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  #1  
Old 01-26-2022, 02:51 PM
1sailor 1sailor is offline
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Default Reloading the 30 Super Carry

I haven't seen any reloading data for the 30SC. It is a pretty high pressure round so I don't even know if any available powders would work well in such a small cartridge. They use a .312 dia. bullet so that's not an issue. Has anyone here heard anything? Just curious.
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Old 01-26-2022, 03:01 PM
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Haha, I’m laughing in that you don’t think any available powders will run high pressure in a small round.

It’s allllllll been done. If you can get your hands on the dies, you will have no struggle.
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Old 01-26-2022, 03:13 PM
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Wonderful. Since you are so familiar with it maybe you could make a few recommendations. Or better yet direct me to the location where you got your information. My understanding from the little info that is available is that the case capacity is quite a bit less than the 9mm luger. I was wondering if that diminished capacity would hinder reloading to factory velocities. If I'm wrong, then so much the better.

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Old 01-26-2022, 04:12 PM
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Your condescension and attitude are duly noted. This is where I should apologize that the included did not convey the casual nature of my comment.

I shall go in deep web search for some published source of internet apology that is lab tested and SAAMI approved. Please hold your breath whilst I do so.
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Old 01-26-2022, 04:18 PM
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Sorry. I don't use emojis so I tend not to notice them.
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Old 01-26-2022, 04:26 PM
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To the subject, a good comparison of what will be happening internally would be the 5.7x28mm, also a very small capacity/very high pressure cartridge. Folks absolutely reload this round and plenty of data is available.

You mentioned something about being hindered to loading to factory velocities… well, factory velocities is probably where you would need to be to be safe, especially when this new round is being marketed in to some of S&W’s cheapest plastic guns.

Unless you are stepping up for the Nighthawk, in which case you probably have room to experiment.

Across the board however, I’m not sure why we would expect to have an array of published and lab tested load data for a cartridge that has been on the market for less than one month.
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Old 01-26-2022, 04:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sevens View Post
Haha, Iím laughing in that you donít think any available powders will run high pressure in a small round.

Itís allllllll been done. If you can get your hands on the dies, you will have no struggle.
It's certainly doable but there is going to be little to no data available. With no data it seems like it would be a struggle to know how to proceed.

Components will be hard to find during normal times much less while everything is out of stock.

I'd start by asking Alliant if they can give out any info. Federal is making the ammo and they are both owned by the same parent company.
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Old 01-26-2022, 08:18 PM
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I have dibs on the CFE pistol and all the BE-86 powder that you can find !!

You can pack a lot more of this in a 9mm case than Unique and I would also
be looking at some HS-6 if it is in the area.

Carry on.

PS;
any clue on which pistol will handle +P+ loads.........
or are they just all, high priced +P pistols ?

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Old 01-26-2022, 10:30 PM
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Performance wise itís what, about 32 H&R, so maybe starting load (or below) for this cartridge may serve as starting point. Full disclosure- Iíve never ventured into such development, where absolutely no published data is available.
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Old 01-26-2022, 11:16 PM
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I am betting it will be powders we already use for 9mm, maybe on the slower end of the spectrum.
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Old 01-26-2022, 11:56 PM
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If you've got any 4756 pigeonholed ...
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Old 01-27-2022, 12:04 AM
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Thanks for the answers. I just got a little curious about reloading it when my son and I were talking about how high ammo prices seemed to be for the round. I certainly wasn't expecting to find any published data for it at all. But I thought I'd ask here to see what info other members might have.
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Old 01-27-2022, 12:12 AM
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Just guessing, but I would be surprised if there weren't some H110/W296 loads published soon.
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Old 01-27-2022, 10:42 AM
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Don't worry ... good old fashioned Unique will step up and do what no other powder can do ... Don't Worry ...Be Happy !
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Old 01-27-2022, 11:20 AM
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I would buy a gun in that caliber just so I can keep it with my 45GAP that is also useless when compared with all the other calibers that operate exactly as well.... :-))))))....

J.
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Old 01-27-2022, 12:36 PM
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I can hear it now.............!!

Penalty........

15 yards for pilling on !
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Old 01-27-2022, 02:01 PM
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Kinda new to have any published data available. I have only read about the new round about a month ago and doubt it there is any data and reloading tools available this soon. I saw some speculation (forum guessing) the cartridge compares to the 30 Carbine. As for canister powders, there are "suitable" powders available for all typical/popular calibers, new and old, produced in the last 120 years, just finding a specific powder available now is a problem...
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Old 03-24-2022, 11:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnnu2 View Post
I would buy a gun in that caliber just so I can keep it with my 45GAP that is also useless when compared with all the other calibers that operate exactly as well.... :-))))))....

J.
If you examine the .45 GAP within its context, and put aside A) .45 ACP chauvanism, and B) contempt for the fact that ammo and components are currently scarce to nonexistent... the .45 GAP is an excellent cartridge. It's actually one of my favorites. Three best Glocks ever made: G37, G19 and G42. All you need. Naturally, on a S&W forum it's not going to be popular amongst the fandom.

The .45 GAP puts .45 ACP ballistics in double stack 9mm frame. That's a noteworthy achievement. The Glock 37 is also very accurate. S&W wouldn't chamber the M&P for it, for marketing reasons. If you shoot a 1911, it's also a worthless cartridge. If you shoot a revolver, you don't even care! :-)
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Old 03-25-2022, 01:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Model 15-4ever View Post
If you examine the .45 GAP within its context, and put aside A) .45 ACP chauvanism, and B) contempt for the fact that ammo and components are currently scarce to nonexistent... the .45 GAP is an excellent cartridge. It's actually one of my favorites. Three best Glocks ever made: G37, G19 and G42. All you need. Naturally, on a S&W forum it's not going to be popular amongst the fandom.

The .45 GAP puts .45 ACP ballistics in double stack 9mm frame. That's a noteworthy achievement. The Glock 37 is also very accurate. S&W wouldn't chamber the M&P for it, for marketing reasons. If you shoot a 1911, it's also a worthless cartridge. If you shoot a revolver, you don't even care! :-)
It is a completely useless addition to an already crowded market , another subdivision of ammunition to be produced during times of shortages to help make them worse, and its greatest accomplishment is to screw over people gullible enough to buy a direct to obsolescence cartridge.

It isn't 45 ACP pride or cult, it isn't a bunch of old men screaming at new ideas. 45 GAP was genuinely a bad idea, bad execution, and in all theory hurts the entire pistol shooting market. 45 GAP shooters will always have trouble finding ammunition, will always pay more for it, and the factory turn overs only hurt overall production and scheduling with another switch over.

Better learn well the reloading secrets of 45 GAP and 30 Super Carry, as well as the 327 Magnums. Because you will probably have little choice but to roll your own as they remain little used and loved cult cartridges.
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Old 03-25-2022, 03:48 AM
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Question

I have a G17 (& a 19) but not really a fanboy. Have a few pistols chambered in 45 acp as well. There certainly are those around who champion caliber and/or manufacturer out here, but...

Please explain how putting 10 rounds of 45 GAP vs. 17 rounds of 9X19 into the same sized frame constitutes a "noteworthy achievement", but at the cost of 40+% less capacity? Is it from a design or engineering standpoint?

Sure, a smaller grip radius than a regular ol' G21SF, but at 23% less capacity?

The serial killer, of course (and as acknowledged?), will always be ammunition availability. In the last 5 years I have found exactly one fired 45 GAP case at the range. Finding new (or once fired?) brass could be a challenge: the ones I saw online were more for 100 "unprocessed, just sorted(?)" range pickups than Starlines's New (but unavailable)...

Somehow I think this may also be the case going forward with this, the newest... But, who knows? There was an image in a thread on the Ammo forum with a hunch of 30 SC product available: the 1st I've ever seen.

Cheers!

P.S. Once saw a truly beautiful Mauser HSc in 9x18 Ultra for sale on this forum: such a really cool pistol, until I started looking for ammo and reloading info! If I have a firearm I want to be able to actually shoot it...

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Old 03-25-2022, 08:27 AM
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9x19 Ultra is very easy to find compared to 9mm Federal! But if you have a need to shoot the weirdest cartridge, go for the Gyro-Jet!

Ivan
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Old 04-25-2022, 11:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duckford View Post
It is a completely useless addition to an already crowded market , another subdivision of ammunition to be produced during times of shortages to help make them worse, and its greatest accomplishment is to screw over people gullible enough to buy a direct to obsolescence cartridge.
Thanks for being first to demonstrate the exact points I made.
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Old 04-25-2022, 11:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STORMINORMAN View Post
Please explain how putting 10 rounds of 45 GAP vs. 17 rounds of 9X19 into the same sized frame constitutes a "noteworthy achievement", but at the cost of 40+% less capacity? Is it from a design or engineering standpoint?

Sure, a smaller grip radius than a regular ol' G21SF, but at 23% less capacity?
You assume a 10/11 round weapon is inadequate. May I suggest more range time, with an emphasis on accuracy? And less Call of Duty and John Wick movies.

The NYSP dropped the Glock 17 for the Glock 37 after a couple of inadequate shooting results with the 9mm cartridge. The .45 GAP was entirely effective in every shooting they had with it. And no trooper ran out of ammo....

You, and many others, sound like ammo company executives, who for ages have wanted to get rid of 90% of the cartridges out there, because it complicates manufacture and supply. When the ammunition cartel that runs that business in the US has trouble supplying ammo in crunch times like now, everybody gets frustrated. How about we limit metallic cartridges to 12 designs, will that make supply of those 12 better? What's your criteria? How about anything more than 100 years old gets dropped? Bye bye .45 ACP.

Whiners gotta whine, and haters gotta hate. I say, viva la difference!
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Old 04-25-2022, 11:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikld View Post
Kinda new to have any published data available. I have only read about the new round about a month ago and doubt it there is any data and reloading tools available this soon. I saw some speculation (forum guessing) the cartridge compares to the 30 Carbine. As for canister powders, there are "suitable" powders available for all typical/popular calibers, new and old, produced in the last 120 years, just finding a specific powder available now is a problem...
My exact sentiments as well!
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Old 04-25-2022, 12:15 PM
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I like to see new things, once in a while something comes along I want. Not sure about this yet, time will tell. Pretty boring if everyone had the same thing.
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Old 04-25-2022, 01:12 PM
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I checked, and Dillon has the 3 set dies. Pricey at $129.00 but available. Components will be at a premium though.
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Old 04-25-2022, 01:23 PM
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I got no ambition to own one. I wish I had come out a few years back. I hade a very nice French 35a pistol in 32 French Long. Had to make brass by turning 32 S&W. The French round was derived from the American military .30 Pederson for 03 conversion. If the 30SC don’t get off the ground the brass will be well recieved by owners of the above.
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Old 04-25-2022, 01:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duckford View Post
It is a completely useless addition to an already crowded market , another subdivision of ammunition to be produced during times of shortages to help make them worse, and its greatest accomplishment is to screw over people gullible enough to buy a direct to obsolescence cartridge.

It isn't 45 ACP pride or cult, it isn't a bunch of old men screaming at new ideas. 45 GAP was genuinely a bad idea, bad execution, and in all theory hurts the entire pistol shooting market. 45 GAP shooters will always have trouble finding ammunition, will always pay more for it, and the factory turn overs only hurt overall production and scheduling with another switch over.

Better learn well the reloading secrets of 45 GAP and 30 Super Carry, as well as the 327 Magnums. Because you will probably have little choice but to roll your own as they remain little used and loved cult cartridges.
This is a little dramatic. Having options never really "hurts" anyone. The idea was decent...many people like big bore guns and many people like 9mm sized guns. This idea went for the intersection of those people.

Marketing departments go for growth and untapped market share. Sometimes they hit a home run, sometimes they strike out. They never know until they try.
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Old 04-25-2022, 01:42 PM
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Lee has 30 Super Carry 4 Die Set(Now Out Of Stock)
Lee 30 Super Carry Pistol 4-Die Set. Includes Carbide Full Length Sizing Die, Bullet Seating Die, Powder Thru Expanding Die, Carbide Factory Crimp Die, Universal Shell Holder, Powder Dipper and Instructions/Load Data.
3 Die Set 30 Super Carry - Lee Precision
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Old 04-25-2022, 01:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Model 15-4ever View Post
You assume a 10/11 round weapon is inadequate. May I suggest more range time, with an emphasis on accuracy? And less Call of Duty and John Wick movies.

The NYSP dropped the Glock 17 for the Glock 37 after a couple of inadequate shooting results with the 9mm cartridge. The .45 GAP was entirely effective in every shooting they had with it. And no trooper ran out of ammo....

You, and many others, sound like ammo company executives, who for ages have wanted to get rid of 90% of the cartridges out there, because it complicates manufacture and supply. When the ammunition cartel that runs that business in the US has trouble supplying ammo in crunch times like now, everybody gets frustrated. How about we limit metallic cartridges to 12 designs, will that make supply of those 12 better? What's your criteria? How about anything more than 100 years old gets dropped? Bye bye .45 ACP.

Whiners gotta whine, and haters gotta hate. I say, viva la difference!
Bye bye 9mm Luger too!
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Old 04-25-2022, 02:10 PM
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I very much like my M&P EZ in .380. I’m interested in getting one of the .30SC’s … should the ammo and component availability situation ever loosen up during my lifetime . I think the CSX would be an even better platform for it, I dunno maybe they are already offering it.
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Old 04-26-2022, 12:13 PM
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Exclamation

My comment regarding "...how putting 10 rounds of 45 GAP vs. 17 of 9x19 into the same sized frame constitutes a "noteworthy achievement", but at the cost of 40+% less capacity" from a design or engineering standpoint remains unanswered.

Where did I indicate a "10/11 round weapon to be inadequate"? I have quite a few with even less capacity that are most definitely adequate. Who is making the assumption? It's very likely (I'll suggest) that I spend a lot more range time (with "an emphasis on accuracy") than the average "whiner" or "hater", or even a GLOCK GAP fanboy, or two...?

As far as the ammo company execs are concerned, I currently reload for every caliber (10 pistol & 5 rifle) firearm I own (except 22 lr & 22 WMR) and three others for friends (9x18mm, 30-06 & 338 Lapua Magnum), so it is doubtful I really have much in common with them nor any furtive desire to "get rid of 90% of the cartridges", either...?

Still waiting to hear more about that "noteworthy achievement"...

Cheers!

P.S. Ah, but I digress from the original thread's theme... What do the appropriate 30 Super Carry bullets for reloading (besides Hornady's XTP?) go for, and where?

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Old 05-08-2022, 06:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STORMINORMAN View Post
My comment regarding "...how putting 10 rounds of 45 GAP vs. 17 of 9x19 into the same sized frame constitutes a "noteworthy achievement", but at the cost of 40+% less capacity" from a design or engineering standpoint remains unanswered.
Yes, it was answered. You just don't agree with it.
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  #34  
Old 05-08-2022, 06:44 PM
mscampbell2734 mscampbell2734 is offline
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What I'm waiting on is to see in writing the specs for the new 6.8X51 round. Suppose to operate at 90k psi, and achieve 3000 fps out of an 11 inch barrel.

Reloading it's bimetal case might or might not be possible. I've never played with reloading steel cases. Of course the head may not expand, meaning you just treat the brass body like any other brass case.
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