Smith & Wesson Forum

Go Back   Smith & Wesson Forum > Ammunition-Gunsmithing > Reloading
o

Notices

Reloading All Reloading Topics Go Here


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 05-11-2009, 10:29 AM
cmort666's Avatar
cmort666 cmort666 is offline
Member
Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers  
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Rocky River, OH, USA
Posts: 9,451
Likes: 1,271
Liked 9,184 Times in 3,621 Posts
Default

I'm considering getting into bullet casting to mitigate the bullet shortage. I may have a pretty good supply of wheel weights available to me.

My problem is that I live in an apartment with no obvious place to work outside. Does anyone have any suggestions, or is casting in an apartment just not something which should be done?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 05-11-2009, 10:54 AM
OFT OFT is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Odessa Texas U.S.A.
Posts: 210
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Default

Cast near an open window where the fumes can be exhausted. A fan in the window blowing out will help.
__________________
OFT/NRA LIFE MEMBER
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 05-11-2009, 12:32 PM
cmort666's Avatar
cmort666 cmort666 is offline
Member
Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers  
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Rocky River, OH, USA
Posts: 9,451
Likes: 1,271
Liked 9,184 Times in 3,621 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by OFT:
Cast near an open window where the fumes can be exhausted. A fan in the window blowing out will help.
I have a living room with a large window in it and a floor fan. Good enough?
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 05-11-2009, 12:51 PM
John R's Avatar
John R John R is offline
Member
Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers  
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Michigan
Posts: 1,216
Likes: 647
Liked 798 Times in 392 Posts
Default

Be very careful in your living room, if you drip or spill any hot lead on the carpet or hardwood floor, or any kind of floor, they'll be toast.
__________________
John
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 05-11-2009, 01:24 PM
cmort666's Avatar
cmort666 cmort666 is offline
Member
Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers  
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Rocky River, OH, USA
Posts: 9,451
Likes: 1,271
Liked 9,184 Times in 3,621 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by John R:
Be very careful in your living room, if you drip or spill any hot lead on the carpet or hardwood floor, or any kind of floor, they'll be toast.
I've got a kitchen type table on which to work. You don't see any ventilation issues?

It's possible that I could make ingots some place else.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 05-11-2009, 01:30 PM
OKFC05 OKFC05 is offline
Member
Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers  
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 8,156
Likes: 3,600
Liked 5,197 Times in 2,171 Posts
Default

Quote:
I have a living room with a large window in it and a floor fan. Good enough?
Well, not being able to see it, this is getting pretty subjective.

Personally, I don't like it. I'd want a fan in the window pulling out, rather than a floor fan spreading it around.
Also not too happy about using a multi-purpose table that somebody might eat from either.

Metallic lead in bullet-sized chunks is quite safe, but the fumes, dust, and smoke can have some nasty water-soluble compounds in them that are readily absorbed if inhaled or eaten.
__________________
Science plus Art
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 05-11-2009, 02:19 PM
Paul5388's Avatar
Paul5388 Paul5388 is offline
US Veteran
Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers  
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Rusk Co. Texas
Posts: 1,318
Likes: 0
Liked 43 Times in 31 Posts
Default

This is my casting area.



As you can see, there isn't a window or anything else close to it. If you're getting "fumes, dust, and smoke", you're not doing something right, like using enough flux as a barrier for that type of stuff.

Here's a picture of the actual casting operation fired up, with the blue light on the hot plate showing everything is on. The melter, hot plate and lamp to the right all come on at the same time.



You'll notice there isn't any smoke or anything else visible. That's the way it should be, especially since the temperature is well below the boiling point of lead.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 05-11-2009, 02:30 PM
cmort666's Avatar
cmort666 cmort666 is offline
Member
Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers  
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Rocky River, OH, USA
Posts: 9,451
Likes: 1,271
Liked 9,184 Times in 3,621 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by OKFC05:
Quote:
I have a living room with a large window in it and a floor fan. Good enough?
Well, not being able to see it, this is getting pretty subjective.

Personally, I don't like it. I'd want a fan in the window pulling out, rather than a floor fan spreading it around.
Also not too happy about using a multi-purpose table that somebody might eat from either.

Metallic lead in bullet-sized chunks is quite safe, but the fumes, dust, and smoke can have some nasty water-soluble compounds in them that are readily absorbed if inhaled or eaten.
That's why I said "kitchen type". It came from a friend's mother's house when he put her in a nursing home in Canada. I use it to clean guns, clean brass, and occasionally build computers. I've never eaten off of it and never will. There's no reason why I couldn't put a fan in the window, blowing out.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 05-11-2009, 03:21 PM
Mr. Tree Mr. Tree is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 51
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times in 3 Posts
Default

I cast in my reloading room in the basement. Since this room has very poor air circulation, I bought a 4" squirrel-cage blowed, put a piece of dryer hose on either end, hang the sucking end over my lead pot, and turn it on. The exhaust end is fastened in a sguare flap vent fit into the glass block window. Works well. Draws just enough air across the pot to keep all fumes going outside. Since making ingots from dirty wheel weights really put out the smoke, I do that outside with a Coleman camp stove and cast iron pot. In your apartment if you have a washer/dryer you might be able to tap into the dryer vent. Good luck.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 05-11-2009, 04:29 PM
canoe on the yukon canoe on the yukon is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 466
Likes: 0
Liked 36 Times in 10 Posts
Default

I've been casting for a long time and started when I was still quite young.Because of the line of work I was in,I had to move fairly often and so I can tell you that I've cast lead and alloys in all sorts of places.I've even cast lead balls for a muzzleloader over a camp fire.

With a little imagination and forethought,you should not have any trouble.Spend a little time reading about the proper way to cast and then apply some common sense.Lots of bullets have been cast in apartments.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 05-11-2009, 08:23 PM
keppelj keppelj is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Washington State
Posts: 122
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

I'd think twice about melting lead in an environment I lived in, or my children lived in. It vaporizes immediately into the air and then you're living in it. Google "lead melting hazards" or some such and look at the data. Consider the health issues plumbers have had with vocational use of lead solder.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 05-11-2009, 09:35 PM
Gatofeo's Avatar
Gatofeo Gatofeo is offline
Member
Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers  
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Remote Utah desert
Posts: 355
Likes: 0
Liked 101 Times in 38 Posts
Default

Lead does not "vaporize" until it reaches a very high temperature, well beyond the typical casting temperature of 700 to 800 F.
The greatest hazard comes from handling lead or items that have touched lead, and getting it on your hands.
Once on your hands, it's easy to introduce it to your mouth or moist membranes in your nose (no joke intended).
Nonetheless, I don't like casting lead indoors. It always seems to leave a little smoke and odor, no matter how clean the ingots appear.
In your case, I'd suggest you buy a propane burner, 5-gallon propane tank, and heavy cast iron pot. NEVER use an aluminum pot to melt lead. The flame will soften the aluminum, then the weight of the lead in it will come crashing through, splattering lead beneath it.
With a solid iron pot, burner and 5-gallon tank you can take your entire operation to the local gravel pit or a remote place away from public view.
Make a full day of it, or camp for the weekend, and churn out all the bullets you need.
Allow at least two hours for the pot and stove to cool before you pack it back in the car. Three hours is preferable.
Be aware of fire regulations too.
Years ago, in Idaho, I'd take just such an arrangement into the woods and set up beside an old campfire ring. I could cast all day, start a fire in the ring when evening fell, and roll out my sleeping bag for the night.
The next morning, all my casting equipment was cold and I had coffee cans of bullets to take home.
I had no concerns about ventilation and it was a nice outing for the weekend.
All my dross followed me back in a coffee can, for proper disposal.
Don't leave anything behind to indicate what you've been doing. Some Rangers may not look kindly on it and accuse you of polluting Mother Earth!
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 05-11-2009, 10:34 PM
Paul5388's Avatar
Paul5388 Paul5388 is offline
US Veteran
Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers  
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Rusk Co. Texas
Posts: 1,318
Likes: 0
Liked 43 Times in 31 Posts
Default

Most people are completely unaware of the MSDS for anode lead (approximately the same composition as wheel weights). The LD50 for Sn (tin) is less than the LD50 for Pb (lead). That means there's a greater risk (which is still very low) from tin than there is from lead.

Plumbers are at greater risk from lead free soldier than they are from normal soldier.

Sb (antimony) is even lower than the other two and thus presents even greater risk.

Quote:
SECTION II: Composition and Information on Ingredients
Name CAS # % by Weight Exposure Limit LD50 oral, rat
Lead (Pb) 7439-92-1 88 - 98 0.05 mg/m3 790 mg/kg
Antimony (Sb) 7440-36-0 1.00 – 7.00 0.50 mg/m3 15 mg/kg (man)
Tin (Sn) 7440-31-5 1.00 – 5.00 2.00 mg/m3 72 mg/kg (mouse)
mg/kg is equivalent to ppm.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 05-11-2009, 11:06 PM
pps pps is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Near Fresno, Peoples Repu
Posts: 309
Likes: 7
Liked 34 Times in 19 Posts
Default

For all those LD50's you listed, that would take a HUGE exposure. Kids under 6 years old, who's nervous systems are still developing, I'd not take ANY chances with. I do my casting outside when the weather is good, in my garage when the weather is bad.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 05-11-2009, 11:16 PM
MrPhil MrPhil is offline
Member
Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers  
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Oregon, the less dry side
Posts: 188
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Default

Just a reminder of what LD50 means. It is the dose needed to KILL 50% of the tested population.

Also, check the partial pressure of lead at casting temperatures. It is a little greater than 0. Some of the liquid lead does vaporize. Not a lot, but some.

Just saying.
__________________
It's around here somewhere!
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 05-11-2009, 11:32 PM
Paul5388's Avatar
Paul5388 Paul5388 is offline
US Veteran
Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers  
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Rusk Co. Texas
Posts: 1,318
Likes: 0
Liked 43 Times in 31 Posts
Default

A proper barrier being used as a flux would eliminate the vapor problem. I use cellulose (commonly known as sawdust) that is reduced to carbon.

Lead is basically inert in its elemental form, which is what is being used in the alloys for casting. It isn't attacked by hydrochloric acid (stomach acid) and passes through the system intact, even if you eat it.

The usual cause of lead poisoning for children is from eating lead oxides in paints and primers.

The common wormer used on livestock for many years was lead arsenate. The livestock and/or milk was later consumed by the general public without a noted problem.

My baby girl is 35 years old. I cast where I want to.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 05-12-2009, 05:44 AM
n4zov's Avatar
n4zov n4zov is offline
US Veteran
Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers  
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: S.E. USA
Posts: 1,942
Likes: 0
Liked 63 Times in 37 Posts
Default

Overall I am not a fan of casting indoors mainly because I always imagine bad stuff happening to 20 pounds of lead at 700+ degrees! If you have children in your home, I would be really hesitant to do it.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 05-12-2009, 11:31 AM
240grJHP 240grJHP is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

Do you have a shooting friend that has a better location?. Maybe you can cast at their place and reload at yours. Sometimes these tasks are easier if two people are working together. More than that tend to be a distraction.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 05-12-2009, 03:55 PM
canoe on the yukon canoe on the yukon is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 466
Likes: 0
Liked 36 Times in 10 Posts
Default

According to some of these warnings,I should've been dead from lead poisoning many years ago.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 05-12-2009, 04:14 PM
Skip Sackett Skip Sackett is offline
Banned
Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers  
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Hoosier Land!
Posts: 4,379
Likes: 587
Liked 576 Times in 307 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by canoe on the yukon:
According to some of these warnings,I should've been dead from lead poisoning many years ago.
I don't know canoe, maybe you are. I've read some of your other posts!

(Just kidding! Laugh!)

I guess I have to ask the OP this: "Why can't you move?" Rent a house or buy a mobile home on a large lot or something?

I would do just that if I wanted to pursue my hobby.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 05-12-2009, 05:31 PM
Paul5388's Avatar
Paul5388 Paul5388 is offline
US Veteran
Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers Bullet Casting for Apartment Dwellers  
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Rusk Co. Texas
Posts: 1,318
Likes: 0
Liked 43 Times in 31 Posts
Default

I will be at the Depot Museum in Henderson, Texas tomorrow entertaining some of the local school children with bullet casting!

I'll probably wear a short sleeved shirt and no gloves, except when I use the all metal .32 caliber mould that doesn't have a sprue cutter. Mel Gibson can handle that sort of mould over an open camp fire, but I'm kind of a weenie when it comes to getting hot real fast!



I'll carry the extra ingots of alloy in my bare hands and hopefully I'll make it to my 65th birthday in a couple of months.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Would like some advice on bullet casting. sarge1967 Reloading 12 02-03-2013 11:54 AM
bullet casting for a 40? Daddyschatz Reloading 10 05-21-2011 02:49 PM
WTB - Bullet Casting Equipment kend WANTED to Buy 0 12-01-2010 12:13 PM
bullet casting Mr.parker Reloading 15 08-03-2010 11:41 AM
.38 Special ammuntion for apartment dwellers? Andy Griffith Ammo 12 10-16-2009 04:20 AM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
smith-wessonforum.com tested by Norton Internet Security smith-wessonforum.com tested by McAfee Internet Security

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:33 PM.


Smith-WessonForum.com is not affiliated with Smith & Wesson Holding Corporation (NASDAQ Global Select: SWHC)