Doing my research and for a 44 Special, 200gr cast lead flat nose, using W-231/HP38

Lee Modern lists: 4.5 to 5.6 (same as Hodgdon)

Speer #14 lists 6.0 to 6.8 (cowboy action)

and the

Hodgdon web site lists 4.5 to 5.6

Why is the Speer info higher?
I thought Cowboy action was a lighter load?? Or is this for steel plates or something?

__________________
Still Running Against the Wind

You usually shoot steel with the lightest load you can. That Speer data looks suspiciously high.

Buck

Seems high to me also but it is the current edition. They speak specifically about Cowboy Action Loads and to not load below the start number to avoid "inconsistent performance and stuck bullets"
It is for their 200gr bullet mold 82307, 44-200 CM or FN.

I do not load 44 Spec often but my last ones I used 5 grs HP-38 and they seemed fine to me. 4" 629.
Now that I have a chrono I might just clock these. It is so damn hot and humid I really do not want to "exert myself" setting up the tripod. Pretty sad but true. Kinda a modified drive "in" shooting at the range and get out.

__________________
Still Running Against the Wind

For my money, I'd go with the Speer #14 data. My Hodgdon manual (6th Ed.) is notoriously "optimistic" about velocities, while the Speer manual often comes very close to the actual speeds I get in my guns. I used QuickLOAD to check the Speer data, and the results from its computations are very, very close to the published Speer data. Incidentally, the Hornady 4.5gr starting load computes to only about 740 fps, and 7500 psi. I would be very concerned about occasionally sticking a bullet in the barrel at 7500 psi, but to each his own.

Also, the Lee manual just reprints other companies' data (without attribution). Their data is identical with the Hodgdon data because it IS Hodgdon's data...

Perhaps look at the primers used in the load manuals. Does the Hodgen use WLP ? This may be similiar to using a magnum primer with a fast burning powder? Then look at the rest of Hodgen's 44 special loads using hp-38. Notice anything unususal?


Currently my favorite 44 special load uses a 200 lrnfp over 6.2-6.4 grains hp-38 with a Fed 150 primer. This gets close to 800 fps from 3 inch 696. Tried Rem and CCI large pistol primers and had to noticably reduce the powder charge to get similiar velocity. Posted the results awhile back. HP-38 can be picky about slight variations in charge weight for best accuracy.

Well, I went to the range today and it was miserable 90 degrees and the same humidity, not a breath of air)

I messed around with my new chrono. I am thinking you (and Speer are correct)

With 5 grs of HP38 and 200 grcast LFN the numbers were pretty bad.
Two strings of 10 shots avg vel of 638 and 607, extreme spread of 121 and 141. SD of 46
High of around 685 and low of 545 between the two strings.

Think I will bump it up to 6.0 grains, the Speer start load.

__________________
Still Running Against the Wind

Thanks for the report, OCD1. You did exactly what I would do when faced with such a large discrepancy in suggested loads... chronograph the lowest published start load and then proceed from there based on the newly-acquired knowledge.

Thanks. I have lived here for loooong time. Do not remember it being this hot and nasty.
I will load some more and if I can stand it, will go test some more.

Know anywhere I can get a used NASA portable A/C suit?
The Space center is on the other coast from me. Maybe they have closeouts on sale.

__________________
Still Running Against the Wind

The W-W 14th Edition Reloading Manual lists a maximum load of 5.4 gr. W-231 for a 246 gr. lead bullet at 796 fps and 12,500 cup.
Personally I prefer Trail Boss for light loads with lead bullets. Hodgdon has some excellent data on their website.

I'm shooting a 200 gr cast bullet with a load of 5.0grs HP-38/w 231
As I posted above the numbers are real poor and I do not think the Hodgdon data is correct on this particular load. Normally I follow their info almost to the grain. I have contacted Speer and they stand by their data, which is a bit higher.

__________________
Still Running Against the Wind

Well I loaded some more 44 special rounds using 6.0 grs of HP-38 based on the Speer manual, with the same 200 gr cast LFN. CCI LPP. 629, 4" barrel.

The numbers are much better with a average of 736 fps, ES of 50 and SD of 18.4. This is still lower than the Speer data claiming 904 fps using a 5.5" barrel which I guess makes some of the difference.

Easy shooting and accurate. Maybe bump it up to 6.5 next time

So the question still remains, were did Hodgdon get it's results?. Is mentioned, I usually follow their data to the grain. Guess I need to call them.

__________________
Still Running Against the Wind

OCD,
Hodgdon has to use "worst case scenarios" to develop their data as they are the ones responsible should you follow their loads and blow up your gun.

Here is what I mean: Largest hardest bullet with the smallest bore, shortest OAL for the caliber. Their test barrels aren't your revolver, basically.

All of those thing play a role in actual velocity achieved. One thing I am not sure about is what the twist rate of the barrel is. If there isn't any or it is real slow that could add velocity. Your handgun may have a tighter spin than theirs. Not sure though.

I have had problems with the Hodgdon data for SR4756 as well. We have talked about it over and over. You are finding the same thing with HP-38/W231 and are doing just what I did with the Speer #8.

Let me see, you said I was in a territory you wouldn't go to. And NOW?

What territory are you in? NW?

Are you referring to the "Light Load for 642 thread" (Took me a while to remember/find it. To many lost brain cells
light load for s&w 642

Any how, maybe when I am at this as long as you have been, I might be able to attempt some of the loads you use. I do not feel I have enough experience to attempt that yet. But I still do not think 6.0grs
of HP-38 in a 44 special is anywhere near 8-11 grs of 2400 with a 158gr in a 38 special, out of a 642. Just call be a wimp (again)

Now if you were my neighbor I would be glad to try some of your loads with your guns.

I am driving up to Kentucky next week, maybe I can convince my wife to make a detour so we can go shooting? (sure, she would go for that)

Cheers

__________________
Still Running Against the Wind