scarce snubnose ?

reinhard · #1 10-19-2010, 11:13 PM

I have a question ,today I held a vintage snubnose in my hands,it was a 2inch smith&wesson topbreak in caliber 38s&w
,original wooden grips , the gun is nickelplated and is in 99% condition,the gun is a fifth model no barrel adress only "SMITH&WESSON" on side off barrel, they told me this is a scarce gun , but how scarce exactly?

alaskavett · #2 10-20-2010, 01:17 AM

Reinhard, there were 2 distinctly different early top break revolvers with Fifth model attached to their name. One had a hammer and the later did not.There were only some 15000 produced with no break down as to barrel length.These were made from 1909 to 1911 or so The second is of the Lemon Squeezer variety with a grip safety and no hammer.This was made in a 2 barrel, there were some 50000 total produced in this series but I have no idea how many were in 2" but it is shown in the book. Hope that helps. Kyle

murphydog · #3 10-20-2010, 06:32 AM

From your description, if it has no external hammer this could be a "Bicycle Gun", so named for its intended use for carry by bicyclists for defense. However, many of the common longer barreled (3 1/4 - 6") guns were cut to the shorter length, and are not worth as much as a factory original 2", as would a refinished gun compared to a 99% original one. Photos would be helpful, especially of the barrel markings and front sight.

reinhard · #4 10-20-2010, 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by murphydog

From your description, if it has no external hammer this could be a "Bicycle Gun", so named for its intended use for carry by bicyclists for defense. However, many of the common longer barreled (3 1/4 - 6") guns were cut to the shorter length, and are not worth as much as a factory original 2", as would a refinished gun compared to a 99% original one. Photos would be helpful, especially of the barrel markings and front sight.

thank you ,it is a bicycle gun , the barrel was original and the gun was not refinished,another buyer offered more than me and the gun was sold for XXXX$,

Göring's S&W · #5 10-20-2010, 08:14 AM

I don't know that I ever saw a 38 DA or SH with original wood grips. Since rubber / bakelite came first, I thought they all had rubber or special order.

There are other bicycle guns around, just watch out for fakes.

reinhard · #6 10-20-2010, 10:20 AM

a picture of the gun

reinhard · #7 10-20-2010, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alaskavett

Reinhard, there were 2 distinctly different early top break revolvers with Fifth model attached to their name. One had a hammer and the later did not.There were only some 15000 produced with no break down as to barrel length.These were made from 1909 to 1911 or so The second is of the Lemon Squeezer variety with a grip safety and no hammer.This was made in a 2 barrel, there were some 50000 total produced in this series but I have no idea how many were in 2" but it is shown in the book. Hope that helps. Kyle

Kyle;Alan thanks for the info ,

deadin · #8 10-20-2010, 10:48 AM

Reinhard,
Are those screwheads blued or is it just a trick of the lighting??

murphydog · #9 10-20-2010, 10:51 AM

It has the appearance of an original 2" and finish. I agree the walnut stocks are uncommon but they look original also. Keep searching, there's another one out there with your name on it

.

reinhard · #10 10-20-2010, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deadin

Reinhard,
Are those screwheads blued or is it just a trick of the lighting??

Hi dean,the screwheads are not blued ,pictures are not mine ,
and are not that clear

I hope another will come along soon, too bad because I realy wanted this one

SDH · #11 10-20-2010, 04:37 PM

The "tell" of original barrel length, at least with the .32, is the address and patent info on the right side of the barrel rather than on the top rib. Presumably there because there wasn't room on top. The top rib is bare. I'm not sure about the .38's as I've never run across one.
While not in the 'best' condition, I've had this one for about 20 years and it remains one of my favs!

I would love to have any 'Squeezer' with walnut grips!

cflier · #12 10-20-2010, 05:17 PM

Reinhard,

Some very late 5th model Safety Hammerless guns were shipped with wood grips. Everyone that I have seen though were non medallion grips. I know that you could special order medallion grips at the time though. I consider the 2 inch 38 and 6 inch 32 Safety to be scarce guns, as opposed to 2 inch 32 and 6 inch 38 Safetys which I see as only somewhat scarce. The data bases that I have access to bear this out also.

Mark

twaits · #13 10-20-2010, 10:32 PM

Top breaks look so good with these walnut grips. You don't see them very often

opoefc · #14 10-20-2010, 11:55 PM

A couple of comments: I've had a number of 5th model Safetys, shipped after WW2 in blue two piece metal cornered boxes that had the walnut stocks, but none had medallion stocks, they were all no medallion checkered walnut, so I'm suspious about the medalion stocks on the pictured gun above. Might be correct, but I doubt it. - - - The first 2 inch .32 Bicycle gun by S&W was a special order first model shipped in Dec. 1893, blue, hard rubber stocks, serial number 53232. Patent dates, etc., stamped on top of the barrel rib and frame, until they ran out of room for the full stamp as stamped on the 3 1/4 inch barrels. This gun was in Mark Connot's great display at the Tucson meeting last July. Ed.

reinhard · #15 10-21-2010, 10:44 AM

the wooden grips where original to the gun , can't say anything about the medalion tough,there was also a 32 hamerles with 6 inch barrel in blue for sale , condition was superb but again I failed to purchase that one

anyway I consider myself lucky there was still one 32 hamerles for sale that I took home with me

this will be the last one for a long time,since the moneywell is dried out now