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S&W Antiques S&W Lever Action Pistols, Tip-Up Revolvers, ALL Top-Break Revolvers, and ALL Single Shots


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Old 02-09-2013, 06:55 AM
cotton42 cotton42 is offline
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Disclosure: I'm not proposing selling anything in this particular forum; only seeking advice from antique S&W enthusiasts on the "How" given my circumstance. So, my apologies in advance for those who might feel this post in the wrong forum.

I have 30 or so antique S&W pistols from my late father's collection which he put together in the late 60's and early 70's. The majority are small frame pieces of varying quality. However, I do have some very nice cased pieces and some top quality large frame top breaks. I also have some old ammunition and other odds and ends.

Based on some good advice about who to stay away from and who is reputable in the arena of professional dealers and auction houses; I have contacted one auction house and a dealer (both well respected) and haven't gotten any serious response likely due to the majority of the collection being somewhat unremarkable (yet all of the pieces are generally quality and desirable) and perhaps in part due to my insistence for a simple written agreement for the consignment terms.

Let's presume that the only auction house and dealer that were reccomended to me aren't options (and that I would not consider any others); it appears I'm left with either: a) getting on the antique gun show circuit myself, b) advertising in classifieds, or ) the online options like Gun Broker or the like.

I have worked with several folks that I trust and I am mostly certain I have good data on vales and that I know what I have.

Given the above, I'd appreciate advice and feed back from prior experience from others about the antique gun show circuit and/or the classified ad/online route.
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Old 02-09-2013, 07:06 AM
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Well, until someone pipes in - as a personal S&W Collector - I would love to see what you have posted on GUNS - For Sale or Trade!
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Old 02-09-2013, 07:33 AM
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The pesonal sale route of gun show & classifieds is fraught with pitfalls. On-line auction eliminates some pitfalls but involves iis own issues of shipping and handling as well as accurately describing & dealing with aftersale claims and/or dissatisfactions. All these carry legal and licensing issues.

That leaves sale to a major gun dealer or sale thru an auction house, either/both eliminate most of the individual issues, or at worst reduce most of them to a minimum. A variation on the same theme would be to have an established gun shop sell them on consignment. Their services may yield you less at the bottom line but it may be worth it in terms of peace of mind and simplicity. .

As an after-thought, it would cost little and would at least provide some useful info to list them all in this forum seeking an offer for the entire collection.

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Old 02-09-2013, 09:32 AM
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National exposure of what you have may result in higher sale prices. The gun store consignment exposure is dependent on who walks through the door. There are companies who deal in the type of items you have, and the first step is identifying who they are and best fits your needs. Good luck.
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Old 02-09-2013, 09:48 AM
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One key question is how knowledgable and comfortable are you in pricing the pieces. If you keep up with the market and can accurately grade the guns, sell them. If not, an auction is the way to determine value. If you sell individually, this site is the best place to move reasonably priced items. You can offer the collection here for a set price or best offer, but if you say best offer, be prepared to accept it.

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Old 02-09-2013, 09:53 AM
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I'm not into antiques yet, but if you don't really need the $ I would hang on to it. Especially since they were your fathers.

If you want to sell, I would recommend to list them on this board here first. If they don't sell here I would go via GunBroker.

You can put them in a shop on consignment yes, but that might take a long time to sell them. Also it's just locally. Therefore, like already said by others the only route would be to go national. Good luck.
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Old 02-09-2013, 10:06 AM
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You will get a fair value here on thie Forum. You will get much less selling at gun stores, etc. You can also get fair value with online auctions, but if you place reserve bids, you will often not sell the item for a long time. You will also have to come up with detailed accurate descriptions and lots of good photos to get the best prices. Many buyers are leary of buying from someone with little or no sales history. I very rarely buy a consignment item since the prices are almost always too high. First, you have to set your price and the congisner will add their seller premium, reducing the chances for a sale.

The bigger auction houses will offer you the highest gross value, but you will pay 10% to 20% seller commission to get your items sold.

Again, the easiest place to list is here, since there are no costs and lots of collectors, so if your prices are reasonable, you will do fine. If you ae looking for the highest dollar, go online and take your chances getting the items sold.
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Old 02-09-2013, 10:59 AM
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I would sell them yourself.
I gave a large quantity of S&W .38 Single Shots to a major Smith & Wesson dealer to sell after a trade we had fell through. After agreeing on prices he showed them at one or two shows. Suddenly they were in an auction catalog without my consent. Bottom line, I got less than 1/3 of what I paid for them. A gunshop, if your luckly, will give you about 1/2 of what a piece is worth. An auction house will sell an item for whatever they can get. Unless you have a reserve on a gun, auctions don't like to not sell. Plus depending on which one you go to, they will get at least 30%. If your not in need of money, take your time. You can always trade some of them for what you collect.
Just my opinion, I'm sure someone else will have better advice.
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Old 02-09-2013, 12:01 PM
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Yes post 3. Having purchased many firearms for a brick and mortar store. Some with collector value I can tell you that the dealer offer will be quite low. I, we never offered more than half of what we thought we could get for ...? The only exception for a higher offer is if I know I can sell it quick. No dealer wants to sit on inventory for years. In this economic climate the money is to valuable to have tied up on items that may sit until that one guy comes in and needs that one gun....unless you get it cheep. A private or Gun Broker type of sale will most likely get you the most. Good luck.
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Old 02-09-2013, 02:55 PM
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I would say that getting on the antique gun show circuit would be a nightmare unless you have oodles of time on your hand and like to spend lots of money for travel, rooms and meals. I mean, sure, you might find a guy at the first show who buys everything you have--but more likely you'll still have half your guns after going to ten shows.

If by classified ads, you mean advertising in your locality, that has its own pitfalls. Do you tell responders your location and have them come by your house? Meet them somewhere? In a very real sense, such ads basically say "I have guns. I live here. Come steal them". Plus you will undoubtedly encounter the deadheads who 1: are lonely and just want to talk, or 2: the cretins who want to trade you their outboard motor that used to run, or some such, for your gun/guns, or 3: the obnoxious jerks who bad-mouth your gun/guns in hopes of getting the price lowered.

Auction house sales were well covered by the responders above.

Selfishly, I too would like to see the guns listed here on the Forum for sale, as I love the little 32/38 Top-Breaks and would like to add to my small gathering. But I couldn't afford to buy all your guns and undoubtedly you would like to sell either as a whole or failing that, in blocks. You could try a listing here of the whole collection or blocks thereof and see what the response is. Listing on "Gunbroker" would be my second choice, personally, but there you would almost certainly have to list the guns individually and Gunbroker fees would cut into your takings. Others above have listed the other on-line auction problems of dissatisfied buyers/returns and etc.

Good luck with whatever you decide. Ralph Boineau in central South Carolina
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Old 02-09-2013, 03:35 PM
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All the S&W's you could sell through this Forum at a "reasonable" retail price, plus shipping, and you would do probably better than anywhere else. It may take some time, depending on what items you have for sale, and the conditions. If you go with a National lever auction house, and there are some reliable ones, you will pay 15%+ in commissions to the seller. If you list here for a reasonable selling price, you keep all the sale price, and the buyer expects to pay reasonable shipping in addition to the sale price. Since I may soon be in this same situation, I will be watching to see what you decide.
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Old 02-09-2013, 05:17 PM
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I think everything has been covered previously. No matter what you do, at least get a good idea of the worth of what you have before doing anything. A good way to do that is by checking the prices of similar items actually realized at the various gun auction sites, and maybe what some of the on-line dealers are asking, plus prices shown in the Blue Book and Standard Catalog. The absolute worst way is to sell them to a gun shop (they will offer a pittance), and the firearms auction houses normally charge a stiff seller's commission. After you get a reasonable idea of market value, then you can do what seems best for you - either list them here, or on one of the online auction sites. If you use the latter, do not list them at an out-of-sight starting bid. Keep it on the low side and let the bidders tell you what the price should be.
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Old 02-11-2013, 06:27 PM
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If you decide to list on the Forum, might you be willing to give us who replied to your post a "heads-up"?
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Old 02-11-2013, 07:03 PM
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At some point in time, we (or our widows/widowers) will be faced with a similar situation so your post should be of interest to us all. Personally, I don't think your task is too daunting. You've obviously done a lot of the leg work. I'd prioritize the pieces by their relative value and desireability and work from the top down. Trying to do it all at once would, for me, be monumental. Better check but I believe as long as a particular piece falls in the realm of C&R, you should be able to ship to a C&R licensed individual.
You'll need a good digital camera for close-up pics and nice, detailed descriptions. If you know current values, then by all means post them here and/or other reputable similar forums and let nature take its course. You'll be amazed at how quickly you whittle down the list. Just be sure to CYA and state if you'll give a certain number of days inspection or that all sales are final, how you'll accept payment, etc. Oh, yes! Always require that the buyer pay for shipping and that shipments be insured. Best of Luck!
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Old 02-12-2013, 01:36 AM
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Great responses and I appreciate them all! Most of my concerns were covered in several posts. But let me pose some more questions:

1) I view what I have as an investment and I'm not ever going to be bitten by the collecting bug. But I don't neccessarily have to or need to convert the collection to cash right now. However, I have been told that black powder S&Ws are generally losing favor in collector circles to the more modern S&Ws and thus black powder values (as a general rule aren't holding up) Is that true?
2) I don't mind putting effort into photographing and trying my best to describe and posting up on the forum. However, I dread figuring out the payment process. Honestly, I'd prefer and in-person cash transaction but I know that probably is not realistic. Could someone PM me a run down for what's acceptable/customary in the realm of selling on the forum and reasonably safe from the standpoint of procedures and payment method?
3) 95% of the collection is pre-1896 but I know there are probably still regs that cover transfer even for black powder. I will get online (I guess BATF's site) and figure out what I need to do about transfer, shipping etc. However, if someone has a link to share that saves me some time...please share!

I will clean up a list I have and figure out getting better photos online in a photosharing site and circle back shortly.
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Old 02-12-2013, 01:44 AM
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Also, would like to hear some thoughts about SWCA sanctioned shows and/or the quality shows that cater to antiques. I might be willing to try one or two shows to see what moves. It would give me some piece of mind about desiring a final all cash face to face sale.
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Old 02-12-2013, 02:10 AM
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First of all I am sorry for the loss of your Father. Been there. Second, having said that you do not need to get rid of the collection for the money, I would say this site would be your best bet. I believe you would be treated fairly and people here would do their best to make it as easy for you as possible. That being said,no matter how you decide to proceed I would carefully look through the whole collection and see if there is one of those guns that really reminds you of your Dad. Maybe one he favored or took a special interest in.Consider keeping that one as a keepsake. I know that I wish I had. That is my .02.
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Old 02-12-2013, 08:59 AM
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The guns made prior to 1898 are not regulated by BATF and can be sold and shipped (properly packaged and insured) as any other antique, including the use of USPS. State laws, however, may vary. The minimum I would want before shipping is a copy of a photo ID with proof of age (over 21). Payment by money order or bank check is good, hold personal checks to clear before shipping (I don't hold personal checks of regular Forum members). Good Luck.

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Old 02-12-2013, 09:35 AM
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Honestly, there is some great members on this forum who are experts in the value of SW firearms. They would be willing to help you price them out if you need to, but if it was me I would post them here to the fans/collectors of SW before putting them on auction site.

That being said I would be happy to help you post the pictures and ad. If you want to send me details of what you have and I will arrange a classified ad, then I can walk you through the payment procedure.

Like you said you don't need the money right now, and I am not asking for anything in return just karma if you need the help.
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Old 02-12-2013, 09:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 78shovel View Post
First of all I am sorry for the loss of your Father. Been there. Second, having said that you do not need to get rid of the collection for the money, I would say this site would be your best bet. I believe you would be treated fairly and people here would do their best to make it as easy for you as possible. That being said,no matter how you decide to proceed I would carefully look through the whole collection and see if there is one of those guns that really reminds you of your Dad. Maybe one he favored or took a special interest in.Consider keeping that one as a keepsake. I know that I wish I had. That is my .02.
Oh I'm keeping a bunch of things, like his .22 Model 61a winchester he bought as a 10 year old by saving his pennies (imagine both of those concepts today!). What I'm mulling over are the antiques have been in the bank vault for 40 years ;-)
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Old 02-12-2013, 10:17 AM
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For those that have been in the bank vault for 40 years, please inspect them and oil as necessary. Guns do rust in bank vaults, and every spec of rust lowers the value.
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Old 02-12-2013, 05:46 PM
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Depending on where you are, Cotton42, there is probably one or more knowledgeable Forum members in your area who you might meet in person who could help with valuation/advice, whatever. Your mention of attending a SWCA or related show seems like a very good idea, assuming they aren't 2000 miles away from you. Good luck
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Old 02-12-2013, 06:32 PM
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Another recommendation to try the For Sale section right here.

Try it with one gun just to see how it works. Pick an antique, to make it a direct sale. If it sells very quickly, you might want to bump up the price ont he next one a litttle. If it does not sell, you can always reduce the price.

Describe the gun as accurately as possible and include several pictures. If you do not know something about the gun, do not guess or assume anything. Better to tell someone "I don't know" then to have them receive it and tell you it was not as described.

Postal Money Orders or Certified Checks are the best forms of payment. Wait till they are cashed before shipping the gun.

The buyer usually has a 3 day inspection period and can return if the item is not as described. Sooner or later you will probably someone who is not happy with the gun they receive. They may have a legitimate issue or they may be someone who is a nitpicker or suffering from buyer's remorse. You can tell the latter type because they usually want you to reimburse some cash back. The best thing to do is to tell them to return the gun for a full refund. Half the time they keep the gun anyway.
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Old 02-13-2013, 07:55 AM
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Quote:
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All the S&W's you could sell through this Forum at a "reasonable" retail price, plus shipping, and you would do probably better than anywhere else. It may take some time, depending on what items you have for sale, and the conditions. If you go with a National lever auction house, and there are some reliable ones, you will pay 15%+ in commissions to the seller. If you list here for a reasonable selling price, you keep all the sale price, and the buyer expects to pay reasonable shipping in addition to the sale price. Since I may soon be in this same situation, I will be watching to see what you decide.
I certainly agree with this. This forum provides an instant international audience of people who WANT your guns. I have been buying and selling guns as a hobby interest for decades and have MADE money selling to a store 3 times in nearly 50 years. I think you have a far better chance of selling even your less interesting pieces here, and with less stress and for a better price...AND to people who will really appreciate them.

Good luck, whatever your choice.

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Old 02-13-2013, 10:24 PM
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Thanks again to all. I have a bit more research to do and will get a direction shortly. I'm certain some of the collection could be on the for sale forum shortly.
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Old 10-18-2020, 07:34 AM
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Since this topic has been addressed in a few threads recently, I located this under "Similar Threads". It is worth resurrecting, although from 2013, as it might prove useful to those with recent similar inquiries.
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Old 10-18-2020, 09:03 AM
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Obviously I agree with the suggestions that the forum here is your best audience. Try us first!

Failing that, I'd say bite the bullet and set yourself up to do it on Gunbroker. You have the advantage of wide audience and auction format to maximize return and somewhat alleviate the need for accurate pricing.

The only real problem is shipping. I'd suggest finding a local FFL who will work with you. Giving him a small cut will save you a lot on shipping, and insulates you from legal hassle.
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Old 10-20-2020, 09:09 AM
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ATTENTION ALL: THIS THREAD IS 7 YEARS OLD. CHANCES ARE THAT THESE GUNS ARE ALL SOLD BY NOW AND MANY WERE LISTED ON THE FOR SALE FORUM IN 2015. THE OP LAST POSTED THAT YEAR AND HASN'T POSTED SINCE. JUST AN FYI.
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Old 11-08-2020, 10:53 PM
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After reading the OP's post and his desire to sell his Father's collection, I am not surprised to hear he has not been back for awhile. Must not have cared much for guns at all if he disposed of his Father's collection. Not matter how much money I needed or wanted, no way would that course of action be my choice.
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Old 11-08-2020, 11:54 PM
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VictorLouis VictorLouis is offline
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I think you're being a bit harsh on the O/P. Perhaps guns were not his thing.
In any case, they were his to do with as he pleased. Perhaps he pleased several of our very own members in acquiring some of the pieces. Just sayin'....
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Old 11-09-2020, 03:57 AM
rct269 rct269 is offline
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Red face 7 YEARS OLD???!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by JSR III View Post
ATTENTION ALL: THIS THREAD IS 7 YEARS OLD. CHANCES ARE THAT THESE GUNS ARE ALL SOLD BY NOW AND MANY WERE LISTED ON THE FOR SALE FORUM IN 2015. THE OP LAST POSTED THAT YEAR AND HASN'T POSTED SINCE. JUST AN FYI.
One of these days, and the sooner the better, I may, if I work at it, come up with enough sense to have a look at the date data some time before post #28 where some kind soul has taken pity on dummies like me.

GGGGGGGGGGGGGAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!!!

Ralph Tremaine
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  #32  
Old 11-09-2020, 06:54 AM
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StrawHat StrawHat is offline
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Originally Posted by Oldbird13 View Post
After reading the OP's post and his desire to sell his Father's collection, I am not surprised to hear he has not been back for awhile. Must not have cared much for guns at all if he disposed of his Father's collection. Not matter how much money I needed or wanted, no way would that course of action be my choice.
My fFather and both of my brothers shared an interest in firearms. Pop had a few and when he passed, they were distributed among us. I like S&W revolvers so I got a 32-20, a 20 gauge, a 12 gauge and some others. I kept the S&W and sold the others. Why should I keep something that is not along the lines of what I collect? Just because it was Pop’s? He was well known and liked locally but not enough to demand a premium for his guns. He also liked TR3s and there were a bunch of those parts.

Fortunately, others liked the things we had no use for so they have been passed along to those who can put them to use.

Keeping everything just for sentimental reasons does not make sense to me.

Kevin
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Old 11-09-2020, 10:57 AM
Johnnu2 Johnnu2 is offline
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I've observed some folks who were very concerned about being 'cheated' or, 'getting the true value' out of things they wanted to sell. The result: they never sold anything. Whenever I've sold anything, whether it be houses or garden hoses, I priced my items to sell and kept reducing the price until the sale was made....period. Most people can't or won't do this. If you are like most, I would suggest that you put them on consignment with a reputable national (gun) auction house, pay the price and get them off your mind and out of your hands... DONE. No more worrying about "am I getting cheated/do I need to do more reseach".... You will know what the market actually paid for your valued items; and whatever you get after commissions is the price you pay for a service that takes a burden off your mind.
IMHO of course,
J.
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Old 11-09-2020, 12:46 PM
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JH1951 JH1951 is offline
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Originally Posted by rct269 View Post
One of these days, and the sooner the better, I may, if I work at it, come up with enough sense to have a look at the date data some time before post #28 where some kind soul has taken pity on dummies like me.

GGGGGGGGGGGGGAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!!!

Ralph Tremaine
If you are successful at this, please let me know your method. I suffer from the same issue, and have fallen for this enough times to know better (today included).
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