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Old 06-11-2013, 05:12 PM
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Default A bit tough to find........

High condition 1 1/2s are tough enough, with the original box took a really, really long time....Enjoy!

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Old 06-11-2013, 05:34 PM
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Wow what a time capsule that is. Amazing 1 1/2. I just picked one up in nickel, and it looks to be original (being shipped in). Any idea how scarce nickel is for one of those? All you need is the model 1 1/2 old model tool, and you are all set.
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Old 06-11-2013, 06:16 PM
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There's nothing like wood and blued steel for
a gun like that. Nickel is nice, and protective, but...
Your wait was worth it! Really nice!
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Old 06-11-2013, 07:07 PM
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WOW, that's the first time I have ever even seen a box for a 1 1/2. I'm waiting for a letter from Roy on the 4" I purchased a couple months ago. Not quite as nice as this by a far cry. With that date has to be one of the earliest ones out. My 3 1/2" is a Jan 1866.
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Old 06-11-2013, 08:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goring's S&W View Post
Wow what a time capsule that is. Amazing 1 1/2. I just picked one up in nickel, and it looks to be original (being shipped in). Any idea how scarce nickel is for one of those? All you need is the model 1 1/2 old model tool, and you are all set.
Please tell us about the old model tool.

Thx,
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Old 06-11-2013, 08:59 PM
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Quote:
Please tell us about the old model tool.

Thx
I was only kiddin. I was pretending to be a jerk. You know, the guy who always nitpicks the collector's prize, such as this model 1 1/2.
I guess if I would have said "its SAT" everyone would have known I was kidding, I hope.
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Old 06-11-2013, 09:18 PM
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It is amazing to me to think of some guy forging the barrel and shaping the grips. This would have happened almost 150 years ago. I am sure he was in a dimly lit room with a fire burning under his forge. etc. ect.

I guess that is why I love this stuff.

Anyway, Great find.

Wingmaster
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Old 06-11-2013, 09:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goring's S&W View Post
I was only kiddin. I was pretending to be a jerk. You know, the guy who always nitpicks the collector's prize, such as this model 1 1/2.
I guess if I would have said "its SAT" everyone would have known I was kidding, I hope.
(Smile)! Well ya' got me. I didn't know of any SATs before 1881 and it's not a target model so you're right, I probably wouldn't have fallen for that. But I thought I was going to learn something new about S&W antiques because I know little about them. It was the 1st box of that vintage I think I've ever seen.
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Old 06-11-2013, 09:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goring's S&W View Post
I just picked one up in nickel, and it looks to be original (being shipped in). Any idea how scarce nickel is for one of those?
Based on previous surveys and what I've compiled over the last few years, the rate of survivors in nickel runs about 17-18%. As far as the percentage actually made, since some of those records are lost to time, don't think we'll ever really know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Goring's S&W View Post
I was only kiddin. I was pretending to be a jerk. You know, the guy who always nitpicks the collector's prize, such as this model 1 1/2.
I guess if I would have said "its SAT" everyone would have known I was kidding, I hope.
Not that far fetched an idea except it didn't come from the factory. The one pictured below shipped to J.H. Crane, London, England . The guns were cased by the distributor and included tools and an oiler also supplied by the distributor.

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Last edited by pace40; 06-11-2013 at 10:29 PM. Reason: new photo
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Old 06-11-2013, 09:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H Richard View Post
I'm waiting for a letter from Roy on the 4" I purchased a couple months ago.
I'm gonna take a wild guess and say April 10, 1866 to Boston...let me know if I'm right

(oh...and if it turns out I am right, you and I need to talk)
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Old 06-11-2013, 10:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingmaster View Post
It is amazing to me to think of some guy forging the barrel and shaping the grips. This would have happened almost 150 years ago. I am sure he was in a dimly lit room with a fire burning under his forge. etc. ect.

I guess that is why I love this stuff.

Anyway, Great find.

Wingmaster
Probably something like this....

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Old 06-11-2013, 10:17 PM
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Quote:
I thought I was going to learn something new about S&W antiques because I know little about them.
Quote:
It was the 1st box of that vintage I think I've ever seen.
I'm in the same boat as you. I'm happy when I get an antique + box and I've not got any which had any contents. My earliest box is ca 1878. I saw a box, perhaps at old town station, which was the same style as pace40s, but for a model 1. I have a small but growing antique collection myself, but there is a lot to know, and I don't think I know a lot. I like having antique revolvers from S&W, before they reached their peak as far as innovation, production numbers, etc.

The gun of this thread is beautiful and boxed, but for what its worth, this gun of pace40 is spectacular for 2 other, perhaps not so obvious reasons: first, the fact that the bluing (even though we only see one side) did not flake off, or get all marked up, even if the gun was lightly used. The bluing was done differently at that time, and it was far less durable. Then, for these 1 1/2 rimfires, they seem to have a high attrition rate, and I've noticed they are also rarely found in high condition. They are uncommon to scarce in the market today, IMO. I have a pretty clean 1 1/2 new model 32 RF, which I was happy to get. You do see many more new model 1 1/2s than the old models. I have to assume that the 32 RF ammo, compared to other cals, was even much more so corrosive. That is only my personal theory as to why these guns didn't survive. Many probably were ruined, and tossed or cut up for parts after the pitting got out of hand. By production alone, one would expect to see a lot more of them. Also consider that the civil war had no effect on them, since they came out after the civil war.

On the other hand, the model 2 was the same cal, and many of those saw action in the civil war. Perhaps a new ammo maker, or a new process came out after the civil war which made the ammo more corrosive. The 1 1/2 was also one of the best carry options around at the time: small package, decent caliber, uses ctgs rather than cap and ball, etc. Perhaps many were basically carried literally, to death. We will most likely never know the whole truth about what all ate them up. Probably a combination of factors.

Production was 26K of the 1 1/2 old model (pace40 example), over 100k of the 1 1/2 new model, and for the model 2, 77k. Out of the 3, I see the most model 2s myself. 1 1/2 old models are by far the hardest to find of the 3, IMO. As for styling, the old model 1 1/2 is like the model 2, basically an enlarged 1st model 2nd issue, and the new model 1 1/2 is like an enlarged model 1 3rd issue, basically. I guess they wanted those models to share those similarities.

Here is a pic of my model 2 (top, SN - 31XXX, prob 1865) and my model 1 1/2 new model, bottom, SN - 56XXX.

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Last edited by Göring's S&W; 06-11-2013 at 10:20 PM.
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Old 07-21-2018, 06:43 PM
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Model 1-1/2, not much remaining finish but mechanically complete.

Walt
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Old 07-21-2018, 09:36 PM
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Here's a 1 1/2 First Model I bought on Wednesday, No 6295, in about "as good as they get" condition, pictured along with the No 2 Army No 62440, I purchased along with it. The seller valued the 1 1/2 at $600 and the No 2 Army at $800, so I paid $1400 for the pair. SCSW4 values the 1 1/2 at $800 in this condition, which seems low, but, then again, despite the near impossibility of finding these in this condition, the demand for these just isn't there compared to other models.
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Old 07-22-2018, 10:31 AM
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Is it just me, or are there supposed to be pictures attached to the OPs original post. If so, I cannot see them.
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Old 07-22-2018, 10:50 AM
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Is it just me, or are there supposed to be pictures attached to the OPs original post. If so, I cannot see them.
Nope! Me too! Others responded before me in such fashion that I believed they could see the OPs photographs. So I thought it was just me.
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Old 07-22-2018, 10:56 AM
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Here's a 1 1/2 First Model I bought on Wednesday, No 6295, in about "as good as they get" condition, pictured along with the No 2 Army No 62440, I purchased along with it. The seller valued the 1 1/2 at $600 and the No 2 Army at $800, so I paid $1400 for the pair. SCSW4 values the 1 1/2 at $800 in this condition, which seems low, but, then again, despite the near impossibility of finding these in this condition, the demand for these just isn't there compared to other models.
Both are very nice . Good catch, VERY reasonable price.
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