Smith & Wesson Forum

Go Back   Smith & Wesson Forum > Smith & Wesson Revolvers > S&W Antiques
o

Notices

S&W Antiques S&W Lever Action Pistols, Tip-Up Revolvers, ALL Top-Break Revolvers, and ALL Single Shots


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 06-29-2015, 11:01 AM
elhombreconnonombre elhombreconnonombre is offline
Member
Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle  
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 2 Posts
Default Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle

It is well known that Capt. Sam Walker, U.S. Mounted Riflemen, a previous Lt. Col. in the Texas Rangers during the early part of the Mexican War, received his two new .44 cal presentation Colts from Colt, just prior to his death at the Battle of Huamantla, Mexico in Oct. 1847. These Colts were reportedly retrieved after his death.

What is not well known is that he also had in his posession an Edwin Wesson-made target rifle. Has anyone ever read what might have happened to his caplock muzzle loading Wesson target rifle? Lt. Claiborne, Walker's 2nd in command, who gathered up his possessions on the battlefield and back at camp, only mentions the disposition of Walker's two Colts.

Was the Wesson taken by Walker into the charge in the hope of bagging Santa Anna at a distance, and forgotten about and left on the field???

In Walker's last letter to his brother before his death he remarked that his company members were very impressed not only with his new Colts, but also with his Wesson target rifle. Further research indicates that Walker was interested in ordering 100 identical rifles (for his own company???) in late 1846/ early 1847, but the order was not fulfilled while he was on the east coast on recruiting duty. He also mentions the wish to capture or kill Santa Anna should the opportunity should arise.

Last edited by elhombreconnonombre; 06-29-2015 at 12:10 PM.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
  #2  
Old 06-29-2015, 06:56 PM
model3sw's Avatar
model3sw model3sw is offline
SWCA Member
Absent Comrade
Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle  
Join Date: May 2006
Location: South Florida, USA
Posts: 3,577
Likes: 7,970
Liked 4,671 Times in 1,606 Posts
Default

Please note your reference material on this. Thank you.
__________________
ANTIQUESMITHS
LM1300 SWHF425
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 06-29-2015, 10:50 PM
elhombreconnonombre elhombreconnonombre is offline
Member
Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle  
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 2 Posts
Default

Haven and Belden, 1940
Whittington, 1983
Parsons, 1949

Nouvelle page 0

Last edited by elhombreconnonombre; 06-29-2015 at 11:12 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 06-30-2015, 01:18 PM
opoefc opoefc is offline
Absent Comrade
US Veteran
SWCA Founding Member
Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle  
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: San Diego, CA. USA
Posts: 10,536
Likes: 3,529
Liked 6,883 Times in 2,796 Posts
Default

"Man with no name" (elhombreconnonombre) Lewis & Rutter, in their 2011 book " Volcanic Firearms" page 19, wrote "…correspondence in Feb. 1847 indicated that Walker wished to order 1,000 rifles for his regiment." What do your references cite as the authority for the possible order being 100 rifles, and not 1,000 rifles ? Ed.

Last edited by opoefc; 06-30-2015 at 01:20 PM.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
  #5  
Old 06-30-2015, 02:50 PM
elhombreconnonombre elhombreconnonombre is offline
Member
Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle  
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 2 Posts
Default

oops my bad, slipped a zero. It was 1,000 wasn't it per our French historian friends.
That would match the number of Colt revolvers under military contract, coincidence...I think not, but that is speculation on my part.

Thanks for the additional reference from which our French pards likely pulled their info.

Last edited by elhombreconnonombre; 06-30-2015 at 02:52 PM.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #6  
Old 06-30-2015, 06:40 PM
opoefc opoefc is offline
Absent Comrade
US Veteran
SWCA Founding Member
Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle  
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: San Diego, CA. USA
Posts: 10,536
Likes: 3,529
Liked 6,883 Times in 2,796 Posts
Default

,,,,number of Colt revolvers under military contract,… I'm assuming you are referring to the 1,000 Colt "Walker" U S model revolvers. A little known fact about these revolvers is that the barrels were made in Edwin Wesson's shop, as sub contractor for Colt. Many of the Colt made cylinders failed in service, but no barrels were ever reported as failures. Ed.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
  #7  
Old 08-06-2015, 03:13 AM
Boge Boge is offline
Member
Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle  
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Border
Posts: 426
Likes: 86
Liked 262 Times in 129 Posts
Smile

The Wesson rifle would have been ill suited for Walker & Dragoons in the war as it was slow to load, requiring careful attention to detail, nut unlike a Whitworth or Kerr rifle in the Civil War. The latter however were relegated to dedicated snipers/skirmishers. Just my 2 cents.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 08-06-2015, 09:44 AM
Skeetr57 Skeetr57 is offline
SWCA Member
Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle  
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Inman, SC USA
Posts: 1,303
Likes: 95
Liked 649 Times in 372 Posts
Default

Opoefc: I don't think that any part of the Walker guns were made by Colt. Weren't they contracted to Eli Whitney because Colt didn't have a factory after the bankruptcy of the Patterson company? I have also read that Civil War period Colts had problems with cylinders due to poor quality material.
__________________
Tom
1560
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 08-06-2015, 09:46 AM
Valmet's Avatar
Valmet Valmet is offline
Member
Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle  
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Richmond, Virginia
Posts: 4,011
Likes: 3,225
Liked 3,837 Times in 1,955 Posts
Default

The CW Colt cylinders had problems because they were mfg'd by Norinco.






I just couldn't resist ��
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 08-06-2015, 01:35 PM
opoefc opoefc is offline
Absent Comrade
US Veteran
SWCA Founding Member
Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle  
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: San Diego, CA. USA
Posts: 10,536
Likes: 3,529
Liked 6,883 Times in 2,796 Posts
Default

Tom, Edwin Wesson's shop records are the source of the info. regarding their producing the barrels for the Colt Walker revolvers, per Roy Jinks, S&W Historian. As we know, Colt had to contract with various source for parts needed to complete the order for the 1,000 revolvers, and it is believe by some researchers that Colt's slow pay for parts contributed to the bankruptcy of Edwin Wesson's shop where Daniel B. Wesson was employed and then left to eventually start the partnership with Horace Smith. Ed.

Last edited by opoefc; 08-06-2015 at 01:37 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 08-06-2015, 02:36 PM
Skeetr57 Skeetr57 is offline
SWCA Member
Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle Thoughts on Capt. Samuel Walker's  Edwin Wesson long distance Target Rifle  
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Inman, SC USA
Posts: 1,303
Likes: 95
Liked 649 Times in 372 Posts
Default

Ed: I didn't mean that I doubted that Wesson was the source of the barrels, because I don't have any knowledge of that, but that Colt didn't have a factory at the time to build any guns. I have seen the Walkers referred to as "Whitneyville Walkers" indicating that Eli Whitney actually contracted to build them. The Walker contract allowed Colt to get back into the gun business, and his patents prevented others, including Remington and S&W from producing revolvers until the patent expired @ 1857. Both Remington and Whitney built revolvers after that date which are better guns than Colts because they have solid frames, making them both stronger and potentialy more accurate.
__________________
Tom
1560
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Dan Wood's book on Edwin Wesson and pistols? Andy Griffith S&W Antiques 1 08-27-2013 04:07 PM
Shooting a rifle long distance just got a whole lot easier Wolfman-Iraq Smith & Wesson M&P 15-22 8 05-21-2013 07:25 PM
Edwin Wesson Target Rifle 1848-49 mhicks8668 S&W Antiques 1 04-21-2012 06:54 PM
Smith & Wesson Long Rifle Info Please Justcalledsteve S&W Revolvers: 1961 to 1980 1 02-19-2012 10:03 AM
Smith & Wesson 22 Long Rifle CTG freddy1 S&W Hand Ejectors: 1896 to 1961 13 04-09-2010 10:08 AM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
smith-wessonforum.com tested by Norton Internet Security smith-wessonforum.com tested by McAfee Internet Security

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:43 PM.


Smith-WessonForum.com is not affiliated with Smith & Wesson Holding Corporation (NASDAQ Global Select: SWHC)