Howdy

Just yesterday I picked up this nice 3rd Model Single Shot, 22 Long Rifle, 10" barrel. Roy says it shipped in February of 1912.







The lock up is still very tight, just a teeny, almost imperceptible amount of play. I took it to the range today and put a few (maybe 30 or so) rounds through it. Very accurate, more accurate than my poor eyesight is capable of taking advantage of with the tiny sights.

It was really fun shooting it, no real disadvantage to it being a single shot for plinking at tin cans on the 25 yard berm.


I do have a question about the front sight. There are not a whole lot of photos of these out on the web. The front sights on these seem to vary a bit. This one seems to be not quite the same as some of the Patridge front sights I have seen. Wondering if maybe this is an alteration to a half moon sight front sight. The bottom vertical surface has some horizontal serrations, and the top looks like it may have been flattened a bit. Wondering if anybody has an opinion on whether this is the original front sight or not.

Sorry these photos are less than ideal.






Thanks

Here is the Patridge front on my 1920 third model. My understanding is that in 1912 the narrow blade was standard with the Paine bead optional. Does the rear sight look like an original square notch?

Bob

Howdy

Thanks for your reply.

Here are two photos of the rear sight.

I can't even afford to look a these pictures let alone buy one. This is why I try leave most of my money at home when I go out gun shopping, because if I ever see one of these for sale I am going to buy it. These things have got to cost several $K these days. I have never seen one for sale.

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Dr. B

That rear sight notch seems to have been filed out, and the front sight isn't like any that AI am familiar with, may be a modification of a patridge. This is not unusual, competitive shooters were always doing whatever gave them any edge on the competition. That's a nice gun. Much nicer than my Mod 3, it has a Mod 2 barrel and a completely different front sight.

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H Richard
SWCA1967 SWHF244

Howdy Again

Don't get me wrong folks, I like this Single Shot very much, am very happy with it just as it is. Just curious about the sights.

DocB: It's probably not going to make you feel any better, but there was a pair of these for sale from a local SWCA member at a local gun show. I chose this one because the bore was better, it is like new. Not a pit or anything at all.

The asking price was $900 each. I got this one for $800.

I'm glad you got this one. I still think you should have taken the First Model Single Shot I had.

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Don Mundell

The earlier guns typically carried a blade or blade with a bead front sight---U notch rear. There are no (known) factory fronts with horizontal serrations. The only known half moon shaped front is the Lyman Bead. If yours was/is a Lyman, it will say so---stamped on the left side.

As I'm sure you know, your pictures have gone bye-bye. If you can get them back, I may be able to help more.

Ralph Tremaine

And the Lyman Bead was a flattened half moon shape----with the bead at the end of the flattened surface. Needless to say, if the bead is not there, the flattened surface would remain---unless.

????

I can see them fine.

Me too----now??

At any rate, my knee-jerk reaction is H Richard nailed it when he said modified Patridge----maybe----could be homemade from scratch. There are two different Patridge----.100" and .125" thick. I have three of those----measuring .100", .105", and .123" (the latter two being "close enough for government work" I guess). The (stock) lengths being .505", .508", and .508". The height (above the rib) is .215". Your height is going to be less than that (if it's a modified (stock) Patridge) because the stock shape rises from the front radius (to the back edge)----and yours appears to be flat. I have no comment on the notch at the rear. I'd understand it if it was undercut. I reckon the notch and the serrations seemed like a good idea at the time. As was also noted earlier, the lunatic fringe target shooters (then and now) do their own things. The first thing they mess with are the grips. Next come the sights. After that, you name it---weight/balance is probably next (barrel weights being a not all that unusual modification). A lot of them can shoot better than I can, so I don't argue with them.

Ralph Tremaine

And for sure what it isn't is a modified blade sight (a la Lyman)---------way too thick.

And if you're so inclined, you can probably come up with a stock Patridge replacement. George Dye (at David Carroll's) has come up with a rear blade (for these sights) and a complete latch/adjustable sight for a NM #3 for me recently----like there was nothing to it---just like Walmart! Don Mundell (Club Gun Fan) also noted his acquisition of a large, heavy assortment of bits and pieces (including sight stuff), so he may have a dozen or so of these blades laying around too.

Howdy

Thanks for the great information.

The blade is .065 thick, approx .570 long, stands about .245 (yes .245) tall above the rib. Maybe that's why it was shooting a little bit low.

It has definitely been modified, maybe home made, the junction of the rounded front and the flat at the top is out of square, and I just noticed this, the sight leans a bit to the right when viewed from the front. In addition, the pin holding the sight in place has not been driven in evenly, more is protruding on one side than the other.

Again, not complaining, just trying to get to the bottom of this.

P.S. Where can I find more information about the S&W Single Shots? The information in SCSW and Neal & Jinks is pretty limited.

So---- the pin is protruding unevenly is it?!! Well that settles it! And here I thought I was the only really around the bend nit picker left on this planet!! Good for you!!!

And just so you know for sure, your sight was not born in Springfield. I know this because whoever messed with it certainly could have made it narrower than stock, but they'd have a tough time making it longer----and taller. And yes, I know they could have modified some other Patridge that WAS born in Springfield.

RT

Congratulations on your purchase, she is a beauty!
I have one that has been in my family for 3 generations, most accurate pistol I have.
My front sight is 0.115, the rear face is moon shaped with no bead.
Also has an Olympic chamber.

Ed, yours is, or could be rather unusual. As near as I can tell from the photo, the front sight is that known as the "thin round top blade"---available on order for top break revolvers from about 1905 to 1923, and standard on all HE's from the same period---and on order until 1942.

But the combination of that sight and the Olympic Chamber is what's unusual----if my knee-jerk reaction is accurate. (Big IF there!) The sight says early gun. The "Olympic Chamber" says later gun----usually, but not always. So, is the serial number above 9548? And did it ship in/after 1920?

Many thanks!

Ralph Tremaine

My serial no is D 9560. Cartridges will not chamber without a little push for the last 16th of an inch. I can chamber them by simply closing the action or pushing them in with my finger, either way accuracy is the same.

Driftwood, you asked about additional information about SS's. Jinks' History of Smith & Wesson has some (pretty much same only different as that found elsewhere). This forum is as good as it's going to get for most anything you may want to know. Terry Wagner is a walking encyclopedia on these things. Ernie Rice has forgotten more than most folks know about the Straight Lines, and Ed Cornett is a walking encyclopedia on dang near anything S&W. So, as they say, ask---and you shall receive.

Ralph Tremaine

Driftwood and Ralph, Should either of you need the correct from sight blade, I have a very small hoard of single shot front sights I picked up from Charles Duffy (RIP) about 30 years ago, still in the Marbles's cellophane wrapper envelopes. Sal

PS: I'd never pass up a deal on any version single shot if the price was right. Bravo on your find

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ANTIQUESMITHS
LM1300 SWHF425

Late Serial Number. Olympic modification. Marbles Front Sight.

She is a real beauty, thanks for sharing the great photos.

If you got that from Club Gun Fan, I hope it isn't the one with a March 16th ship date, he sort of offered me first options on it some time back, but I think that was his wife's birthday also, so I'm sure it couldn't be that one.

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H Richard
SWCA1967 SWHF244

Picked it up about 25 years ago at a gun show. Didn't know anything about it. Just liked it........ so I bought it. Until I read Jinks book.......... didn't know what exactly I had.

I thought it worthy of resurrecting this thread as I have two Third Model Perfected Single Shot Pistols that shipped a week apart in February of 1913, a year after Driftwood Johnson’s pistol shipped, one being modified and the other not. The unmodified one, to be pictured in the next post, would have probably had a rear sight blade and front sight of the style on Driftwood’s pistol, and mine, prior to modification, probably by a serious pistol shooter.

First, the pistol with modified sights:

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And the unmodified pistol with a Patridge front sight:

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The front sight pictured above is the "Thin Round Top Blade"---think of it as a skinny Patridge as respects the sight picture. It never appeared on a 3rd Model as standard, so it was special ordered (could be had all the way up to 1942)---or it's a replacement.

The one great advantage it offers to us---today, is it's the same thickness top to bottom, and is child's play to make from scratch!

Ralph Tremaine

And up there where I said it never appeared as standard---I take that back! I'm almost certain my 6" had one------very early gun (#4807/made in 1911/shipped in 1915(!!)). I'm not so sure the 8" gun didn't have one too---also an early gun (#4826/also made in 1911---and shipped two days later) (!!)----one of the advantages of special orders!

Darn it all Ralph, just when I think I have a sound working knowledge base, you punch holes in that theory.

But thank you for the commentary and please to know it might be special order, or replacement.

Yeah, well all good things come to an end! The good thing that came to an end this time was my good sense in trusting my memory about the sight on the 8". It wasn't the Thin Round Top Blade, but a Patridge. That revelation came about due to my lack of faith in my memory of the serial numbers (of both the 6" and 8")---so I checked the letters. I was right about the serial numbers--but a little further down it said the 8" shipped with a Patridge-------so PPHHHTTTT!!------back to the drawing board!

Ralph Tremaine