I've recently purchased a Frontier SA Model 3 in 44-40. Still waiting for arrival and wanted to ask if any of you can advise the best diameter of bullet size for hand loading?

I have optional sizing from .427 to .430" thanks.

Original Winchester .44-40 bullet diameter was listed as 0.427"

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Tom
1560

Most reloaders use somewhere between .427 and .429 bullets. The selection is usually whichever gives the best accuracy in modern gune. Larger bullets often give better accuracy, but pressure will rise as you move up in size. For me, I shoot 44 Russian and 44-40 in old S&Ws, but always use the lighest and smallest diameter bullet that will leave rifing marks on the bullet and not key-hole on target. Lowest pressure, lightest bullet, lots of fun, and easy on the gun.

If you are using BP, you will not be able to get 40 grains of powder in modern brass, so velocities and pressures should be under original factory loads. If using smokeless, I keep velocities around 700 fps.

*Thanks for the correction Guy.

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Gary
SWCA 2515

fps, not psi. But we knew what you meant .

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Guy
SWHF #474 SWCA LM#2629

Size your bullets to the cylinder's throat diameter. Hopefully all 6 diameters will be close to eachother.

Howdy

Loading 44-40 can be squirrely at best. I have about five rifles chambered for the caliber, old Winchesters and an old Marlin, plus a couple of Ubertis. Even though the standard groove diameter for 44-40 was .427 in the 19th Century, one of my old Winchesters has a groove diameter of .429. Go figure. One of my new Ubertis also has a groove diameter of .429. All the others are .427.

With revolvers, it gets even squirrelier because you have to contend with chamber throat diameters as well as rifling groove diameters.

I have no Smiths chambered for 44-40, but I do have a New Model Number Three and a Russian both chambered for 44 Russian. Both of these have very generous chamber throats, way up around .434. They will easily pass a bullet .430 in diameter. But I have a Merwin Hulbert and an old Colt New Service chambered for 44-40, and they both had very tight chamber throats, down around .424. I had the throats on both of these opened up to .430 because I was not comfortable firing bullets through that were several thousandths over size.

To make matters worse, most S&W barrels have an odd number of grooves, which makes it difficult to get an accurate measurement across the diameter when you slug the barrel.

Because of all this variation, I settled on .428 as my standard 44-40 and 44 Russian bullet diameter a bunch of years ago.

I agree that the best course is to use the smallest bullet that will leave good rifling marks on the bullet, without keyholing. For me .428 works in my revolvers and rifles, but I went ahead and opened up those tight chamber throats in the Merwin Hulbert and the New Service so I would not be raising pressure too much shoving my .428 bullets through .424 chamber throats.

Thanks posters. Good info here. Looks like i'm going to have to experiment a little bit. I will put some pictures up when she comes in. @ driftwood... 428 seems like a good compromise.

I agree with Gary and most of the insightful replies.

Keep the loads light on the older guns. How much head pressure you need to punch a hole in a piece of paper ? I load my Model 3's to the gallery specs for target shooting. I load others a bit hotter that the gallery loads but stick with Phillip Sharpe's specs and you can't go wrong. If you don't have his book ... buy one, fast ! It doesn't matter what condition it's in as long as you can still read all the pages.

I have every edition (printing / revisions) of every one of his books, mostly all signed by the author because he was almost as good a showman as P.T. Barnum only difference being Phil Sharpe printed only proven facts and rigidly repeated test results.

I also have his only known original "this hand loading game of ours" (or similar / near title IIRC) that I found by sheer dumb luck. It was the 2nd copy in the Library of Congress, sold off as surplus about 10 years ago. That's how much I admire Phil Sharpe !

Also, better off using softer or pure lead bullets in the older barrels. Cast bullets with too much tin are a bit too hard for the older barrels, I feel, because you never know just how "hard" the cast bullets are. Make sure your barrel is clean and take the time to polish it out with a mop as best you can. Usually the barrels have black powder pits and stains which is quite common.

Good luck with that NM3 in 44-40. I have NM3 Frontier SA, SN: 2 that had the barrel clipped to make it a belly gun many MANY years ago but functions perfectly. It has U.S. stamp on it but there is no proof it was in fact a US gun.

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ANTIQUESMITHS
LM1300 SWHF425

@M3...thanks for the reply. Too bad that SN 2 cannot talk. I'll check out Sharpes book. I've read his stuff in magazines as long as I remember. Now that I'm getting older it's the old stuff that interests me. Guess it figures.

Makes sense about soft bullets. Thanks again.