I am getting ready re-plate a .32 Double action because it needs it and condition would eliminate it from being anything more than a nice shooter. My question is did S&W ever plate the trigger guard and/or hammer, because this gun has plating still on those areas.
I also am having trouble finding a replacement cylinder stop.
The serial number is 82661. I guesstimate a Fourth Model about 1887.
It looks like only one of the photos up loaded.
Thanks in advance.
IMG_6011.jpg

I am quite certain the hammer was never plated---same for the trigger guard (but not so certain).

I'm no help on the cylinder stop.

Ralph Tremaine

Thanks, that was my guess; however only a guess.

I hope my recent attempts at having the nickle removed from a 1st change 32-20 are my problem and not something to be concerned about. A local firearms refinisher seemed competent and was not overly concerned about the pitted nickle finish that I wanted removed and then blued. He returned the revolver to me on Monday and I was dismayed at what I saw, according to him the pitting on the nickle had worked its way under the nickle, he had trouble removing all of the nickle and in fact some remains. He has had the piece for nearly a year and struggled with it, I saw it six months ago and it looked terrible after coming out of the tank. I was not into the thing very much and probably is an answer to why I got such a good deal on it. I feel fortunate that it is still a functioning firearm, the overall outside of the piece is pleasantly satin blued, most of the roll marks are dim at best, the etched areas that are on the inside of the receiver look terrible but he did not want to remove anymore metal than would be required. It is sad and if it weren't for the lesson I have learned I would be angry not only with myself but the guy that performed the lousy job. As such I cannot ever recommend his services to anyone in the area, although as a FFL license holder he can handle shipping or recieving of firearms at a reasonable price.
I would imagine for sake of argument that someone like Fords would give you a warning about pitting difficulties or at some part in the process give you a heads up, one can only hope.
Please let my experience serve as a friendly warning to anyone attempting this process.

I think I would have left the Gun as it is. Refinished it is still a 'Shooter' Grade Gun as a Collector can pick a Refinished Gun a mile away and will only be interested in it as a Shooter!! These smaller Framed Top Breaks were made in the Hundreds of Thousands and are only worth much in near new condition, preferably still in the original Box. Your Refinish may cost more than the Value of the Gun. Still, if you want your baby all prettied up; go for it.

Your Gun has and old Refinish Job already on it. To look at all authentic; you Gun should have the Trigger Guard and T Latch Blued; the Hammer and Trigger should be in Case Colours and the rest Nickeled. The Gun will need all the Pits and Rust Spots Buffed back to mirror smooth or the Nickel will look bad. The Old Nickel can be removed by Reverse Electrolysis but you are left with one Hundred years + of oxidization which is happening under the Nickel - eventually the Nickel bubbles and you get a spot growing just like an old Car's Bumper Bar will bubble up from rust forming under the Plating.

You will find a Cylinder Stop; there are Parts Guns out there and folks who have Shoe-Box Wrecking Yards in their Sheds with all kinds of goodies. If the search takes too long for your liking, there is always places like Numrich..

Firearm Parts & Accessories | Military Surplus | Numrich Gun Parts

The final result will depend entirely on how much time and trouble your Refinisher takes (and what you are willing to pay for) in getting the surfaces perfect, as the Plating can only look as good as what its covering.

sw44russ nailed it!! Surface preparation is EVERYTHING!!

Anybody can blue or plate anything. Not anybody has the knowledge, skill, and patience to do it right. Knowledge, skill, and patience cost money. Look for the best---not the best price.

There ain't no free lunch!!

Ralph Tremaine

The simple answer is yes. I am aware of a couple of letters stating full nickel plate and documentation from the SWHF that shows a sales receipt for a full nickel gun, plus I have a full plate 32 RF Model 1 1/2 that Jim Supica stated was factory full plate BUT they might be the only ones out there??

Your revolver would almost certainly have had blued trigger guard and case colored appearance on trigger and hammer. The case hardening is often gone on antique revolvers that have seen use, leaving an appearance from grey metal to dark patina. You did not ask about the cylinder stop being plated, but all mine are what looks like in-the-white metal and they may have been case hardened to add wear resistance. You might check with gunpartscorp.com or on ebay for the cylinder stop you need. You do have a 4th Model from about 1886-1887. Good luck

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Gary
SWCA 2515

Pitting isn't something that forms on the Nickle - it forms under the Nickle It is Oxidization (Rust) forming on the Metal beneath. Eventually, the Nickle has nothing to stick to and bubbles up. The Rust Spot is gradually exposed and grows as the air reaches it. Nickel applied at the Factory is very durable but Re-Nickel jobs are only as good as the guy who did them.
You can remove old Plating by putting the gun in the Plating Tank and running Reverse Current through it; this basically 'De-plates' it - the Plating simply falls off. There will be several layers of Plating on all but the worst Jobs and each layer takes time to remove.
Then the Real Prep Work begins; sanding, Buffing, etc to try to get a decent surface for the new Nickel. Just like a Car Body, the Finish can only ever be as good as the surface it was applied to and this is where the job will shine (literally) or you end up with a Matte or Satin Finish that looks pretty average.

It's all about how much time spent and how much of a perfectionist your Refinisher is - and how much you want to pay for his time.

I have a NM3 being Blued right now - this Gun had been Chromed!! I've asked for a good job and I'm willing to pay but really; who knows what I'll get back. I think the surfaces are quite good (merciless buffing has been committed against it) so fingers crossed!!

Thank you everyone for your info.
My suspicion was that the gun had already been re-plated. After the bead blasting, I will re-blue the hammer, T latch, trigger guard and trigger. I realize the parts that should be case hardened will not be right; however I feel they will look better than the nickle.
I have used the same guy for plating for several guns and he does amazing work and for far less any other one I have found. These are all guns I get for very little to nothing and bring them back shooting condition usually for less then $120 including the plating. He does a lot of work for museums but loves fire arms.
The cylinder stop was broken so it needs replacing. I have been searching for a while from Numrich to small shops.
Thanks again to everyone.

Who' your plater?

Thank you for your interest AMMODAVE,
The name of my plater is Kim Colla and his company is Pilgrim Plating, 757 Lincoln Ave., Ste 25, San Rafael, CA 94901.
Phone number is (415) 456-1525.
He does Brass, Silver Copper and Nickle and you need to have patience because of his work load. Just one of his clients is a museum that keeps him very busy; however that said he loves firearms and has always been willing to work me in. Some times even that has been two to three months.
It's fun to find an old "parts gun" and bring it back to a safe and beautiful shooter.
Thanks again for everyone's input.

This is what an original condition .32 DA looks like. Trigger guard and barrel latch/knurled buttons in blue. Hammer and trigger are case colored.

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Guy
SWHF #474 SWCA LM#2629

Thank you.

I have a S&W Favorite in great mechanical condition but it now blue and according to the factory letter the original finish was nickel. I know it does not make any financial sense to get it back to nickel but this is not a financial decisions for me. I am not in any rush and just want the job done correctly. Who would you recommend to do this?

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Petter
S&WCA 1759

Are we talking about a very rare Wesson's Favorite 44 Double Action? If so, you should do nothing until you find an expert to figure out what the finish was originally. I would first question I'd the gun was ever nickel. It takes a lot of effort to remove nickel and there is usually some indication that the gun was nickel at one time. Take off the sideplate and look at the back? The factory records are not 100% accurate, since they were logged by a person who could have mad a mistake. Post some photos here and you will get some valid opinions on what you have.

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Gary
SWCA 2515

Yes it is the rare Wesson's Favorite 44 Double Action. The serial no is 9985 and it letters as shipped from the factory Nov 5, 1890 and delivered to Harley & Graham NY and with nickel finish.
Any input and recommendations would be greatly appreciated.



http://smith-wessonforum.com/members...15717-side.jpg

http://smith-wessonforum.com/members...714-hammer.jpg


http://smith-wessonforum.com/members...rame-right.jpg

http://smith-wessonforum.com/members...frame-left.jpg

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Petter
S&WCA 1759

A very nice looking Wesson's Favorite. The first picture shows what could easily be original finish. What bothers me is the butt-frame under the stocks, but I cannot know for sure what I am seeing. A nickel revolver will have nickel under the sideplate and the inside of the frame. Can you remove the sideplate? Take off the wood stocks and remove the screw. Tap the butt-frame with a wood hammer handle and it will drop right off. If you can take pictures of the inside of the frame and the back of the sideplate, that would help a lot. Use a little penetrating oil on the screw head and let is set overnight. Find a screwdriver with a well fitting blade and try to remove the screw. Should come out without problems.

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Gary
SWCA 2515

Hi Gary,
I'll be happy to do so and thank you for your help and insight. I'll make it my evening project and have some more pictures posted tonight.

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Petter
S&WCA 1759

Although many of us have a desire to bring back some of these neat older guns, typically the cost is more than the gun is worth and any refinish or restoration destroys all collector value regardless of who does the work and how good it is.

For most collectors, a refinish unless done at the factory is the kiss of death for a firearm.

So, if you are doing it for yourself and cost is not an issue, go for it. If you are hoping to someday get your money back, you may be in for a long wait.

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James Redfield
LM #497

About 1000 of this model was manufactured and most went overseas. They are very rare in the US. This is the first fresh one I have seen in a couple of years. They just do not come up for sale and are very sought after.

To me this revolver breaks the condition rules since most hard core collectors still do not have an example of one of this model and you could be still talking about good value. The problem is that restored guns are not like restored automobiles. Their value is normally not enhanced by bringing them back to original as new, but rather are typically worth half of a documented original condition collectable S&W. Jim Supica's Standard Catalog of Smith & Wessons does not even venture a guess at value, stating "Too rare to estimate, worth substantial premium."

About 5 years ago, I ran across a half-breed Wesson Favorite that had been resurrected by using some parts from a standard 44 DA, including a 44 DA cylinder that did not have patent date stamps. It still sold for $10,000, far above what I was willing to bid.

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Gary
SWCA 2515

Hi James,
Yes I would do this for my own satisfaction and would not consider refinishing the gun if it still had any of the original finish. But if it turns out that it has a non-factory refinish from original nickel to blue, then it has already had the kiss-of-death and and another kiss will not hurt (except for some out-of-pocket $$).

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Petter
S&WCA 1759

Hi Gary,
Here are the pictures you suggested. I also included a picture of the cylinder and as you can see the markings are worn and not sharp while the backstrap looks almost new (the cylinder no match the gun). Also the case hardning of the hammer looks "different" at least on the sides, than typical.



http://smith-wessonforum.com/members...-sideplate.jpg

http://smith-wessonforum.com/members...ammer-lose.jpg

http://smith-wessonforum.com/members...2-cylinder.jpg

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Petter
S&WCA 1759

Thanks. I do not see any nickel, did you detect any? The closeup of the cylinder clearly show pitting that has been blued. The nickel could have been removed chemically or by reverse electrolysis. It now seems that the gun could have been nickel originally, and the refinisher completely removed the Nickel in order to blue it. Case coloring often fades with age and sometimes takes on a matte silver appearance.

Check out the Forum for comments on Fords Custom Gun Refinishing. I have no direct experience with this company, but have heard many good reports on their services. Also, I believe that they also restore stampings and engravings.

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Gary
SWCA 2515

Thanks Gary for your input. I have not seen any traces of nickel and most of the edges on the gun are nice and sharp and I cannot see any indication that it was polished. So as you said, the original nickel might have been removed chemically or by reverse electrolysis.
I will proceed with Ford (I have also heard good things about them) and will post some before and after pictures when it gets done.

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Petter
S&WCA 1759

With apologies to higbees for this thread drift; schof45, does the serial number have a star (*) after it? It is my understanding that many Wesson Favorite revolvers were refinished at the factory because of finish problems from their long term storage while awaiting a Russian contract that never materialized. It is the rare revolver that does not have the star.

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Mike Maher #283

Thanks for the question Mike and the long term storage info.
It does not have a star or a date stamp on grip frame.

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Petter
S&WCA 1759

You know that significant polishing will have to be done to remove the pitting on the cylinder which will erode the patent stamps. I would talk to Ford's first to make sure they can recut the stamps. But, I doubt they have the stamps for the patent dates. Even with the pitting and perhaps a finish change, that gun looks very good. If the work was done, it was done long, long ago. I wouldn't refinish it because what's on it now is a part of its history. Also, I would check again with Roy to make sure it wasn't originally blued.

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Guy
SWHF #474 SWCA LM#2629

Thanks for good advice Guy.
I am not in a rush to do this so reaching out to Roy before I make the final decision makes sense.

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Petter
S&WCA 1759

I agree. Check again with Roy.

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Mike Maher #283

Thank you for your interest schof45,
The name of my plater is Kim Colla and his company is Pilgrim Plating, 757 Lincoln Ave., Ste 25, San Rafael, CA 94901.
Phone number is (415) 456-1525.
He does Brass, Silver Copper and Nickle and you need to have patience because of his work load. Just one of his clients is a museum that keeps him very busy; however that said he loves firearms and has always been willing to work me in. Some times even that has been two to three months.
It's fun to find an old "parts gun" and bring it back to a safe and beautiful shooter.
Thanks again for everyone's input.

Schof45, sorry for any confusion, I was referring to the OP's questions raised in post #1. I only glanced at the other posts and did not realize that you had jumped in about your own gun.

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James Redfield
LM #497

Someone recently posted that theranger1 has some of these old parts available on GB

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Robert
SWCA #2906, SWHF #760

Thanks, I'll look

Thank you for the information Higbees. Have not made up my mind yet on what to do and in no rush.

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Petter
S&WCA 1759

My guess-
The nickel, if it was there, was removed by reversing polarity. The gun was then lightly and skillfully buffed and blued.
It has definitely been buffed.

As far as what to do-
your gun, your money, your decision.

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Regards,
Lee Jarrett

Thanks Lee,
I think you nailed it. Wish I knew who and when it was blued but of course not knowing the histories of our guns is part of the intrigue of collecting these pieces of history.

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Petter
S&WCA 1759