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S&W Antiques S&W Lever Action Pistols, Tip-Up Revolvers, ALL Top-Break Revolvers, and ALL Single Shots


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  #1  
Old 06-11-2017, 01:28 PM
lechat lechat is offline
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Default My new SW n°2 cased

I just buy this case with a SW n°2 old model in a estate auction in France.





The revolver is in new condition with deep blue everywhere. Only the cylinder in medium grey. (I don't know why ?).

I'am very happy with this buying.

Do you see a other one like this ? I don't know if it's very rare ? I have see other small SW sold by Claudin but never a n°2 old model.

Maybe a idea of the value in the USA ?

Regards

Michel
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Old 06-11-2017, 01:57 PM
gmborkovic gmborkovic is offline
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That is the most beautiful No.2, I have ever seen. Nice buy. And welcome from FL. Best. Love that case.
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Old 06-11-2017, 02:07 PM
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Michel, I have to follow Mike's comments with a "me too!" The Standard Catalog of S&W, 4th Edition, says Excellent condition - $2700 and Fine Condition - $1800. But, I believe your package would exceed those estimates. Congratulations!
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Old 06-11-2017, 02:27 PM
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Magnifique!
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Old 06-11-2017, 05:24 PM
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Strange that Claudin put his name upside down on the barrel. Also, sometime in the past the case insert has been removed and replaced upside down. Having said all that, this is not a Smith & Wesson, but a copy by Claudin. Common in Europe in the late 1800s. Ed.
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Old 06-11-2017, 07:06 PM
gmborkovic gmborkovic is offline
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Hello Ed, do you mean those guys were that good? I know we are working off of one pic.
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Old 06-11-2017, 07:07 PM
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Defitively not a copy, Claudin was a dealer of fine arms and importator of Smith & Wesson for France. The SW markings are perfect.

For the story, this gun was the gun of the creator of perfume GERLAIN in Paris and stay in the family.

I'am the second owner of the gun !

The serial number is 70617.

Maybe you can help me for a date ?
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Old 06-11-2017, 07:12 PM
g8rb8 g8rb8 is offline
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Extraordinaire!

The Standard Catalog of Smith & Wesson, 4th edition, page 487 states:
Model 2
1861-1874 serial number range 1-77155
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Old 06-11-2017, 07:45 PM
Bob L Bob L is offline
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Very nice looking revolver and case. Great Find!
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Old 06-11-2017, 09:54 PM
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Copies of S&Ws, made in Europe by quality makers and dealers, such as this one, were often very good. Almost exact in dimensions. In my opinion, this is a copy. It says so, right on the barrel. "Brevete" means 'copy, or licensed " ( S&W did not license any European gunmakers to produce Model 2 Armies.) You will see genuine S&Ws cased and retailed by European dealers, but they are not marked as "Brevetes" Claudin sold genuine S&Ws but if this is one of them, why mark it as a copy? Some tests can include the wood used for the stocks. Rosewood? Number of lands & grooves. Thread pitch of the hinge, extractor & stock screws, dimensions of lettering on barrel & cylinder. Ed.

Last edited by opoefc; 06-11-2017 at 09:55 PM.
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Old 06-12-2017, 12:39 PM
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Ed, I have closely compared the images with a 5" of mine and the OP's gun sure looks close. Enlarging the barrel stamping, it is identical to the standard S&W barrel stamping and is in the right place on the rib for a 5" gun. The stocks look a little too brown for rosewood.

Here is what I see as different than my Model 2s:

- The screw escutcheons are different than originals (originals are not dished)
- The hammer has a heavier spur and has a wider top than sides (originals are flat-sided)
- There is a detail around the hinge area that does not show up on originals (flat metal on originals)
- There is no evidence of the patent line around the cylinder visible (should be visible in a next-to-new gun)
- The ejector rod is shorter than originals (should be 1 3/4" from tip to center of retaining screw)

Other than that, it was built to exact dimensions and configurations of originals. Could you see if there is a serial number stamped on the butt and inside the right stock. Also, is there an assembly number or letter(s) on the inside of the left butt frame under the stock? It should match the front of the cylinder and the rear of the barrel frame in front of the cylinder. Please report what numbers you find.
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Old 06-13-2017, 12:38 PM
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Thanks to everybody.

Others pictures for Gary and Ed









If it's not a SW, I very proud of the quality of the french gunsmiths

In every case, never a copy have a serial number with 5 number in the good range.

Last edited by lechat; 06-13-2017 at 12:46 PM.
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Old 06-13-2017, 01:54 PM
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Thanks for the additional photos. I did see one other difference and that is the pivot screw is either an incorrect replacement or the choice of a forger gunsmith. It is a very tough gun to be certain one way or the other.

My opinion is that if the gun has the above mentioned assembly letter/numbers and if the right stock is stamped with the serial number, it is most likely an original S&W Model 2 with added stampings of a dealer or distributor.

Lastly, the word Brevete, to me, simply means patented.
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Old 06-13-2017, 02:41 PM
lechat lechat is offline
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Yes "breveté" is "patented".

It was usual on the 19' Century to write "breveté par" for the importated guns. I have others SW, Colt and Webleys with the same marks.

I know that luxus dealer in Europe made modification of foreign best products after import: other finish, other grips and sometimes on demand acessories like stocks.

I'am not at home now and I can't compare with my other old model

Last edited by lechat; 06-13-2017 at 05:00 PM.
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Old 06-13-2017, 08:34 PM
mmaher94087 mmaher94087 is offline
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I vote: Original. Late production revolvers (approximately serial number 60K from observation) appear to have a heavier spur (but not flanged) which may be a byproduct from the change in knurling of the hammer spur. The escutcheons on the stock were dished not flat as were the earlier No. 2's. I see nothing to indicate anything but a very nice original #2 Army. OP, have you checked with the Ron Curtis Number Two Project?
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Old 06-14-2017, 07:18 AM
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Another tid bit of note is that the display case is also marked with the word brevete under the name. If you GOOGLE the word "brevete" there are several different uses given depending on whether the word is used as a noun or an adjective etc. As an adjective is means "patent protected" so perhaps the store owner was merely trying to explain that S&W's were covered by patents??????
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Old 06-14-2017, 01:22 PM
mmaher94087 mmaher94087 is offline
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lechat, Smith and Wesson Model 2 Army Revolver This is a compilation of 30+ years of research on the No. 2 Army.
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Old 06-14-2017, 01:27 PM
lechat lechat is offline
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Yes it's the good rendering but it's too a common guile in the 19' Century
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