I just received an early (s/n 345) 8" second model. Good but not great condition, clean bore. Frame, barrel, latch and stocks match. Front sight is a King bead, improperly mounted in an apparent attempt to elevate it.
The rear aperture sight is the interesting part. Definitely not the work of a home gunsmith, but new to me. I know the factory offered an optional rear aperture on the registered magnum, but I have not seen one on any of the top breaks. I thought there was a thread on something similar, but couldn't find it.

Bob

Very interesting, I have not seen one before. The aperture looks rather large, but held at arms length is probably correct size. Would I be correct there is a tiny screw from underneath that adjusts the elevation? I'm watching to see if it can be recognized as factory.

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H Richard
SWCA1967 SWHF244

If that's factory, you have now joined an august group of exactly two souls who have found a sight Bob Neal missed. Bob spent several years, aided and abetted by an unknown number of SWCA members, researching S&W target sights. Given the factory maintained no records on sights worth talking about, it was a monumental undertaking. All this was assembled into a two part article (The Evolution of Smith & Wesson Target Sights) published in the Arms Gazette in 1977. (I'm the other soul in the august group, having stumbled upon the so-called "large screw spring up" sight in 1999.)

As to the peep sight on an RM, I (dimly) recall knowing of one gun being fitted with such, but have no recollection it was done by the factory, or offered by the factory. Assuming the RM peep sight was done by the factory, I'm inclined to believe it was a one-off. And having said all that, I am now (also dimly) reminded of a peep sight offered by King (and if it was offered by King, it was offered by S&W as a matter of course).

Get a letter. If it letters with the sight, you're home free. If it letters as an unspecified special order, you're home free---or at least home free enough to win any arguments with me.

And having mentioned King, I am also reminded they were not even remotely bashful, and marked virtually all their stuff-----KING. Any King marks anywhere(?)---sometimes found on the hidden part of front sight blades---otherwise pretty much anywhere there was enough room to stamp it.

Ralph Tremaine

And as an aside of no moment whatsoever, your 2nd Model was built on a 1st Model frame (two pins). I suspect that was as common as dirt with the early 2nd's.

CONTINUING--------------with all the news that's fit to print about RM sights----and peep sights in particular.

"The King rear sights (for the RM) included the white outline style and the King adjustable peep sight." (Jinks---black ink on white paper) So---King peep sights were available for installation on any S&W King made them for-----and any which could be modified to accept them.

BUT--------here we may have a sight from a company founded in 1913(?) on a pistol produced from 1905 to 1909. So much for it being factory installed----at least at the outset. It could have been factory installed (by the Service Department folks) if the pistol was sent back. Given it's a King sight, it also could have been installed by anyone with a little screwdriver.

Bottom Line: It's a neat gun---never mind where the sight came from nor who installed it.

Ralph Tremaine

Without disassembly, the rear sight is unmarked. The front sight is King, but the workmanship of the fitting is not consistent with being done by either King or Smith.

Bob

After seeing a post in the HE forum by S&W ucla regarding pre-war King rear apertures, I removed and cleaned the rear sight. Sure enough, it does say KING. Obviously designed for the break opens, unlike S&W ucla's, which was for a hand ejector.

Bob

AND-----given it's a KING product, it stands to reason they made them for both frame sizes (both frame sizes using the same design sight differing only in width----and blade heights for the several different calibers).

SO-------somewhere out there there's very likely some NM #3's and some of those big ugly double actions sporting KING peep sights---never mind I've never seen nor heard of one.

Getting old is not so bad as long as we keep learning about new things---especially new old things.

Ralph Tremaine

VERY interesting, and, I LIKE it !!

Attached Images

VERY INTERSTING Arte Johnson.jpg (23.3 KB, 15 views)

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ANTIQUESMITHS
LM1300 SWHF425

Ralph,

I am officially joining the search for a NM#3 with King aperture (preferably .44 caliber). Unfortunately, I am not optimistic, not just because I probably couldn't afford it. By the time King came along, many Smith singleshots were on the firing line. I suspect, however, that the large frame SA's and DA's had pretty much been replaced by HE's.

Bob

That is an interesting gun thanks for posting and shareing ,thanks to the experts for adding information and or educated speculation .

Any and everything that's made is/was made because somebody thinks somebody else will buy it----and the more the merrier.

Given access to King catalogs, anybody can tell us when they made what. I don't have the first clue as to when King started making peep sights (for handguns), nor for which guns they were made. I know they were designed with (at least) two things in mind: The first is ease of installation. The second is a large market. Now what is/was a large market is in the eye of the beholder. I personally was dumbfounded (or at least mildly surprised) to see a King peep sight made for S&W's earliest adjustable sight (those on most top-breaks)----not much of a market there---comparatively speaking. Similarly, I wasn't the least bit surprised to see them made for the entirety of the pre-war HE targets (obviously not counting the 22/40---although for all I know, peeps may have been made for the micro (click) adjustable sight as well). Those are as common as dirt, compared to top-breaks---and there are only two different bases to contend with---both simple.

My best recollection is King started off in 1913---stopped in 1955. The mere fact they lasted that long says they made stuff that sold----enough to keep them going, and enough to facilitate a significant expansion. I know next to nothing of their history besides what I've seen---they started out making sight stuff, and ended up in what I'll call the custom or modified gun business----but still focused on sight stuff.

I have only two guns sporting King products. One carries a "Cockeyed" hammer----likely a "do it yourself" installation product. The second is a complete "Super Target" conversion---most assuredly NOT a "do it yourself" installation product---------unless you have a milling machine and some fancy jigs in your basement.

I had a third---a 3rd Model SS with a King white outline rear blade. Somewhere along the way it fell out----and was gone. That had to be the result of some dummy putting it in incorrectly/incompletely---never mind he knows better. Alas, there's only one person who fits that description. It's poetic justice he had to lay out $50 for a new blade----not a King.

Ralph Tremaine