Smith & Wesson Forum

Go Back   Smith & Wesson Forum > >


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 08-03-2018, 04:57 PM
kennethg kennethg is offline
SWCA Member
Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks  
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Northern California
Posts: 500
Likes: 613
Liked 329 Times in 105 Posts
Default Mystery stocks

I was going through my wood pile and found these stocks. I donít remember when or where I got them. I am not sure if they are for a Single Shot Model of 1891 or a later single shot or a 22/32 Hand Ejector (Bekeart) or a 22/32 Heavy Frame Target. It appears that they might have been used on a pistol that they were not made for. I base this on the fact that there are 5 spacers on each of the stocks at the bottom. Any help will be greatly appreciated. Also, any idea of value?
Thanks in advance,
Attached Thumbnails
Mystery stocks-1-jpg   Mystery stocks-2-jpg   Mystery stocks-3-jpg   Mystery stocks-4-jpg   Mystery stocks-5-jpg  

__________________
Ken
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 08-03-2018, 05:23 PM
murphydog's Avatar
murphydog murphydog is offline
SWCA Member
Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks  
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 18,198
Likes: 39
Liked 7,554 Times in 4,476 Posts
Default

They are 1920s era Target stocks, most likely from a 22/32 Heavy Frame Target but also used on other I frame Target guns of the era (as I recently learned). The spacers are not factory, don’t know why or how they would work?
__________________
Alan
SWCA 2023, SWHF 220
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 08-03-2018, 06:40 PM
JSR III's Avatar
JSR III JSR III is offline
SWCA Member
Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks  
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Massachusetts USA
Posts: 8,253
Likes: 2,988
Liked 6,873 Times in 2,781 Posts
Default

Is there a serial number written on the inside of the right stock panel? If you can make it out it would help determine what gun they were from. Could be a .22/32 HFT from the 1920 to 1930 period when S&W did not install medallions or could be a .32 HE or a single shot. All of these guns could come with these stocks IIRC.

I don't believe that the holes filled with lead at the bottom are spacers but rather added weight. Just a WAG based on looking at photos and not seeing them in hand.
__________________
James Redfield
LM #497

Last edited by JSR III; 08-03-2018 at 11:17 PM. Reason: Ralph was CORRECT. Suffered a CRS moment
Reply With Quote
The Following 6 Users Like Post:
  #4  
Old 08-03-2018, 07:25 PM
rct269 rct269 is online now
SWCA Member
Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks  
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Pikeville, Tennessee
Posts: 2,931
Likes: 160
Liked 3,365 Times in 1,422 Posts
Default

Uh----just so nobody gets confused, what James almost certainly meant to say (instead of just "straightline") was that the stocks will likely also fit any/all of the top break single shot pistols whose barrels run in a straight line, but should not be confused with the other single shot pistol often called a Straight Line, but is more formally referred to as ".22 Single Shot 1922 Model"---which explains why most everybody calls it a Straight Line----and it has flat stocks sorta like an autoloader---'cause that's what it looks like---sorta.

Now---about those spacers: It's probably just the camera angle, but, for the life of me, I can't figure out what it is they space. Of course if James' WAG is right (which it almost certainly is), then I don't need to know anything else----no way---no how.

Ralph Tremaine

Last edited by rct269; 08-03-2018 at 07:33 PM.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
  #5  
Old 08-03-2018, 07:52 PM
chiefbob81's Avatar
chiefbob81 chiefbob81 is offline
Member
Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks  
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Maine
Posts: 220
Likes: 273
Liked 329 Times in 123 Posts
Default

I have tried to find stocks for my 1891 single shot. Difficult to find. Should fetch a nice sum.
__________________
Bob P.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 08-03-2018, 07:55 PM
H Richard's Avatar
H Richard H Richard is offline
US Veteran
Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks  
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: West Central IL
Posts: 17,790
Likes: 8,965
Liked 11,550 Times in 4,944 Posts
Default

I'm with Jim, those holes were probably for weights, possibly some lead shot with some putty to hold it into place. Added weight for the "Target" pistol.
__________________
H Richard
SWCA1967 SWHF244
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
  #7  
Old 08-03-2018, 11:18 PM
JSR III's Avatar
JSR III JSR III is offline
SWCA Member
Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks  
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Massachusetts USA
Posts: 8,253
Likes: 2,988
Liked 6,873 Times in 2,781 Posts
Default

Ralph, absolutely correct. I have edited my post. Meant single shot not straightline. CRS moment.
__________________
James Redfield
LM #497
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #8  
Old 08-03-2018, 11:32 PM
rct269 rct269 is online now
SWCA Member
Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks  
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Pikeville, Tennessee
Posts: 2,931
Likes: 160
Liked 3,365 Times in 1,422 Posts
Default

CRS moment?? Is that the same as an elder moment? I have those every now and then---Boss Lady calls them brain farts.

Ralph Tremaine
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
  #9  
Old 08-03-2018, 11:40 PM
JSR III's Avatar
JSR III JSR III is offline
SWCA Member
Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks  
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Massachusetts USA
Posts: 8,253
Likes: 2,988
Liked 6,873 Times in 2,781 Posts
Default

Ralph, unfortunately I have suffered CRS (can't remember sXXX) for some time. My favorite is when I am working on a project in the house and need a tool from my workshop. I get to the basement, stare at my workbench and ask myself what did I come down here for?????

At least now since I had my little roof collapse and fall at the Maine cabin last summer and suffered a concussion, I can blame that when I forget things.
__________________
James Redfield
LM #497
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
  #10  
Old 08-04-2018, 01:06 AM
Club Gun Fan's Avatar
Club Gun Fan Club Gun Fan is offline
SWCA Member
Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks  
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 4,119
Likes: 1,694
Liked 5,460 Times in 1,625 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rct269 View Post
Uh----just so nobody gets confused, what James almost certainly meant to say (instead of just "straightline") was that the stocks will likely also fit any/all of the top break single shot pistols whose barrels run in a straight line, but should not be confused with the other single shot pistol often called a Straight Line, but is more formally referred to as ".22 Single Shot 1922 Model"---which explains why most everybody calls it a Straight Line----and it has flat stocks sorta like an autoloader---'cause that's what it looks like---sorta.

Now---about those spacers: It's probably just the camera angle, but, for the life of me, I can't figure out what it is they space. Of course if James' WAG is right (which it almost certainly is), then I don't need to know anything else----no way---no how.

Ralph Tremaine
Ralph
Can you show me were any of the Smith & Wesson catalogs or advertisements refer to the ".22 Single Shot 1922 Model" and not the Straight Line? I thought the .22 Single Shot 4th Model was introduced in 1925.
__________________
Don Mundell S&WCA LM614
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 08-04-2018, 10:59 AM
rct269 rct269 is online now
SWCA Member
Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks  
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Pikeville, Tennessee
Posts: 2,931
Likes: 160
Liked 3,365 Times in 1,422 Posts
Default NOT HARDLY!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Club Gun Fan View Post
Ralph
Can you show me were any of the Smith & Wesson catalogs or advertisements refer to the ".22 Single Shot 1922 Model" and not the Straight Line? I thought the .22 Single Shot 4th Model was introduced in 1925.
Absolutely not!! That's because I have no such documents----and it seems unlikely such a convoluted name would ever make it into those documents in the first place---the marketing folks would have had a hissy fit. (And to the best of my knowledge, this pistol was in fact introduced in 1925.) And now, and I may be sorry I asked this, but can you show me any Smith & Wesson catalogs or advertisements which refer to the Straight Line as ".22 Single Shot 4th Model"? I thought that was collector speak. Okay, so much for that.

Sometime before it was introduced it was designed and built--and judging from the results, the marketing folks don't seem to have had much to do with that. Now, to the point of your inquiry, it appears the folks who designed it referred to it as ".22 Single Shot 1922 Model"---that quotation from the engineering changes list shown on pages 234-238 of N&J---Revised Edition. So I didn't make it up---just copied it down---and when I come across something I figure just might be new news (and perhaps even of interest to some folks besides me), I take advantage of the opportunity to let them know about it.

Ralph Tremaine

Last edited by rct269; 08-04-2018 at 11:03 AM.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
  #12  
Old 08-04-2018, 01:35 PM
kennethg kennethg is offline
SWCA Member
Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks  
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Northern California
Posts: 500
Likes: 613
Liked 329 Times in 105 Posts
Default

When I examined these stocks before the initial post I thought there might have been some characters written on the inside of the right stock. It looks more like letter than numbers.
Sorry, no help here.
__________________
Ken
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 08-05-2018, 12:19 PM
rct269 rct269 is online now
SWCA Member
Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks  
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Pikeville, Tennessee
Posts: 2,931
Likes: 160
Liked 3,365 Times in 1,422 Posts
Default

I've speculated here that the strain screw (that in the butt) could be used to vary the pressure exerted by the sear spring, and therefore alter the trigger pull. It made sense at the time, and still does; but the results of a simple test don't---at least not to me. Perhaps we have a mechanical engineer in the crowd who can explain the whys of what's happening. And it's no problem if we don't, 'cause what's happening is still happening.

What's happening is as the strain screw is withdrawn, the trigger pull increases---the exact opposite of we expected (what I expected, at least).

To the specifics: I backed the screw out ten turns from seated. The screw moved approximately .170" (approximately 50% of its threaded portion of approximately .342").

I made four pulls with a Schrader gauge with capacity of 80 ounces. The hammer release occurred between 46 and 52 ounces over those four pulls.

Next, I returned the screw to seated (and made four more pulls). The hammer release occurred between 40 and 42 ounces over those four pulls.

So---moving the strain screw does impact trigger pull, but exactly opposite of what we (I, at least) had in mind.

The moral of this story is leave the strain screw alone.

Ralph Tremaine
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 08-05-2018, 05:20 PM
JSR III's Avatar
JSR III JSR III is offline
SWCA Member
Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks  
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Massachusetts USA
Posts: 8,253
Likes: 2,988
Liked 6,873 Times in 2,781 Posts
Default

Ralph, I will float my thoughts based on what you have observed.

The spring is a shallow curve with hooks on the top end. These hooks engage a T in the action that applies tension to the trigger. With the screw in the full in position the arch of the spring causes the two ends to be closer together. Picture a piece of computer paper laying flat on a table and measuring 11" long. Lift that piece of paper in the middle (representing the strain screw) and the two ends get closer together. As the screw is loosened, the main spring gets longer and applies more lift or tension on the hook end thus raising the trigger pull weight.

The bottom end of the main spring is fixed at the bottom of the frame and cannot move so all movement is directed at the hook end. At least that's how my brain sees it.
__________________
James Redfield
LM #497
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 08-05-2018, 05:46 PM
rct269 rct269 is online now
SWCA Member
Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks  
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Pikeville, Tennessee
Posts: 2,931
Likes: 160
Liked 3,365 Times in 1,422 Posts
Default

Job One: Forget any and everything you know about S&W's (except for the spiffy finish) when it comes to the Straight Line.

Next, forget about any and all leaf springs----with or without hooks.

Finally, get out N&J---go the the patent drawings---find the Straight Line-------------------------and sit and stare.

Sit and stare long enough, and (almost) everything will make sense----and you will see the light!!

And as long as I have this parts list Ernie was king enough to give me, I count four springs---ALL COIL!! And when you back out the strain screw, you decrease the spring pressure---and INCREASE the trigger pull. This is all explained by the expression "Go Figure!".

Ralph Tremaine
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 08-06-2018, 08:11 AM
JSR III's Avatar
JSR III JSR III is offline
SWCA Member
Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks Mystery stocks  
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Massachusetts USA
Posts: 8,253
Likes: 2,988
Liked 6,873 Times in 2,781 Posts
Default

Ralph, I was thinking of revolver main springs. I will get out my copy of N&J and try to edumacate myself.
__________________
James Redfield
LM #497
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Mystery stocks from the Symposium in BR LA lowriderfxr Smith & Wesson Semi-Auto Pistols 0 09-05-2016 01:13 PM
New Set of Mystery Stocks younggun22 S&W Hand Ejectors: 1896 to 1961 3 06-23-2016 12:19 PM
Mystery K frame pre war RB stocks..help? mbliss57 S&W Hand Ejectors: 1896 to 1961 13 03-24-2016 12:25 PM
Mystery K frame stocks.... Holmes375 S&W Revolvers: 1961 to 1980 8 05-27-2015 07:45 PM
Mystery N Frame Stocks ID tnvol44 S&W Revolvers: 1961 to 1980 1 05-25-2015 11:11 PM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
smith-wessonforum.com tested by Norton Internet Security smith-wessonforum.com tested by McAfee Internet Security

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:34 AM.


Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO v2.0.42 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
© S-W Forum, LLC 2000-2018
Smith-WessonForum.com is not affiliated with Smith & Wesson Holding Corporation (NASDAQ Global Select: SWHC)