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08-22-2018, 05:05 PM
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1st Model Schofield
I am researching a 1st Model Schofield. US on toe of butt, SN 415, cartouche on left stock SBL.
If possible, I would like to determine the unit to which this revolver was issued. It would be especially important if issued to a Buffalo Soldier in the 9th or 10th Cavalry.
Would a factory letter provide this information, or is there another source of information? I've had no luck with Google, although still trying.
Thanks in advance for any assistance.
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08-22-2018, 06:04 PM
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The factory records for 1st model Schofields are very difficult to read, so all 1st Model Schofield factory historical letters say the gun was shipped to the US Army at Springfield Armory (and the date the factory invoiced the Army for the shipments) regardless of whether the gun was a military shipped gun, or non-military gun shipped to an individual officer, etc. The archives at Springfield Armory may have info. on where the gun was issued, assuming it was ever issued to troops in the field. A low serial number, like your gun, was probably issued. Springfield Historical Research ( not connected to Springfield Armory ) published four books of records of individual Army unit's small arms, and listed some Schofields in their inventories, by serial number. Copies of these books are out of print, I believe, but might be found on Ebay or Amazon. Ed.
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08-22-2018, 06:13 PM
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Now that is a S&W to own. I have no answers to your inquiry.
But you will receive a mound of info.
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Mike 2796
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08-22-2018, 07:21 PM
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I did find the notation that 3000 First Models were shipped to the Springfield Armory on July 12, 1875. That led to me believe, as opoefc says, that the factory letter would only show that destination.
I located an expired auction item for a First Model with serial number 603. The auction site (McPheeters Antique Militaria) says "SN 603 falls within the range of specific three-digit serial numbered Schofields known to have been issued to the 9th and 10th Cavalry Regiments." Cited as a source is Arming and Equipping the U.S. Cavalry 1865-1902 by Farrington.
I have ordered a copy of the book. I hope it confirms the revolver in question as a Buffalo Soldier issue.
Alas, it is not my gun. I am inventorying firearms for a museum. The information on file for this one did not identify it as a military purchase nor note the inspector's cartouche, much less the possible 9th or 10th Cavalry provenance.
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08-23-2018, 12:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inusuit
I am researching a 1st Model Schofield. US on toe of butt, SN 415, cartouche on left stock SBL.
If possible, I would like to determine the unit to which this revolver was issued. It would be especially important if issued to a Buffalo Soldier in the 9th or 10th Cavalry.
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Inusuit,
Not sure if this helps or not...Given I didn't find Ser. No. 415 specifically noted in My Data...All of the 3 Digit Serial-Numbered Schofields I found noted (7 in total)...Were issued to F/H Troops of the 9th Cavalry!!
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Masterpiece
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08-23-2018, 02:21 AM
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"I did find information that 3000 1st models were shipped to the Springfield Armory on July 12, 1875" That info. is incorrect. July 12, 1875, is the date S&W invoiced the guns to the Springfield Armory. The guns were shipped weeks earlier in several different shipments, as recorded in the archives at Springfield. They were shipped in crates which were sequentially numbered. In my post above I mentioned the Springfield Research publications. I checked my copies and there is no listing for Schofield # 415.
Army regulations required that whenever there was a change of command in a unit a written inventory of all small arms, by serial number, was done and the new CO then assumed responsibility for those weapons. Military archives can sometimes be located for those change of command inventories but it's hit & miss and a lot of work digging through records at the National Archives in Wash. DC. & at Springfield Armory. It's a very good chance that # 415 did get issued to a military regiment. Does the gun show evidence of use? Are all the numbers matching? Are the stocks numbered to the gun ? Schofields that saw service often are found with non-matching parts, due to replacements, repairs, etc. Ed.
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08-23-2018, 07:38 AM
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I've tried to get the same info on one of the military issued model 3's, and have had no luck. I don't think that info exists.
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08-23-2018, 09:57 AM
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Thanks for the responses. I appreciate your assistance.
Masterpiece: Are you willing to share the source of your data that confirmed seven three-digits issued to the F/H troops?
opefc: Thank you for correcting the sequence of events relating to delivery of the revolvers to the Armory. The gun does show evidence of use. I would rate it at very good antique condition. There are remnants of blue in sheltered places. Most of the revolver has patina. No pitting or rust.
Numbers match. I have not removed the stocks. I will do that today.
I appreciate the information from all who replied.
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08-23-2018, 10:02 PM
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I'm curious why this information contained in the 4 SRS books is so protected. I see them listed for as little as $60 (digital) or as much as $1000. Certainly I would think owners of the books would be willing
to provide serial number lookup to assist those researching a specific model and serial number. I can't see the value of owning the entire set for the sake of a few inquiries. Am I wrong?
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08-23-2018, 10:17 PM
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For $60 I would think that any interested party would be more than happy to acquire the digital version. With a history letter costing $75, the price of $60 seems like a real bargain.
Have you reached out to Charlie Pate? He has done massive amounts of research writing his many books and if he can't answer your questions, he can probably point you in the right direction.
Not sure how to reach him but I am sure someone here could put you in touch.
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08-23-2018, 11:45 PM
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I have kept data bases of Schofield sightings, sales, offers, articles, etc. going back over 100 yrs, if the gun was listed by serial number. That info has been provided to Col Pate for his research. Hopefully he will author a book on Schofields in the future. He has recently done an outstanding job of forensic analysis of Schofield serial number 13 to prove it is a first model non-military revolver ( commercial) and once owned by Cole Younger . Collector's know a few 1st model Schofields left the factory to destinations other that the Springfield Armory.(See Parson's book, etc. ) Col. Schofield is known to have given several revolvers to fellow officers, however no viable records exist on the serial numbers of these guns, except they were most likely very early in the production run, and they were most likely made up from rejected parts. It is believed serial number 6 ( in my collection) may also be one of these non-military Schofields. These few guns do not have the inspectors final approval stamps, as they left S&W before final inspection, however they are made up from parts, some of which will have inspector, or fitters, stamps and will often have the US stamp on the butt, which was applied long before final inspection and is no guarantee the gun passed final inspection, or became a military purchased gun. On the other hand, there are true military Schofields known w/o the US stamp, and no evidence that it was removed. Probably a production oversight. All genuine Wells Fargo Schofields are ex-military. (Schofield, Serial number !, formerly in my collection, now in the national Firearms Museum, is a genuine Wells Fargo gun ) There are second model Schofields, non-military, commercial models listed in the Day Book as shipped to S&W distributors and they do not have the US stamp, but can have parts that have a military inspector's stamp on them. Col. Pate is continuing to collect data on Schofields. His contact info. is listed in the Roster of Members of the S&W Collectors Assoc. and he can provide you a form for listing the markings and correct description on any Schofield. Ed.
Last edited by opoefc; 08-23-2018 at 11:48 PM.
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10-15-2018, 06:42 PM
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I just bought a 1st model schofield serial# 1354. It's beautiful!
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Last edited by gjamison; 10-15-2018 at 06:46 PM.
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