S&W Schofield 1st Model Wells Fargo

flintlockman · #1 08-22-2018, 07:20 PM

I inherited an S&W 1st Model Schofield revolver marked W.F & Co. Ex. The SN is: 1008 and is stamped on the butt in small numbers and in large numbers on the right side of the frame. There is also a US stamped on the butt. The revolver belonged to my Grandfather who carried it while on duty as a bank guard in the 1920s. It appears to have original grips, but they are worn and no cartouche is visible. There is no caliber stamped on the revolver and no model number is stamped either. I'm assuming it is a .45 Schofield based on what I have read. The Schofield is in good condition, but the plating is not. I'm wondering what the date of manufacture was and any other information that might be available. I'm also wondering about the value.

AJ · #2 08-22-2018, 07:24 PM

Will be interesting to see what the experts have to say.

model3sw · #3 08-22-2018, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flintlockman

I inherited an S&W 1st Model Schofield revolver marked W.F & Co. Ex. The SN is: 1008 and is stamped on the butt in small numbers and in large numbers on the right side of the frame. There is also a US stamped on the butt. The revolver belonged to my Grandfather who carried it while on duty as a bank guard in the 1920s. It appears to have original grips, but they are worn and no cartouche is visible. There is no caliber stamped on the revolver and no model number is stamped either. I'm assuming it is a .44 S&W based on what I have read. The Schofield is in good condition, but the plating is not. I'm wondering what the date of manufacture was and any other information that might be available. I'm also wondering about the value.

Please include a close up, well focused and naturally lit, photo of the Wells Fargo stamp.

The correct caliber is ".45 Smith & Wesson Schofield" ... in later years, when commercially produced (late 1800s to about pre WWII) were packaged and produced (in factory packed ammo such as Winchester and others) as just ".45 Smith & Wesson".

From my experience it is in / near a known range, I having 1080 verified as already being stamped Well Fargo and 5" barrel when it was returned to the factory for a nickel finish in July 1945.

I have examined many, Wells Fargo Schofields for authenticity purposes. I found some from the 8xx range to the 12xx range. Not to say this is "it" or the only range (as there are other legit WFS in other SN ranges) just that I've verified more in this range than others, but, the guys that do the better fakes know this, too.

You're in a known SN range but I cannot distinguish the W.F. Markings. Perhaps when you add some better photos, I can give you a bit more hope.

The bad news .,, there are more fake Wells Fargo Schofield that genuine Wells Fargo Schofields. Further, it may not be a completely fair statement right now from this one, poor photo, but I'm leaning towards "fake" at this moment but that could change when you post and / or send me higher quality digital images.

Up until the late 1970s a 5" Schofield marked Wells Fargo was worth less (by about 1/3) than the same 5" Schofield that was had NO Wells Fargo markings.

In the 1980s the values of the 2 were about equal. Then in the early 1990s through 2000s (and until today) the Wells Fargo marked are worth more (in some cases, significantly more) than a similar quality 5" unmarked, provided the Wells Fargo markings are authenticated and other criteria is met. This can only be ascertained by a thorough physical examination by one of very few people who are Wells Fargo Schofield aficionados (I won't "say" experts but that's what is required). In the S&WCA there are only about 5 of us left alive that have the qualifications and experience to do so.

It is in the early 1990s that the fake Wells Fargo markings started to show up in epidemic proportions.

There is much more to verifying a true Wells Fargo than just examining the outer stamping on the barrel as many were rather cheesy looking, however, some of the fake stamps are rather impressive.

The edit in the Blue Book of Gun Values ... to beware that there are more fake Wells Fargo Schofields than genuine Wells Fargos ... that was my edit and contribution to the Blue Book of Gun Values in about 1995 or so.

Feel free to email me from the link here in my profile, if you'd like.

R.S. "Sal" Raimondi, Sr.

flintlockman · #4 08-22-2018, 08:44 PM

I took the best photo I could with my I-phone, the only camera I currently have at my disposal here. I should note that as I mentioned, this was my grandfathers revolver and he passed away in the early 1980s and the revolver has been in my possession since.

model3sw · #5 08-22-2018, 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flintlockman

I took the best photo I could with my I-phone, the only camera I currently have at my disposal here. I should note that as I mentioned, this was my grandfathers revolver and he passed away in the early 1980s and the revolver has been in my possession since.

yes, you did.

No offense to you nor anyone else but it seems many or most of old S&W that show up here of those that could be a treasure find, are usually someone's grandfather's gun just coming out of an old drawer or cabinet somewhere where it had been lost to time.

Further, it is usually presented by someone brand new to the forum who we do not know.

Regardless of all that whether the background story is a Wyatt Earp gun or Joe the bartender's gun ... all we have is the physical evidence of the firearm to examine, void of any stories that may accompany it to fairly evaluate it and the authenticity, unless you have verifiable linage and historical evidence to support it.

flintlockman · #6 08-22-2018, 09:12 PM

I have no documentation or anything else other than the gun itself and what I've been told. I'm not intending to sell it since it has been in my family for probably a century or more. I have no idea when my grandfather obtained it, both my father and grandfather have passed on.

model3sw · #7 08-23-2018, 07:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flintlockman

I have no documentation or anything else other than the gun itself and what I've been told. I'm not intending to sell it since it has been in my family for probably a century or more. I have no idea when my grandfather obtained it, both my father and grandfather have passed on.

I put in a request to Col. Charles Pate, US Army (Retired), the author, to ask if he has records on 1008.

BAM-BAM · #8 08-23-2018, 07:49 AM

flintlockman..... don't take offense...if you hang around here for awhile.... you will hear the expression....."Buy the gun, not the story!"

Anyway that's a coool family heirloom...... I'd shadow box mount it with as much of the 'history' of the gun as you know ...... before it gets lost over time and a family member in 2048 asks "Where did this come from?"

H Richard · #9 08-23-2018, 08:57 AM

Welcome, I'd keep it clean and dry and not do anything to "clean it up". Keep it as original as it currently is. As Sal mentions there are only a handful of "experts" capable if verifying authenticity as some of the "fakes" have been done by real artists and are difficult spot. Hang in there, and with enough good close up pictures and confirmation of shipping dates I think you will get a affirmative answer.

raljr1 · #10 08-23-2018, 09:43 AM

Nice. If it had been my grandfather's I wouldn't give two hoots if it was counterfeit or not , it would be priceless....i agree that you should gather as much history as you csn to keep with it.

Robert

mg357 · #11 08-23-2018, 09:51 AM

That is a nice s&w Schofield I suggest that you obtain a factory letter from s&w they would be able to obtain more information on it from their archives.

opoefc · #12 08-23-2018, 02:03 PM

Factory letter on a 1st model Schofield will tell you nothing of value, as the records are unreadable, so the letters just say the gun was shipped to the Springfield Armory and the date the Armory was invoiced, not the shipping date, and S&W has no records that reflect any Wells Fargo usages. Your WF & Co. stamp is genuine in my opinion, being one of two known valid styles of stamps. Wells Fargo auctioned off their armory in approx. 1924 in NYC, as I recall. That auction list, by serial number, has been very helpful in validating Schofields ( and many other WF&Co firearms ) . I have a copy somewhere in my files, if I can locate it, i will post it later on. Ed.

flintlockman · #13 08-23-2018, 04:40 PM

I went ahead and sent $75.00 and photos to the Smith & Wesson Historical Foundation. I'll see what comes back. I'm almost positive the Wells Fargo stamp is genuine since the revolver has been in my family for so long. The last time it was shot was when my Dad and I both shot it when I was around 12 years old and that would have been in 1961. I remember the date because that was the same day I received my first rifle as a present, a .303 Enfield Jungle Carbine.

AJ · #14 08-23-2018, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by model3sw

I put in a request to Col. Charles Pate, US Army (Retired), the author, to ask if he has records on 1008.

Flintlockman, don't take any offense to anything here. This forum has seen a lot of things from the original pieces , to out & out fakes and the totally unexplained. Sal an expert has asked for assistance from an authority on these. Be glad he has taken interest.

No matter, I would shadow box the revolver and put the information on the back for future generations of your family. That it has been in your family for this long is great. Enjoy it.

model3sw · #15 08-23-2018, 05:21 PM

Col. Pate responded to my inquiry. He has no records on Schofield SN: 1008 which means, it has not shown up in his "radar" yet. He'll be checking in here to take a look.

gordonrick · #16 08-23-2018, 05:25 PM

Dang! Shooting a family heirloom with Dad AND getting a Jungle Carbine. A fine day indeed!

Larry Weinbrenner · #17 08-23-2018, 05:46 PM

Well, I can understand your excitement about the S&W but must understand the real world concerning collecting antique firearms which has it dark side & can be costly if not careful. There are those wanting a quick buck will either cobble together an original in good shape w/ a collectors value, or if he is talented, can put together parts of different firearms, restamped the numbers, age it then mellow the finish. Either way, the buyer pays big bucks for a weapon that most collectors will shun. It is possible your W/F' s legit, but only a well versed collector can really tell. It is a shame there are charlatans lurking out there but they are in every place where big money is. The S&W is correct as it was issued to the army & is an early number & is a shame it was chopped to be reborn as a W/F if it is the case. You would be surprised as to the number of W/F marked weapons offered for sale. If possible borrow a camera or ask a friend to take clearer photos. !st model Schofields are more in demand than the 2nd models but most were rode hard & put up wet wet & just not many out there. If you letter it, it will only show it issued to the military. Charlie Pate sure could shed more light on it.

jw mathews · #18 08-23-2018, 10:09 PM

Very interesting thread. To Flintlockman: Welcome to the Forum. I think most readers of yr post will understand that you are not an advanced collector & just want to find out info about your Grandpa's revolver. The Schofield design has an interesting history which is described in various books about S&W and other threads in this forum.

When that model was first made to fill a small US Army contract, the Army had already purchased a large quantity of Model 1873 Colt Single Action Army (SAA)/"Peacemaker" revolvers, using the .45 (Long) Colt Cartridge. Daniel B Wesson did things his own way & the cylinder of the Schofield was too short to accept the Colt ammo, requiring a special round of its own. As you might imagine, this created a logistics problem for the Army which led to the Army disposing of those guns after but a few years' service.

The Army revolvers had 7" barrels and were blued. Wells Fargo bought a number of those guns, had the barrels cut to 5" and the guns nickel-plated. So those altered Schofields are very much desirable collectibles--IF they are original as opposed to fakes that were not included in the guns actually purchased by WF.

It would be interesting to know the name of the bank that employed your grandfather as a guard. If there was some record in your family that showed he worked for Wells Fargo, that might add "provenance" & make it more likely that the gun could be an authentic WF version.

I understand that you have no wish to sell it because of its meaning to yr family, but if the gun can be authenticated as genuine, it becomes far more valuable (for insurance purposes if for no other reason).

model3sw · #19 08-23-2018, 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by opoefc

Factory letter on a 1st model Schofield will tell you nothing of value, as the records are unreadable, so the letters just say the gun was shipped to the Springfield Armory and the date the Armory was invoiced, not the shipping date, and S&W has no records that reflect any Wells Fargo usages. Your WF & Co. stamp is genuine in my opinion, being one of two known valid styles of stamps. Wells Fargo auctioned off their armory in approx. 1924 in NYC, as I recall. That auction list, by serial number, has been very helpful in validating Schofields ( and many other WF&Co firearms ) . I have a copy somewhere in my files, if I can locate it, i will post it later on. Ed.

Ed, when you find that list can you either email me or snail-mail me a copy ?

This one, 1008, is in a known Wells Fargo SN range, so, it has that plus working for it, however, I found the only sure way to validate a Wells Fargo Schofield is to dismantle it to examine internal markings that S&W factory did not mark but Wells Fargo armorers did. I feel very strongly about this.

I have seen some very impressive W.F. Ex & Co markings that presented well but failed other criteria.

I don't publish this lesser known research for fear that this data, too, may fall into the wrong hands but I do share with tenured members. But someone I had shared this data with, years ago, felt the need to publish some of the lesser known secrets of a more in-depth verification of WF EX &Co identification I shared with him. (( I'm still ticked about that )).

I have a quick test of my own, I can do from the outside, without dismantling. If that one quick test doesn't check out it is likely not authentic and there is no need to go any further. If that one quick test does check out, I would go further to dismantle it, to more thoroughly examine & document / verify, accurately.

Charlie has no records on 1008 so he's going to pop in to take a quick look but he will likely ask for much better quality digital images than those supplied. Charlie will most likely also ask for all the other standard Schofield criteria and inspectors' stamps (As & Ps etc.), cartouche, etc.

opoefc · #20 08-24-2018, 12:08 AM

1st model Schofields are one of the few S&Ws that the markings & stampings, and their location are not as important as the markings and stamping that are NOT there, and that fact extends to the WF&Co. armorers's marking that Sal refers to, which I believe were probably applied when Wells Fargo received the original 7 inch barreled Schofields from military surplus and cut the barrels to 5 inches. See my dissertation under insult's posting on this Forum. Ed.

merl67 · #21 08-24-2018, 03:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flintlockman

I went ahead and sent $75.00 and photos to the Smith & Wesson Historical Foundation. I'll see what comes back. I'm almost positive the Wells Fargo stamp is genuine since the revolver has been in my family for so long. The last time it was shot was when my Dad and I both shot it when I was around 12 years old and that would have been in 1961. I remember the date because that was the same day I received my first rifle as a present, a .303 Enfield Jungle Carbine.

303 Enfield Jungle Carbines have to be the loudest guns on the planet lol.

flintlockman · #22 08-24-2018, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by merl67

303 Enfield Jungle Carbines have to be the loudest guns on the planet lol.

And terrible recoil as well. The combination of light weight and the fact that the rubber pad on the butt is now as hard as rock limits the shooter to a few rounds before it ceases to be fun. It is very accurate, however.

flintlockman · #23 08-24-2018, 04:35 PM

I will try to take some better photos, especially some close-up photos of all of the markings on the Schofield. As surmised, I am not an advanced collector, although I have accumulated some fair to good condition firearms from the 1800s, including a Manhattan pepperbox, a Manhattan boot pistol, a Remington 1858 .44 (I shoot in matches), a Remington Beals .36, a Colt Pocket Revolver with 6" barrel in presentation case, and some others as well, including several original flintlock and percussion rifles. I also have an S&W .32 Bicycle revolver in good condition. Back in the 60s, a wino approached me on the street in Atlanta and asked if I wanted to buy a pistol. At first I told him to leave me alone, then I asked what he had. He pulled it out of a paper bag. He wanted $50.00 for it, but I only gave him $10.00. I took it to the police and had the serial number checked to see if it was stolen - it wasn't. It is in relatively good condition with the original grips. I've shot it several times. I should probably take some photos of that revolver as well, and post them.

flintlockman · #24 08-24-2018, 08:16 PM

I have now taken some more photos with a Canon EOS Rebel T4i camera. Hopefully they are better, but I'm not a professional photographer. I have uploaded the first five photos. The following is the text in each photograph if it isn't clear.

1. US, 1008
2. L, P
3. 700 P, P
L
4. SMITH & WESSON SPRINGFIELD MASS USA PAT. JAN 17th
& 24th 65 JULY 11th 65 AUG 24th 69 JULY 25th 72

I'll upload the others in a few minutes.

flintlockman · #25 08-24-2018, 08:25 PM

These are the rest of the photos I took of the Schofield revolver.

1. W.F. & CO. EX. 1008 (1008 is very large)
SCHOFIELD'S PAT. APR. 22 1873

Hopefully, these photos will assist in identifying this revolver.

opoefc · #26 08-24-2018, 10:24 PM

"Hopefully, these photos will help in identifying this revolver " I don't think identification presents any problem. As said above, the gun is a Smith & Wesson 1st model Schofield, ser. # 1008. It has seen heavy use, has been finished at least once long ago and is a Well Fargo & Co, Express surplus revolver. Further disassembly will reveal more stampings of fitters & inspector's marks, and if you remove the barrel latch, screw & cylinder, you should find 1008 stamped on them. Ed.

JSR III · #27 08-25-2018, 08:11 AM

Quote:

When that model was first made to fill a small US Army contract, the Army had already purchased a large quantity of Model 1873 Colt Single Action Army (SAA)/"Peacemaker" revolvers, using the .45 (Long) Colt Cartridge. Daniel B Wesson did things his own way & the cylinder of the Schofield was too short to accept the Colt ammo, requiring a special round of its own. As you might imagine, this created a logistics problem for the Army which led to the Army disposing of those guns after but a few years' service.

Welcome to the forum and that was quite an entrance.

From what I have read over the years the founders had no love loss for their largest competitor from Connecticut. They were known for not producing arms in popular calibers if the name contained the word COLT. This effort may have cost them over the years especially with the Army. Things were also as political back then as they are now and if the General that was buying arms for the military happened to be a fan of COLT then S&W was out of luck.

Hopefully your gun will be found to be correct. The fact that Charlie Pate has never heard of it could actually be a good thing. Had the serial number surfaced years ago and found to be a non Wells Fargo gun then that would be the end. Since no one has seen or heard of the gun it lends credence to the fact that it has lived in a sock drawer for many years and hasn't had the opportunity to be messed with.

model3sw · #28 08-27-2018, 10:29 PM

Col. Pate responded to say:

(Start) "There are two types of Wells Fargo letter markings and three sizes of numbers. The placement of the letter marking makes it look a little different but the style and size are right."

"This gun has the middle size numbers and the dies used match those I’ve seen on other guns that I think are right. Ask if the “US” is there. I could not see it in the photo." (end)

ME: could you post a nice clean shot off the butt where the serial number is and the U.S. should be.

My very best and congrats on that find. I was hoping it was a good one for you, but, my suspicions were not unwarranted.

The known Wells Fargo SN range was the most inspiring to me. Col. Pate giving it his blessing is even better, in fact, you can't get any better than Col Pate.

Naturally, this is a valid statement from the world's foremost authority but based on photos. If you're going to insure it, you'll need to get it more formally authenticated, but, if not ... you're clean and green.

flintlockman · #29 08-28-2018, 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by model3sw

Col. Pate responded to say:

(Start) "There are two types of Wells Fargo letter markings and three sizes of numbers. The placement of the letter marking makes it look a little different but the style and size are right."

"This gun has the middle size numbers and the dies used match those I’ve seen on other guns that I think are right. Ask if the “US” is there. I could not see it in the photo." (end)

ME: could you post a nice clean shot off the butt where the serial number is and the U.S. should be.

My very best and congrats on that find. I was hoping it was a good one for you, but, my suspicions were not unwarranted.

The known Wells Fargo SN range was the most inspiring to me. Col. Pate giving it his blessing is even better, in fact, you can't get any better than Col Pate.

Naturally, this is a valid statement from the world's most foremost authority but based on photos. If you're going to insure it, you'll need to get it more formally authenticated, but, if not ... you're clean and green.

Thanks very much to everyone that has helped me with this revolver. I knew it had to be legitimate, based on the very long time the Schofield was in my family. I'll try to take a photograph of the butt that shows the US and the S/N clearer. The US is partially worn off. The SN on the butt is very clear, but is very small size and difficult to see without the use of a magnifying glass, at least for my eyes. My wife has no trouble reading it without any assistance.

flintlockman · #30 09-04-2018, 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by model3sw

Col. Pate responded to say:

(Start) "There are two types of Wells Fargo letter markings and three sizes of numbers. The placement of the letter marking makes it look a little different but the style and size are right."

"This gun has the middle size numbers and the dies used match those I’ve seen on other guns that I think are right. Ask if the “US” is there. I could not see it in the photo." (end)

ME: could you post a nice clean shot off the butt where the serial number is and the U.S. should be.

My very best and congrats on that find. I was hoping it was a good one for you, but, my suspicions were not unwarranted.

The known Wells Fargo SN range was the most inspiring to me. Col. Pate giving it his blessing is even better, in fact, you can't get any better than Col Pate.

Naturally, this is a valid statement from the world's foremost authority but based on photos. If you're going to insure it, you'll need to get it more formally authenticated, but, if not ... you're clean and green.

I have finally been able to take a good shot of the butt. The problem earlier was me - I'm still using the same camera.

flintlockman · #31 09-23-2018, 11:35 AM

Well, everyone that told me that sending $75.00 to the Smith & Wesson Historical Foundation was a waste of money was correct. I can't believe that S&W does such a poor job. The certificate I received is obviously just a standard form for the pistol. The certificate doesn't even reference the serial number of the revolver. I should have listened.

JSR III · #32 09-23-2018, 12:07 PM

Smith and Wesson does not do the letters, Roy Jinks does them through the S&W Historical Foundation. Unless there is something unique found, many times a letter only verifies that the gun shipped on a given date with a given barrel length and a given finish. If the gun that you have in your hand matches that configuration then you know that your gun is still as it was shipped from the factory. To many collectors that information is critical.

Not every gun comes back as having shipped to Jesse James. If that is what you seek then you are better off not requesting a letter.

DesmoEd · #33 09-23-2018, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flintlockman

Well, everyone that told me that sending $75.00 to the Smith & Wesson Historical Foundation was a waste of money was correct. I can't believe that S&W does such a poor job. The certificate I received is obviously just a standard form for the pistol. The certificate doesn't even reference the serial number of the revolver. I should have listened.

My experience has been great with Roy's letters and I consider them still a bargain at $75 vs having anything lettered thru Colt.

Every letter I have received states something to the effect "we have researched your revolver serial number xxxx" so I dont understand how yours could not have the serial number mentioned.

opoefc · #34 09-23-2018, 01:26 PM

Like I think I said above, a factory letter for a 1st Mod. Schofield will only give the date the factory invoiced the US Gov't for the revolvers, not the date the gun was shipped, as the records are too old to reliably read, so Roy Jinks uses the invoice date as the shipping date. Not a big problem. The actual day the gun left the factory to go to the Springfield Armory was probably a couple weeks earlier than the invoice date. The Springfield Armory archives note the dates each crate of Schofields arrived at the Armory. Having said all that, there's something odd about whatever document you received from the SWHF, if it didn't show the gun's serial number. Can you post a photo of the document ? Ed.

JSR III · #35 09-26-2018, 08:09 AM

Roy Jinks has probably forgotten more about Smith and Wesson's than most of us here know. Having his signature on a letter alone is worth the $75. Everything else is merely the icing on the cake....

I agree with Ed and DesmoEd, I find it unusual for the serial number not to be mentioned in the letter. Please post a photo of all pages of the letter for us to see. If the letter is truly incomplete then there are remedies.....but we need to see it.

Club Gun Fan · #36 09-26-2018, 09:45 AM

Gary
Email me a copy of the letter we did for your Schofield sn 1008. I'm meeting with Roy tomorrow and I'll check into why the letter didn't contain the serial number. Send it to me at [email protected].
Don Mundell
Assistant Historian Smith & Wesson Historical Foundation.

flintlockman · #37 09-26-2018, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Club Gun Fan

Gary
Email me a copy of the letter we did for your Schofield sn 1008. I'm meeting with Roy tomorrow and I'll check into why the letter didn't contain the serial number. Send it to me at [email protected].
Don Mundell
Assistant Historian Smith & Wesson Historical Foundation.

Thanks for responding. I have attached a copy of what I received. As you can see, there is minimal information and no reference of a serial number.

andy52 · #38 09-26-2018, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flintlockman

Well, everyone that told me that sending $75.00 to the Smith & Wesson Historical Foundation was a waste of money was correct. I can't believe that S&W does such a poor job. The certificate I received is obviously just a standard form for the pistol. The certificate doesn't even reference the serial number of the revolver. I should have listened.

Would it be possible for you to scan and post a copy of the letter?
I've never gotten a letter from Roy that didn't reference the Ser#.

andy52 · #39 09-26-2018, 03:56 PM

Sorry you posted as I as writing.

andy52 · #40 09-26-2018, 03:57 PM

Was there a second page?

flintlockman · #41 09-26-2018, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andy52

Was there a second page?

No second page. What I posted was what I received.

andy52 · #42 09-26-2018, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flintlockman

No second page. What I posted was what I received.

I'm only conjecturing here but I think there was a second page that may not have been placed in the envelope. I've gotten many letters from Roy and most of them are two pages long.
The subject of your Scofield has already been presented to Roy in the SWCA forum. The letter you posted is just a introductory page for the model. Lets see what might be done with this before you get to discouraged.

Doc44 · #43 09-26-2018, 04:54 PM

What you received was the first page of a two page letter. The second page was apparently left out of the envelope. My advice is return the letter to Mr. Jinks, explain what you received, and you will receive a complete, two page letter in the mail. Roy always initials the first page of a letter, but signs the second page with his full signature.

Bill Cross
S&WCA
S&WHF

andy52 · #44 09-26-2018, 05:00 PM

The reason I'm saying that this most probably is the issue is that there is no signature on the page you posted I have never received a letter from Roy that didn't have one. Here are a couple of his letters as reference. Notice the first page only has his initials on it the second has a signature.

andy52 · #45 09-26-2018, 05:04 PM

Sorry Bill I was writing as you posted.

flintlockman · #46 09-26-2018, 05:11 PM

I still have the envelope the certificate arrived in. I checked to make certain that there wasn't a second page still in the envelope. There wasn't. Hopefully, you are correct and I just didn't receive the second page.

JSR III · #47 09-26-2018, 09:32 PM

I would be willing to bet that there is a missing page. Having been in Roy's office doing research on the .22/32 HFT's I can tell you that it is one busy and hectic place. Roy does letters and answers emails and phone calls at the same time. I would guess that he was interrupted while doing your letter and the second signature page did not get included.

Very easy fix.

opoefc · #48 09-26-2018, 10:42 PM

You're missing the 2nd page. Stuff happens, however all it will tell you (when it catches up with you) is the serial number, finish, and when S&W invoiced the Gov't for the 1st Model Schofields, not when it was shipped. That's the best Roy can do, as the records are unreadable, he says. Archives at the Springfield Armory, or the National Military Archives will have info. on the delivery at Springfield Armory of the Schofield shipments and the date serial number 1008 was received from S&W. Ed.

flintlockman · #49 09-27-2018, 10:41 AM

I was just notified that indeed the second page was missing and that a copy will be forwarded to me. I feel better that what I received isn't the only thing I paid for.

Kinman · #50 10-06-2018, 12:52 PM

Congratulations and welcome to the forum goes out to the OP, my continued respect and closeted admiration for the rest of you guys has again given me more reason to believe in the overall goodness of my fellow man. Well done sirs...