Is it possible to remove the base pin/arbor from the barrel of a 2nd Model .38 Single Action? I am in the process of rebuilding one that has a split barrel and I would like to use the base pin to install in another barrel I have that is lacking the base pin. Has anyone done this or have suggestions? Thanks.

The good news is I'm sitting and staring at the schematic in Chicoine's Antique Firearms Assembly/Disassembly book, and the base pin is illustrated as separate part. The bad news is he makes no mention of it in his instructions for the disassembly of the barrel---treating only with the barrel catch, its cam and spring. So much for that.

I have disassembled only large frame single actions, and have never had the need to remove/replace the base pin----nor to even think about it. Now that there's a need to think about it, I think it must be pressed into place (that being the first and only answer that comes to mind). I'm also inclined to think/believe it's pressed into a blind hole---just to complicate your life. The only remedy for a do-it-yourselfer that comes to mind is to remove the barrel from the pin (considering the fact the barrel is already damaged, it shouldn't make any difference if it comes off in pieces).

If this was my problem, I'd be in touch with Chris Hirsch (Google Chris S gunsmith) a gunsmith (A WIZARD!!) in Texas who works only on antiques, would seem to specialize in S&W's (or at least does work for David Carroll) and who performed a rather difficult task for me in such fashion as to defy detection---and did it pretty much immediately, and didn't charge hardly anything.

Ralph Tremaine

The base pin on the top breaks is threaded into the barrel. The threading is very fine and after 120 plus years the pins are literally frozen in place. The proper tool used to remove the pin is an insert that expands when tightened. Once it's locked in place (inside the base pin) you basically and carefully unscrew the base pin. Often this requires heat application. It's similar to an easy out but not the same.

DO NOT attempt to apply a wrench to the outside of the pin to unscrew it. The pin will collapse like crushing a tin can.

So, without the special tool , a gunsmith is required to remove the pin safely. Since the barrel is split you can always carefully cut the pin out. However, you still need to install it into the new barrel. That's also a problem since the pin must line up perfectly in order for the cam to operate. So you would again need the tool to install the pin correctly.



Murph

Here's a photo of a couple S&W base pins removed. You can see the threading and the cut out that has to line up perfectly for the cam to function.

To be perfectly honest, since you are "building" a gun, why not just purchase another barrel with the pin still on it? They are not hard to find. Most of the double action barrels will fit and function on the single action frame. To have a gunsmith perform the replacement would cost at least twice what a replacement barrel with pin would cost. At least.

I have a couple put togethers that are shooters in my collection. You can get a couple different barrel lengths and put them in a wood box for the range. You can change a barrel on these top breaks in about 3-5 mins "at the range". Even faster if you have a complete barrel/ cylinder assembly.

Murph

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Say,
I think the forum would appreciate a couple photo's of your project gun....Also some photo's of the "split" barrel would be very interesting if you don't mind?

Murph

Hi Ralph. Thanks for the input. Yes, Chicoine’s books are great but as you pointed out, don’t discuss removal of the base pin. Like you I had never considered it until now.
Murph, thanks for the information, very interesting. Here’s the back story. I have three Baby Russians and four 2nd models including the subject gun along with various spare parts I’ve picked up along the way. The subject gun (first pic) was obtained at a good price not long ago. The lockwork mechanics are good but it had quite a bit of endshake and some excess rotational play with the cylinder. The bore was pretty pitted but shootable. Replacing the barrel and or cylinder with parts from a .38 DA was Plan A as I have a S&W barrel that is fully machined, D&T’d, etc but never installed on a gun (2nd pic). It has an immaculate bore and since it had never been fitted to another gun, I figured it would be a good candidate. Unfortunately, it does not have the base pin. But it was only $12 so I had picked it up somewhere just to have on hand. I’ve been looking for a decent .38 DA barrel with the base pin but haven’t found one for sale lately. Also among my spare parts was a .38 SA 2nd Model barrel and cylinder. This is the barrel that shows a significant crack at the bottom of the forcing cone above the base pin. The crack or split extends into the bore at least ¼”, maybe further. It’s difficult to photograph but I think you can see it in the photo. The bore is pretty rough. It was part of a complete parts set (less frame) I bought primarily for the lockwork and other parts. So not as yet having found a decent barrel with the base pin, I thought about pulling the base pin from the cracked barrel to install on the “new” DA barrel. Which takes us to my original post.

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Thanks for posting the photo's.

That's a very late barrel having the front sight integral with the barrel. It should work I guess but installing a base pin "requires" the correct tool. They aren't cheap.

That blown forcing cone is typical from hot smokeless loads used in an Antique firearm. It can actually be repaired but the base pin would have to be removed to repair it.

It's a tough call for you I guess. If it was me I would just continue searching for a replacement barrel with the pin still on it. The gun shows should start opening up soon.

Parts for the top breaks are very common. It won't take long for one to show up with the pin still on the barrel. It's just a bad time right now with limited access to shows etc.


Murph

Thanks for the reply Murph. Actually, I'm a little surprised I haven't found another barrel yet as, as you said, top break parts aren't usually too difficult to find. Was hoping to find one at the Wanenmacher Show in Tulsa in November (I have a table there with a couple of friends) but it was cancelled...again. Maybe the April show will happen. The shows around here aren't much use; very small and not much antique stuff. I'll keep perusing ebay, gunbroker, etc. One will show up eventually. I'll post the results when I find one.

I believe I have seen somewhere, that the 1891 single shot barrels will fit these models also?