Hello
I reconnect to the very interesting thread on the phantom James gang's Schofield, but I open another otherwise I would be off topic.
OPOEFC claims to have been in possession of a New Model n 3 Target in .45 s&w, and there is no reason to doubt it.
But in the SCSW (second edition) this version would not seem to have been chambered for the .45 s&w. Am I wrong?
However, there was an S&W shipment to Winans of 22 of these weapons.
... were they New Model n 3 standard model, or target model? Of course, the caliber is not specified, nor the date of shipment. Does anyone know anything more precise about this expedition.
And finally another curiosity. Why did Winans use this cartridge instead of the .32 or .38 built specifically for the New Model Target?

Giorgio

Never heard of Mr Winans shooting .45.
The legend I have is that he was influential in getting the .38 Target out but eventually went back to .44 Russian.

Giorgio & Jim. The factory letter with Winan's .45 Schofield New Model # 3 Target I posted about listed the caliber as .45. Roy Jinks told me that all S&W NM#3s that were shipped in .45 caliber were only listed as ".45" in the shipping records. Calibers could have been .45 Schofield, .450 Ely .45 Webley, etc. Some times Winans has his revolvers marked ( after market ) with which .45 or .450 round he used in each particular gun. Probably just to avoid confusion at the range. The gun used to shoot the Target in the magazine ad by Hartley had no caliber marked anywhere on the gun, but chambered the .45 Schofield. Some yrs ago, I wrote an article in the S&WCA Journal about that gun. Ed

Here is one of his 45’s that lettered as a 45 Eley.
Here I go again regarding cartridge availability again? But being in London? It makes sense doesn’t it?

Murph

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Very interesting. I am very intrigued by these revolvers and this unfortunate cal .45 cartridge. That's the reason for all these questions of mine!! Maybe Jim Supica knows more about these 4 revolvers shipped in 1890 and if they are in addition to the 22 New Models shipped to Mr. Winans mentioned in his book?
Giorgio

Well, if Mr. Supica's knowledge of such guns is reflected by his display at an NRA Collectors Arms show----Kansas City(?)---way back when, then it's formidable----perhaps even awe inspiring----at least mind boggling!!

Ralph Tremaine

Terrible. You pull out documents like milk from the fridge. Here in Italy I am out of this world ... there are no documents, nothing at all! Weapons - when found - cost like a house. Weapon fairs not even to talk about it! Crazy stuff!!! You enter the last armory on earth and find a K 32 of ‘48 narrow rib. Incredible! Perhaps you do not know that here the 9x19 in semi-automatic weapons is PROHIBITED … we have the 9x21 italian!!!!!! For our law until a few years ago the 9 para was a "war cartridge", six years in prison!!! Now it is ONLY forbidden
Therefore... be patient
G.

Jim
The New Model No. 3 Target played a significant role in Smith & Wesson’s history, since it was the first production model in a target configuration. Target shooting has always played an important role in proving the superior accuracy of a firm’s product and the accuracy of a gun increased its reputation and added to sales. Development of this first target revolver began in 1886. A number of shooters were competing to break the 100-shot record. Among the shooters was Chevalier Ira Paine, who was shooting professionally for Smith & Wesson. He was shooting a standard New Model Number 3, fitted with target sights in .44 Russian caliber. In the latter half of 1887, Paine discussed with the firm, the possibility of a building a New Model No. 3 in a smaller caliber other than the S&W .44 Russian. The President of Smith & Wesson, D. B. Wesson agreed that they could produce a target version in both .32 and .38 calibers. This new target revolver was introduced late in 1887. It was called the New Model Number 3 .32-44 Target or the New Model Number .38-44 Target, depending on the caliber. These were two new gallery or target cartridges developed by Smith & Wesson. The cartridge was so constructed that the bullet, either a picket or round ball type, was completely enclosed within the cartridge case. The serial number series started at serial number 1 and continued until serial number 4333. When it was first introduced, the New Model No. 3 Target was chambered in .32-44 S&W Target, only. The .38-44 came along shortly after. These revolvers were produced in either blue or nickel finish with a 6 inch or 6.5-inch barrel. The front sight, a square cut bead type blade generally of the style designed by Paine and referred to as the “Paine bead front sight, was inserted in a groove cut in the barrel rib and pinned. The target rear sight was adjustable for windage was mounted on the barrel catch. The stocks were round butt checked walnut or checked hard rubber. The hard rubber stocks had the S&W monograms in the stock circles. The walnut stocks were plain, except for the checking.
I hope this helps.
Don

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Don Mundell