Thanks for the info, cflier. It is hard to find much info and it is difficult to determine model number from the various pictures I have found. I wish I knew more info, but my father never talked much about it or used it because he thought it was dangerous. I wonder what he would of thought about my SW40E or a Glock?

I just saw this post while doing some research on my G-Gradfathers police revolver. Any idea of when these were manufactured? Also, need to know how much to insure this for.

Wow you do really nice work!!

__________________
Dom

Nope!! I think it's beautiful Love the turkey grips!

there was (2) safety hammerless SW top breaks at last weekend's gun show here, for $150 each, in very good condition, 32 cal.

last weekend at the gun show I went through several boxes and cans of mixed pistol and rifle ammo that vendors had, old ammo- and picked out all the rifle and pistol ammo that I have guns for. Among it was approx. 150 rounds of mixed 32 SW and 38 SW ammo. Some of it is really old and has copper primers, one is a wooden bullet load, and another looks like a blackpowder load. (probably many are BP loads)

well today I took one of the bullets apart, it was headstamp "Rem-UMC". It had already been fired as a dud, and had a spent primer that didn't go off, with a firing pin mark in the primer. I tried to fire the empty brass with the old primer in one of my guns just to be sure, and sure enough it still would not fire. I weighed the bullet, it was 145 grains- weighted the powder charge, it was 2.5 grains of smokeless powder.

I changed the primer in the shell, and removed 1/2 grain of powder, then put the remaining 2 grains back in, reseated the bullet, and fired that one shot through the 3rd model short barrel "put together" parts gun in previous pictures. Hit a tree at 15 yards no problem.

the soft lead Rem-UMC smokeless loads are probably OK for an SW top break with only 2.5 grains of powder in them. It would help if I knew what type of powder was in the old Rem-UMC 145 grain RN loads. If it was Unique then there's nothing to fear, as I have found "top break" specific loads from very experienced reloaders using 38 SW that state 2.8 grains Unique is ok. If the original powder was Bullseye, that's another story, as they only recommend 2 grains of Bullseye in a top break 38 SW with a 145 grain bullet. I put it at 2 grains just to be safe. Anyone know what powder was used in the original loadings ?

That one round was a real tease, these guns are very fun to shoot and the temptation was there to rattle off 100 rounds today. The kick is mild but firm, and the gun is accurate as heck.

Here's another entry for The Ugliest Top Break...Third Model shipped 5/1891

__________________
Peter #2091

how r u doing i have the same gun i purchased from a friend serial #4145** can u give me any info on it i would appreciate it

Since I've never reloaded, I use commercial ammo, and I do
that sparingly. I know the guns work as intended, and I clean and
wax them periodically.
I didn't see any guns on this thread that looked "ugly", but
I did see some with a ton of character.
TACC1

DA 4th model in .38 S&W, 3 1/4" barrel, shipped in 1900...

She's looking damn nice

I picked up a 5th Model 32 last winter but haven't gotten any pics taken yet.

Mike

These are my break-tops and a cousin. Thanks to the forum members for allowing Merwin an honorary spot.
I should have a Smith & Wesson 4th Model .32 DA soon (days) and will re-post when I get it.
Also the little gold .32 New Departure should get the Jinks letter so many have asked about, any day now.
10/22.

Attached Images

Image014.jpg (110.3 KB, 106 views)

Very nice 10/22!!

Just mine model 1878 New Model 3 Target in .44 Russian.

I love this good revolver. It is very accurate.

Attached Images

P1010779.jpg (28.3 KB, 90 views)

This is sold as an Smith and Wesson aroud 1900.

It is in fact an Belgian product. Look at the original grips.
This is the way to decive people who do know nothing of revolvers in those days.

Attached Images

	P1010758.jpg (32.9 KB, 97 views)
	P1010759.jpg (41.6 KB, 105 views)

Hi,

I have this same pistol. Mine was pasted down from my wife's father from his family. His family was from western Kentucky and lived on the wrong side of the law. Usually as guns for hire for local politicians and merchants. My example is very worn, used and neglected.

Can you tell me more information? Model? Year? Is it worth rehabbing?

Thanks,
Dave

I guess I've let this get out of control....

__________________
Peter #2091

Peter,outstanding gun cabinet,very nicely displayed

Outstanding collection and display. A lot of history in that cabinet!

__________________
Rush

Here's my only antique Smith. Looks a little worn but still locks up tight and shoots pretty good. In my opinion still makes a nice belly gun even today.

Nice pic. Nice knive. Who is the maker?

Thanks for the response! The boot knife was made by a close friend who is very talented.

Is that a 32 New Departure?

Mike

To be honest, I don't know as I'm more of shooter than a collector. I've always called it a "lemon squeezer" and it's in 38.

I think it would be called a 38 New Departure. Here is my 32 New Departure found in Kentucky last year:


Mike

Only reason I am posting this is because I didn't see another one like it in all 32 pages of this old thread! The 320 revolving rifle was similar but this is a 2nd Model American with factory fitted notches on the butt and back of grip frame for a shoulder stock.
I am waiting for S&W letter but per David C. this is one of only 604 shipped from factory this way. Too bad it has seen some abuse and bad gunsmithing in the past...still waiting for Mr. C's opinion on restoration but it was exciting for me to research the gun and find those notches!

Attached Images

	IMG_2435.jpg (73.5 KB, 121 views)
	IMG_2446.jpg (46.4 KB, 102 views)

Hello to any & all;
I'm a new member and not really a collector. I signed up to get more information about an antique pistol passed down to me from my grandfather. I've learned a lot already from pictures and some posts. My pistol is almost exactly like the one in this photo, except that the forward bottom of the handle does not flair out like this one. It is simply rounded off. All else appears to be the same, although virtually all the nickel plating is gone (there are a few small patches still visible here and there). I have seen valuations online that range from $200 to $1500. My question is: what's this pistol worth to a collector? All parts work smoothly, there are no loose or missing screws that I can see. Inside the barrel is very dirty, but you can see rifling grooves. The last patent date on the barrel is 1880 and the serial number on the bottom of the handle is 7850(x). Any information would be appreciated. Thanks!
William1

Hi William,
Welcome to the forum Can you post some pictures so we can see what you have?

Mike

Only recently started collecting pistols, and it will be a poor man's collection, but, I do have this .32 Double Action,4th Model

Heres my first model .32.

Attached Images

S&W New Departure 005.jpg (71.8 KB, 58 views)

This .38 SA 3rd model is stamped "3rd Model" on the side plate.

#13063 was shipped to E.K. Tryon Co. of Philadelphia, PA on Nov. 30, 1892, with a 4 inch barrel, nickel finish and checkered black rubber grips.

Makes me wonder if it was a sample gun for the Tryon Company with the markings on the side plate.







*******Does anyone have an opinion?*******

My opinion is that I don't think S&W knew it as a 3rd. model back in 1892. But I may be wrong on that.
Regards
H. M. Pope

This is a funny one. Take a good look.

Attached Images

P1010756.jpg (35.0 KB, 172 views)

Experimental trigger guard that S&W rejected at the last minute. Actually it looks like a complete gun they rejected.
10/22.

Seems like they would name it as everyone else does, not as 3rd Model, but as New Model #3.
10/22.

But it's not a New Model # 3 so why would they call it that ?.
In fact it's not even an Old Model # 3.
An Old or a New Model # 3 is a much larger frame revolver. It's really a Model of 1891 but not sure if S&W called it a 3rd Model in 1892 ?.
Regards
H. M. Pope

Yeah, I'm sorry about that, I must have been asleep and didn't even read all the post. You are right of course.
10/22.

First through 5th model is a modern classification scheme made up by collectors in the last 40 years to differentiate technical changes in the models. Smith & Wesson never called it a 3rd model when it was in production.
Mark

__________________
Mark Connot

I started my collection with my late uncles .38 top break, a friend of mine gave me the Smith metal sign of the top breaks and I decided I NEEDED one of each, it took a couple years but I got them.

second down is a 1891

I have got the same as Modelof1891 which is in the first 100 with a non standard marking on the barrel.



Nevertheless, we can see that the production was not changed until SN 13063. The third model had been produced until 1911.
It was probably known as "MODEL OF 1891" which is included in the barrel rib marking.
It's clear that the "3 RD MODEL" stamped on Modelof1891's one has not been done by S&W but certainly long after it has been shipped and most probably in the last 40 years after modern classification scheme has been made up by collectors as said by cflier.

Nice under number 100 example!!
Call them 1891's, Modelof91, or .38 SA 3rd Model... that is what they were. As far as what the factory called them is unknown to me. Roy calls it a ".38 Single Action Third Model".

The non-standard markings are also on serial number 1901. I wonder when the standard markings started? Seems as if the short barrel length in the early serial numbers were not marked "Modelof91" from what I have seen.

Terry

Terry,
The factory catalogs of the day called them the
"38 Single Action Model 1891".

The 38 Single Action before the 1891 was called the
"38 Single Action Model 1880".

This is the model that has the spur trigger.
Regards
H. M. Pope

Nice pics on that sign. I realy like that.
Here are a few of my Top Break Smith and Wesson's.

New Model 3 in .44 russian

Model Double Action 1881 also in .44 russian

Model .38 single action in .38 S&W

Attached Images

	ANewmodel31.jpg (28.5 KB, 108 views)
	ASW381.jpg (26.2 KB, 93 views)
	ASW18812.jpg (28.5 KB, 111 views)

This is an Top Break to. It is an Belgian made Levaux in .380 revolver.
Made somewhere 1880.

Attached Images

	ALevaux1.jpg (24.1 KB, 50 views)
	ALevaux2.jpg (25.7 KB, 50 views)

This is what is on the end lable my blued one came in #1901

Figured I'd list my S&W .44 Russian Double Action, which is a 1st year production (1874?) as the serial is below 600!
This one had Red Gutta Percha grips on it and having checked Wikipedia "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gutta-percha" it seems very possible they were oem. Whatever the case, they were on this pistol in 1977 when it came into my fathers' hands!
I am considering selling this one, but don't really know what it's worth realistically.

Terry,
Here are some Photos out of an original S&W catalog. If you wanted to order a 38 Single Action back in the day you would specify if you wanted a 1880 or a 1891 model. Now you know what the Factory called them .

Like others have said, Third Model is a collector thing, not a factory Model.
Regards
H. M. Pope

Attached Images

	Model SA 1880.jpg (27.9 KB, 90 views)
	Model SA 1891.jpg (32.5 KB, 111 views)

Okay guys. I sold a collectors item a while back and have regreted it since. Now I have a chance to buy a breaktop S&W 32 serial #300xxx. It's nickle with pearl grips and looks fantastic in the pics. If it locks up tight with no pitting etc. give me a guesstimate of value. Thanks

S&W top break. #300xxx. I think I've been bit.....