Why do folks convert Heavy Duties to .44 Spl when 3rd and 4th Model HEs are out there? Are they more plentiful in the 4-inch variety? Is the result lighter weight? slimmer? Or is it just because HEs are so hard to find and expensive? Is the conversion to .45 Colt far more common and my perspective is just skewed? I think I'd rather just have a 4-inch HE - surely I'll run into one someday (patience).

Sometimes it a matter of having "the bird in the hand". 4" .44 Specials are less common than 5"ers. If you have a HD, then do the the conversion a little at a time, the price gets spread out. Others want custom sights.

I've owned several .44 Special conversions. My first was done in 1976, when there was no new .44s, and the existing ones were few and far between.

Also, a Bowen conversion can be a real nice piece!!!

Weights will be the same between the conversion and the real deal.

.45 Colt conversions are popular because there were VERY few .45 Colt HEs.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

The 38 HD and the 1926 44 are identical save for caliber.

I guess some people have tons of money to burn and aren't happy shooting hot 38s.

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No life story has happy end.

Prices on 3rd models aren't all that reasonable. A nice one with a 4" tube can easily fetch $1500. Until recently, HDs were out and about for under $500. I'm guessing some of the motivation for such a conversion is economic.

To the earlier poster who said 4th models are available, please let me know the next time you see one. I've spent a lot of weekends at gunshows looking, and to no avail. I've to a 6 1/2 inch, but I lust for a 4" gun. I'd even jump for a 2nd model if it were 4". I do have a nickel 1st model, but I don't even allow others to see it. 4" 44s are pretty nice to own, but everyone wants one.

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Dick Burg

Sometimes a ratty ol' HD can become a dandy usin' revolver...

Before, 38/44 HD .38Spl;


After, converted to .44Spl;


Su Amigo,
Dave

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"IN GOD WE TRUST"

I have to agree with Dick on the relative scarcity of the Fourth Model Military 4". I've very rarely seen one.

Here is the real thing (S 1426xx); no conversion here.

I found it at Tulsa in 2005. Except for a small chip in the base of the left grip, it is a pristine gun with no evidence of ever having been loaded. It shipped March 14,1955 to Rex Firearms, NY.

I think that these guns are usually seen in gold boxes with a stick-on label on the top.

This maroon box is a story in itself. It, like the gun, is in near perfect condition. As you can see there is a stamp (APR 27 1954) in the top and a grease pencil number (123544) on the end label.

In conversations with David Carroll I determined that the maroon box was used by the factory in the '46-'49 period to ship transition guns. Because of the number on the label, the stamp in the top, and the condition, Roy has indicated that this particular box was an "out of style" box that was used to return a repaired 3.5" .357 Mag. in 1954.

Having left the Factory less than a year apart and because of their matching condition they make a striking pair.

Bob

Thanks for the replies. I was hoping Keith44 would chime in - that HD is what got me thinking about it. Keith, who did the conversion? I seem to remember you saying it was done in the 70s? or was that your M27?

Bettis - WOW!; this is at the top of my list (heck, it's all I really want), and I'd settle for a 1st, 2nd, or 3rd model if it was a 4". Like Dick says, so does everybody else (well, almost everybody).

Many years ago I bought a 5" barrel off a s&w model 21. At the time I think I owned a triplelock and a 1950 target both in 6 1/2". Belive I also owned a 7 1/2" colt saa then too. I wanted a shorter barrel.
It took years but I ran into a s&w model 20 4" barrel. It was in fair shape and cheap. Maybe I shouldnt have converted it but I did. A gunsmith friend rechambered the clyinder and screwed on my new barrel. I didnt get it reblued. Here is the result.

I would prefer a four inch and that changes the price considerably, a HD conversion might cost a bit but it would then be a shooter in my mind and I would get my moneys worth out of it. I've seen a couple originals in the last year or so that were very worn with pitting, non-correct grips and other small issues and they were still asking more than a grand and refused to move off of it. Really nice original examples are pricey and IMO are worth it if you can afford to buy, but I could never shoot it. I much prefer the .44 special but also am unwilling to do the deed to the couple HDs that I own.

Keith

Hi
the reason you don't see the 4 inch models in the 44 special is because they only made around 1200 total in all barrel lengths.
If I would guess to the number of ones made in 4 inch it would be
about 300 to 400 hundred. The 6 !/2 model is less than the 4 inch
I would say about 200 to 250 of the 6 1/2 with the rest being the 5 inch.
jim fisher

Thanks for those number estimates, Jim.

When the previous owner of the one that I have showed it to me the conversation went:

He.."Look what I just found!"

I.."Wow, nice HD, looks new."

He.."Look at the hole in the barrel!"

I.."Whoa!!"

At that point he knew that he had me and took everything that I had on my table and pocket.

I wonder how many of us have overlooked a 4th Model thinking that it was just another common Heavy Duty (sorry, Bill)

Bob

You think prewar 4" guns are scarce....try finding a 4" Target!

We only know for a fact there are 2 of them, and the owners are posting to this thread!! Regretfully, Jim's is much nicer than mine.

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Dick Burg

I remember sometime back in the 60s almost buying a nickle 4" fixed sight .44 special new in the box. Would that have been the 4th model you are talking about? This was at a retail gun shop, not a gunshow.
On secound thought it could have been a 5", but I still think it was a 4".

HI
yes the numbers are for the fixed sight 44 specials Known as the model 21
and the nickel models are really rare.
I know of one pinto in 4 inch and thats most likely the only one made.
The fixed sighted prewar 3th models in 4 inch are also pretty rare but I think the numbers are a little more than the post war model 21,s. 4 inch
The transition 44,s in 4 inch are also very rare I have one and have only seen a few others.

Dick thanks for lets us get the two 4 inch Targets together in Ohio
that was great.
jim

It all boils down to what you want, I guess, and what you will pay to get it.

I have only seen ONE 4 inch Third Model .44 Special for sale, in person, in the 35 years I have been chasing S&W's. It was nickel, fixed sights, with modern smooth Target grips. It was priced at $400, a lot in 1976, and I agitated about it for two weeks, until somebody else bought it. I preferred blue and hoped I could find one with adjustable sights. Silly me! I have never even held a S&W 4 inch post-WWII fixed sight .44 Special. There just aren't many out here.

I had Hamilton Bowen convert a pretty good 4 inch .38-44 to .45 Colt. I probably have $2,000 in it and haven't restocked it yet. I did it because I really, really wanted one just like that. With only 12 real ones in the world, no way I could ever get my mitts on one. It's a perfect shooter for me.

I figure that the odds of finding a 4 inch Third or Fourth Model .44 in solid, shootable, presentable shape for under $1,500 may be do-able and with the cost of the gunsmithing and a donor gun right now, it is unlikely I can have a custom one made from a .38 for much less than that. Unless I had the parts and .38 just sitting around already, I can wait for a real one. They do turn up.

If I just needed a shooter, the current Model 21-4 would get me close, fixed sights, ejector rod shroud, 4 inch barrel, but I confess I just like the old ones a whole lot better than the new ones.

Actually, we do see them from time to time. At a gunshow in September I picked up one for $1250, but it had been refinished. Well done, and I wanted it and the 4" nickel T/L that came with it for the same price. Some of us have a soft spot for the guns, and we buy them when we see them.

At the current pace of finding them, I'd guess seeing one every year or two seems to be how well I'm doing. Those who attend more shows probably see more than I do.

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Dick Burg

Yep, I just don't get out enough. Never been to a gun show out of my home state.

I've been to a couple of your Crossroads shows. They're good ones, and some day I'll get to another. I love going to gun shows when I'm on vacation (and I love going to Utah on vacation!! )

There are others here with much more and better experiences than I have. But what I've discovered is each state and show has its own flavors. I guess its what the promoters push. Better still, there are types or kinds of tables I really like. I enjoy the shows where individuals (better known as good ole boys) get a buddy or two and rent a table. Then they empty their junk drawers and cover the table with things to sell. Its where you find the great old grips, grandpa's guns, and other out of production treasures.

Jim, posting above, gets out and about. He lives north of you, but he somehow manages to travel east to the huge Ohio show to exhibit his treasures. Its worth the trip to the OGCA just to see his guns. I'm a 'po boy who likes his guns, Jim is a world class collector who manages to snag the real treasures. We operate in different circles (but we're friends and have mutual friends.) I love the guns that show honest wear, and in my impaired judgement, I have nothing against scoring a great gun with just a little short of abusive wear and tear.

And an honest assessment will reveal I probably spend nearly as much in travel to find my clunkers as Jim pays without all the travel!

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Dick Burg

Yes, I have one and love it, but it's just not the same.