What about these? The Lady Smith came with L frame smooth stocks. The bottom pair came with the 28-2 although I know they are not original; they are very nice wood perhaps cocobolo? I put the T Grip adapter in there and would like to find a correct set for the gun.

But I have never seen either on any S&W so far.

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I just received a letter on my 1957 4 screw pre-29 from Roy Jinks and I am still unclear as to what grips came on my gun. The letter says: "... checkered Goncalo Alves target grips". Would these grips be "Cokes" or in 1957 did the factory ship targets both with and without the slight palm swell? Also, should they be relieved or not? Thanks for your help!

Yes.......cokes and relieved.
"Cokes" is a collector word, not a factory term.

I'd like to say a big Thank you! to everyone who provided info on this topic. It's why I like this forum so much and keep coming back.

"Slaaaaap!" Lynn, aka Beemerrider

In re-reading this entire post , my heads kind of spinning -
There was a period of time from 1948 to 1956 when the .357 magnum Smith & Wesson is known as a "pre-Model 27."
These are my favorite guns in all the world ; my name is Mike and I'm a Luvr of them !
If I don't include the oddball's and rare exceptions to the rule -
what various grips were placed on these "N" frame guns straight from the factory ?

Well the 1948 guns are just too rare to say much about. The basic post war 5 screw 357 had diamond N frame magnas as standard with from about 1950 to 1953 N frame diamond unrelieved targets as optional. The N frame magnas were hand fit to the frame and will bear the SN on the right grip panel when original. Very few if any target grips were ever SN'd to the gun. That unrelieved type is the type on my 357 in a current thread. That grip type was replaced with the relieved diamond N frame target, which was then replaced by the coke bottle type in 1955/56. The cokes were phased out around 1964, in favor of the relieved diamond N frame targets, which were then replaced by the plain non-diamond N frame targets around 1966. You also could have got smooth presentation grips as an option as well as special order grips as extra cost options.

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}-----Jim----->
~SWCA #2732~

Yes. There are no photos on this thread of the earlier service stocks. On those, there is no wood above the stock circle. These went through various changes, too. Before 1910, the stock circle was concave. From about 1910 to 1919, the stock circle had a gold medallion. From 1920 until 1929, there was no medallion and the stock circle was convex. The medallion reappeared in about 1930, but the Magnas came out soon after. By the end of WWII, the service stocks were well on their way out, pretty much replaced by Magnas and, a bit later, Targets.
That is a very brief summary - and there are some exceptions. If I get a chance, I'll try to post some photos later today. Unless someone beats me to it. And there are some examples I won't be able to show, but I have many of them.
Jack

Forgot to add that the Victory Model, during WWII, was kind of a swan song for the service stocks. These, like those on the wartime 1917 military guns, were of the service variety, but with no checkering.

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Jack
SWCA #2475, SWHF #318

Dumb! I failed to look at page 2 of this thread. So I hadn't seen David's nice photos and excellent information. Sorry.

In any case, I hope the details I provided will serve as a good summary, anyway.

Jack

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Jack
SWCA #2475, SWHF #318

another member is asking about period correct stocks for his Pre 27 from 1952 in his new post - I directed him here

My Name is Michael and I am search deficient.

I missed this thread. Thanks Mikeluvr for pointing me in the right direction. My original question is here

Not sure if it would be a double post to also ask it here.

Whoa! What's this? Looks like a 3" 28. Could it be, or is it just perspective?

Also, why do you suppose they didn't make N frame magnas? I think combats are too much of a good thing, and RB magns would look classy. My opinion.

In another thread discussing a rare transitional Model of 1926 .44 Target, Doc44 made an observation of the stocks:

This prompted me to compare the monograms and magna stock medallions of a transitional N-frame (1946 .44) to a 1950 model (1952 .357), and a later N-frame (1954 HP). There is a difference between the transitional and post-1950 "Trade Mark" lettering style on the sideplate mongram, and it appears (to my tired old eye) that all three magna stock medallions are slightly different as well. The transitional stock medallion has a larger "SW" logo on a plain-ish background, the 1952 .357 medallion is more refined with clearly defined ornamentation on a nicely pebbled background, and the 1954 HP is similar but seems a bit muddy and not as crisp as the '52.

I know this is minutiea but discovering and studying small details are part of the fun of collecting.

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Tom in AZ
Respect the Dingbat

I first joined the forum some time ago, but posted only once. I fear I'm too uninformed to make any intelligent commentary, so I've sort of "lurked" in the background, occasionally reading posts that I found interesting, but never having the nerve to ask a question. However, I have a 3rd Model Hand Ejector, Model of 1926, that according to the S&W historian was sold in a lot to Wolf and Klar in 1930. It's engraved (and the real reason I got my nerve up was that I found a picture of similar engraving on a thread about that particular model), nickel plated, but instead of the usual after-market grips, it has bone grips. The gun found its way to Hinton, Oklahoma somehow, and my Grandpa owned it for some years. He told the story (and he told LOTS of stories) that Oklahoma Highway Patrol trooper, Dan Combs, occasionally borrowed the gun for exhibitions and lectures, and always returned it cleaned and oiled with two boxes of hand-load wadcutters.
OK, there it is. Now, what I'd really like to know is how to post pictures to this forum. I can't find any instructions on the site, so someone please help me, and I'll show you what this old gun looks like. The finish isn't pristine, but it's still a good shooter, very solid and as accurate as its operator. (with tri-focal lenses, that is to say, nominal) Help, please.
ProfSkip4212 (retired college professor, decidedly out of step with most of that ilk)

I have always speculated that Perhap's Albert Gagne may have been the Original driving force behind the Birth of the Coke Profile stocks with their Gentle Palm swell that shared a same Likeness to his Father's custom made Target stocks. Albert was also on the S&W Factory shooting Team when he worked there, and worked in their design & Development department.. Here is an early {1950" Time Span} set of S&W Factory Non-Relieved Non-Coke profile stock's that I have. They like most of that time span have no serial numbers or markings of any kind on the rear of them as shown...



[/QUOTE]

These grips ........ look to me to be non-cokes -
the checkering should be more like the one's pictured in an above side by side comparison ? I just want to see the differences .

....I see now where the poster clearly sez they are "non cokes" .
Would it be safe to say that before and after the era of "cokes" that the the checkered Target grips were available ?
So it might be possible to have Target grips that were made from either say 1951 to 1955 OR from 1964 to 1968 and not be able to tell which decade they were made in ?

Can the black washer changing to silver color help ??

Two ways. Both assume that you have the photos you want to upload stored on your computer.

(1) Use the direct upload to the forum approach. On the page where you compose a post, look down below the composition box for a button that says "Manage Attachments." Click on that. Then you get to pick the photo files on your computer that you want to upload. When they are specified, go back and make sure you have said everything in the compositoin box that you want to, and then click "Submit Reply." The photos will come along with your post, and will appear in your post as thumbnails. You need to make sure that the photos on your computer do not exceed the forum filesize limit. If they do, they won't be uploaded. In general, if your photos are formatted not to exceed 1000x800 pixels, they should upload just fine.

(2) Use the Internet photo hosting service approach. Sign up for a photo hosting account with a service like Photobucket. Upload your photos there. Then when you compose a post to this forum, just insert a link to the specific images you want to display from your Photobucket library. You don't have to worry about filesize limits this way, and the photos will appear embedded in your post instead of attached as thumbnails.

The only thing to look out for is that each link needs to be preceded and followed by the [IMG] and [/IMG] tags. This happens automatically if you click on the "IMG Code" version of the link from the several options on the right side of the page.

Other image hosting companies exist, and they will operate in ways similar to Photobucket, but probably not identically.

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David Wilson

David,
Thanks for the reply, and the directions. As I'm currently involved with a project out-of-state and only have my iPad with me, I'll have to wait until I get back home. Also, I may have to re-take photos at a lower resolution before attempting an upload, so it may be a while. I also have a post-war Model 10, which shows signs of wear, stamped "Bavarian Municipal Police" on the left side under the cylinder release. I'll post that one too, when I get the whole thing figured out.
Thanks again,
Skip

Yes, Smith and Wesson did ;~)

All J frame checkered or smooth targets look almost exactly like this from the factory. It kind of sucks, they look great with square bottoms. My dad has been cutting them short for years, makes them square bottom and I have seen at least one pair of custom KB grips with square bottoms and they look awesome!

That left grip in the pic looks VERY suspect to me and that grain pattern is close but is not a book match. This grips looks made to match the other grip. The checkering is crooked on the borders and the back of the border is very poorly cut, double cut. I would bet alot of cash that this is not a matched set from S&W. Edit to add, I wonder if this was done later at the factory? Also looks like non factory clearance holes for screw heads on the inside of these. One from a rounded upper side plate screw head and one from the strain screw head on the front of the frame?


These grips ........ look to me to be non-cokes -
the checkering should be more like the one's pictured in an above side by side comparison ? I just want to see the differences .[/QUOTE]

These grips look like at least an 1/8th of an inch has been chopped of the bottom.

They are also used on Glocks.

Totally unfinished. From the wood room at Smith & Wesson.

Attached Files

stock material.pdf (558.9 KB, 214 views)

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Don Mundell

Hello Pontiaker
The stock's shown came on my Model of 1955 .45 Target revolver. I have a Good friend that own's a Local Gun shop here and he knew that I wanted a Model of 1955 .45 Target revolver, so my Phone range one day from him Telling me that it had just come in and he did not feel it would last long, so he placed it on hold for me so that I had first Crack at it and that was about Five Year's ago now. I jumped in my Truck and rushed out to his store to see this gun. It was a One owner gun, & I spoke with the Older guy that Bought it brand new from S&W as we were Making out the Paperwork for Transfer to me on it. Sadly, he told me that he had lost or Mis Placed it's original factory Box, but he took my Name and contact information in case he ever was to come across it. He said that he ordered it right after he got out of the Marine's as he always' liked the .45 ACP round, but wanted it in a revolver instead of a Semi-Auto 1911 which he had in the service and carried as a side arm. There is a Lot of Mystery to the entire gun as it has a barrel length of only 5-7/8" from the end of the barrel to the face of the forcing cone and it is of Five screw design. I was told that all Model of 1955 Target .45's came with a 6-1/2" barrel, Other than a Dozen of them That shipped to Rex Firearm's that were special order gun's with a shorter 5-1/2" barrel. I later learned that it was bought in June of 1959 as it was told to me by it's original owner, and I felt that he may have been off as far as when he bought the gun date wise as that seemed aweful late to me for a five screw gun, so I asked MR Jinks and he told me that it left the Factory in April of 1959.



I asked MR Jink's why this gun would have left that late being a Five screw variation since S&W dropped the upper side plate screw in 1956 and my Gun was clearly shipped Three Year's after the Engineering design change of dropping the upper side plate screw ? he told me that back when S&W tooled up for the Pre-29's they made a bunch of Frames ahead of time thinking that the Pre-29 would be a strong seller, and many of the five screw frame's remained in the S&W storage safe, so they would Pull a Frame when other N-frame revolver's were ordered, Using up their Existing supply of Five screw frame's that they had on hand. The Cool Factor is that Pre-29 Frames are all heat treated to ensure they can take the repeated Punishment of the Fierce .44 Magnum cartridge so in Essence my Gun and cylinder are Heat treated so it will be Twice as durable as any other Model of 1955 .45 Target revolver.





I was still out there in left field as to how this gun came with an Earlier set of Diamond Target stocks on it, then what would have been normal on a Gun of 1959 Vintage which clearly should have been a set of Coke profile stocks. Again I questioned it's Original owner who bought the gun new and he said that these were Indeed The Original stock's that came on the gun as he ordered it & that he did not request a shorter Barrel, This is the one that it came with, and he was Not aware that a Normal length barrel for this gun was supposed to be 6-1/2" In length but he did Tell me that he liked the shorter barrel that it has. I have speculated that perhaps' this shorter barrel may have been one that was on hand and since he did not specify barrel length when he ordered it this is the one that they placed on it, as we all Know that S&W was Not a Company to waste any part's if they could be used they were. As far as the stock's go I suppose that S&W May have had many set's of stock's in Target form made up back then, and perhaps's this is why my Gun came shipped with the earlier Non Relieved diamond Target stock's on it. They are made of Gancalo-Alves as well which S&W considered a premium wood offering, compared to The standard Walnut wood offering.




I have not Bothered to letter the gun as I bought it to Shoot and enjoy, so being period correct or lettering correctly the way it is would have left the factory would mean nothing to me and I doubt that a factory Historical Letter is going to mention The Five screw frame, the shorter than normal barrel or the earlier style Non relieved diamond center stocks that it came with. Here is the gun Shown with a Target that I shot @ The 25 Yard line off a Sand bag with one of my own hand loads. Once the Gun printed out these result's there was no doubt in my mind that it was a tack driver, I carry it with me when I am Deer Hunting. Regards, Hammerdown




Here is the first test target shot with my Pre-25 Model of 1955 .45 Target revolver. This was a hand load I was testing for it, that showed to be very accurate and consistent as the Bullet P.O.I. show's as I was adjusting the sights while shooting it.








Here is The second Target shot with the same gun bench rested on a sand Bag @ the 25 Yard line. I have made this Load the staple load that fit's this gun very well as can be seen with the 6 shot group that it produced. These are the same Non-Relieved stock's shown, That were off the gun in an earlier response by you.

Hello SDH
I lucked into a pair of N-Frame Smooth Magna's at a Gun show about Eight Year's ago. The seller of them thought that they were K-Square frame & I paid $25.00 for them. Later at the same gun show I Picked up a S&W Model 27-2 with a 5" Barrel. It had a set of standard factory target stock's on it, so I Pulled them and tried my new to me Smooth Magna's on it. They fit like a Glove as shown. I also had a Tennessee Highway patrol revolver Model 25-9 chambered in.45 Colt cartridge that came with Smooth Magna's on it as shown. Regards, Hammerdown

K 4167xx
8 3/8

Is there any information on the dates of silver and black and is there a difference in value?
I am also trying find out more on custom grips.
Mustang
Heretts
Ropers and hoping to put some values on them. Not an easy chore with so many makers out there.
I do like Grasshorns

By the way , great thread.

19-7 LNIB Special order RB with Black Front and Rear sights.


[IMG][/IMG]

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Have a blessed day ,
Bull

I want to show off my M19, but I also have a question.

When I first got it, the M19 had a Hogue grip. Since I've seen a few pictures of Hogues in this thread, I have to wonder. Did Smith and Wesson ever sell handguns with Hogue grips, or were they alway aftermarket?

I was lucky to have bought a NOS fingered combat grips the same week I got the M19, and they feel like a perfect match at the range.

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Grain looks nice! A little shaping needed! Bob

The last few new S&Ws that I bought (M629 and M625 Mountain Guns), back in the mid 2000s, came with Hogues.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

Not sure of the official S&W name but we call those "Presentation" stocks. Obviously they are target size and have the concave cut on the left upper for clearance upon extraction of the spent shells. There is another cut which is much more pronounced to allow room for a speed loader.

There's my two-cents ... well, with inflation, about a buck's worth.

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ANTIQUESMITHS
LM1300 SWHF425

Didn't see any of these in the thread.

N frame Presentation Modified Magnas.

I believe they were only available special order ?

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Paul
S&WCA #2726

Here's some pearl S/W grips Igot on a older .32S/W Long HE. Probably didn't come orig. but added some time later.

sorry guys, but unable to post pic... checking to see what's wrong...

Mustang 3 grips on a late 1970's 36-1

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model 29 4 inch

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Hello, I've recently seen a photo of a model 29-2 S serial# revolver showing the extractor cutout on the right grip. Have you seen this before?

Presentation grips? I have a set like that on a 66-3 to show the medallion stamped on the right side of the gun.

Left, early 60s targets on a 19.
Second, early 80s presentations on a 66-3
3rd, Pachmyers? On a 10-6
Right, late 70s targets on a 57

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I have a set just like that for a K frame. Interesting gold medallion is in the checkering pattern like mine also.

The resemble Pachmayr Renegade combat grips. I have scrolled google images looking for a match and have not found them.
here is a pic of the inside.

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	IMG_0293.jpg (88.9 KB, 70 views)

We talked briefly about the PC Magnas (Plain Clothes) but what about the sharp shoulder or round shoulder Magnas. Isn't there a distinction there as well?

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Join the NRA today

Here's a few K Frame Round Butt Targets.I know the checkered style was posted already but I don't think anyone has posted photos of their K RB Presentation Targets.

Here's my 2 Presentation and 1 Checkered.

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KL RBT.jpg (141.2 KB, 76 views)

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NEVER GIVE UP YOUR GUN

Is there any rhyme or reason to the medallion color? Gold vs. Silver. Are they specific to a certain year? Frame size? Type of grip?

Also the washer that secures the medallion. Black, silver, and no washer (just the pin on the inside).

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SW grips.jpg (120.3 KB, 57 views)

I think checkering screws-up beautiful wood, hence I don't have any on my revolvers.

Those smooth target grips on Rags loooong barrel S&W are not "coke" era grips. They do not have flush with the wood escutcheons. Also, I believe the Presentation, smooth grips of the pre-"coke" era were made of Rosewood and were not relieved. I have seen Presentation smooth grips with relief, from the "coke" era, they do exist.

Hibbs