Is there any info on the Special Order Registered Magnum in .22 LR ? Has this Registered been located ?

Looks like you're pretty much up to speed on the issue.

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Dick Burg

As Dick said, with a little clarification. One is known to have been made, no one knows if it still exists or who has it. It probably is in the collection of someone who wishes to remain anonymous. End of known story.

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

Maybe I can help narrow this down a bit: I don't own it.

Jerry

There was a recent thread on the .22RF Reg. Mag. and I posted the info on where & when it was shipped to Death Valley, CA., and a search I did many years ago for it. Ed

This is the first I have heard of this. I will check out the local garage sales and gun shows. I do however own the Kaisers favorite Luger carbine that he hunted deer with in the Black Forest. Also a table cloth with gravy stains too.

It never ceases to amaze me how much I learn here! I never knew there was a RM .22 out there!

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Misty

For those of you who want to search...two Registered Magnums were ordered by American Potash & Chemical Corporation in Trona, California on October 9, 1936. The two guns were identical: 8 3/8-inch barrel, King Reflector Red Post front sight, King #112 white outline rear sight, and Magna stocks. Registration number 1590 was in .357 Magnum caliber and Registration number 1591 was in .22 Long Rifle caliber (S&W charged $150 for this revolver, or 2.5 times the normal retail cost of this model).

The letter to S&W states..."The price is immaterial as these pistols are intended as a gift for which a subscription has been made,...". (not exactly sure what a subscription means in this context, but it doesn't really matter).

Many have tried, but no one has succeeded in finding either revolver. Happy Hunting!!!

Bill

That's more information on this fabled gun than I have previously seen in one place. Thanks for the summary.

In this context "subscription" looks like it would mean "We passed the hat." I get the feeling that a big shot at AmPot was retiring, and the upper echelons at the company wanted to give him a nice going-away present. If somebody can turn up a list of corporate officers in 1936 (I spent some time looking, but did not find what I wanted), maybe we can make an educated guess at who got the guns first. After that, of course, you have 75 years of undocumented history for them to wander around in.

I doubt whoever got them at retirement stayed in Trona. I've been there. The town and its surroundings are an interesting monument to the heyday of America's surface extraction industry, and the Trona Pinnacles are an interesting geological formation to visit, but the area does not strike me as the kind of place anybody would happily retire in.

I think the suggested Death Valley Scotty connection cannot be true. DV Scotty's situation, not to mention that of his sole benefactor Albert Johnson, had already collapsed by 1935, the year before the guns were made and shipped. Despite his self-proclaimed identity as a mining and minerals guy, there was no reason for him to have had anything to do with AmPot operations at Trona (which, coincidentally, is only 100 miles away, give or take). Scott had been a known fraud since 1906, and real minerals guys would never take him seriously.

It would be fascinating if this gun still existed in a safe somewhere. Or even as a rusty mess hanging from a nail in a barn wall.

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David Wilson

I guess that means RM #1591 is the rarest S&W revolver ever, truly "one of a kind."

N-22 hand ejector model of 1936?
OZ

Anybody want to make a guess on what that little gem might be worth assuming it has survived and is in average or better condition?

I would say easily 6 figures. Not only is it a registered magnum, but it is a one of a kind registered magnum.

What a thread! The education I get here never ceases to amaze me.

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Kevin in Oregon

David, The connection of Al Johnson & DV Scotty was very much alive and well in 1935. Johnson & his wife were living in the "Castle" which Johnson had built, as retirees enjoying the healthful climate of Death Valley. Scotty was living in his cabin about 5 miles away. Johnson, a well known in the industry mining engineer, had connections to many of the mining enterprises in DV. The early advertising hype on the RMs started in the early 30s, so if you lived in DV and wanted an RM, you didn't have a corner gun store to place your order, but you did have AmPot in Trona as the closest place to your residence to have the guns delivered. Johnson's connections to mining in the area made him well known, so his friends at AmPot would have been happy to accomodate him as the delivery point for the guns. Johnson was always giving Scotty gifts and financial support, even though he knew Scotty was a con man & fraud insofar, as Scotty's claims of having a fabulous gold mine hidden in DV, Scotty was still his life long friend. While Johnson had lost money in the stock market collapse in 1929, he was still fairly wealthy and who else in DV could tell S&W "cost is not important." Some times you have to connect the dots to get to the answers. My cousin, Clarence Satterfield, was a old time one burro prospector in DV and knew all the players there. He introduced me to Scotty in about 1948 at Barstow, when Scotty was in town on one of his binges. Unfortunately I didn't know of the .22RM at the time, or I would have asked him what he did with it! Ed. #15

Ed, I am not about to argue with someone who met DV Scotty in person! I can see that the line you laid out does indeed connect the dots in a way that is not unreasonable. But just to be thorough I'd still like to know what was going on with AmPot management in 1936 at the time the order was placed.

There should be a way to cross-link posts in this thread to the "Most interesting person you ever met" thread in the Lounge. You'd get lots of points for Scotty.

Barstow in 1948 -- I conjure up a mental image of a highway with half a dozen gas stations on each side, three motels, two coffee shops and maybe a post office. It sure is bigger now.

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David Wilson

You Guys...

This stuff reads like the "Treasure of the Sierra Madre", and you've got me on the edge of my seat.

I'm ready for a road trip to Death Valley. Or Kemmerer, Wyo. Wherever.

Let's run this thing down. I'm with you. I'll buy the gas.

Who's buying the beer?

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Mitch
SWCA 2438

heck that was 1998, its has really big trucks stops now

I am never ceased to be amazed from what I read on this forum.

John

It'll probably just show up discretely one day on GunBroker listed as an "old .22LR Kit Gun" and someone will snag it for $400.

Hate to ask the obvious but has anyone asked the company in question who they gave it to? The company I work for has been around since that era and I know we would have a record of such a gift. They probably have have an unofficial company historian who knows the answer but would be surprised anyone cared enough to ask.

Will be in my safe shortly.

The person who corresponded with S&W about the pair of revolvers was Mr. L. S. Laughlin, Manager, Industrial Relations Department, American Potash & Chemical Corporation in Trona.

Bill

Didn't Am Potash & Chem become Kerr McGhee at some point? If so, they might have records. Joe

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Keep Today Fresh

That's correct. K-M bought the company in 1967. I may take a run at them if my approach to the local history society in Trona doesn't pay off.

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David Wilson

I was at the Trona History Society last year & researched the files they
had on the Trona Plant, nothing on the RM's.

Sounds like a S&W version of the Maltese Falcon....hopefully it turns up on this forum...

Right when you think you know S&W 5 screws......you hear about a 22 LR RM!!!!

Like many other long lost treasures, (Bugatti type 57 Atalante found in England) some older man, in his 80s to 90s probably owns it in his vast gun collection and has no idea as to its modern day value or its historical importance or rarity. Just some large 22 S&W he bought in 1957 off a guy...

L S Laughlin presented those two firearms to my grandfather as a reward for his patent on the extraction techniques that revoloutionized the industry that he signed over to the company. Quite frankly I wished gramps would'a kept the patent and liscensed it-would have made a lot more money for him. Anyway as the story goes, he made his way back east and upon his death I inherited both-had no idea they were so talked about.
Oh well, guess you learn something new every day.

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Forum consigliere

David, Actually Barstow was a wide open town during WW2 with the various military basis around that area and probably had upwards of 25,000 residents in the area. In 1948 it was suffering from the depression of many small towns that had rapidly grown due to WW2 & the military, so when the military left, there was a lot of vacant buildings, etc. however it's "night life" was well known to the old timers in DV. I was there in 1948 as part of an Army unit surveying the Camp Irwin location ( Now Ft. Irwin) for possible use as a Calif. Nat'l Guard training base. The most nefarious waterhole was called "The Riverbottom" and was a dance hall, saloon & ***** house located in the river bottom, just a few blocks north of the center of town. That's where my cousin took me to meet Scotty and several other old time DV prospecters & desert characters with whom he was well acquainted ( Seldon Seen Slim, Shorty Harris, etc. ) In 1951, the Army assigned me to Camp Irwin as an instructor, so I was able to spend some fun time exploring all the nooks and corners of DV with my military assigned Jeep (and Yes, you can get a Jeep stuck in the sand & rocks, regardless of 4WD. I wore out many shovels proving it!) maybe I should have borrowed one of those 20 mule teams! Mules don't get stuck, however they are a little slower than Jeeps on flat terrain. DV Scotty was a fun guy. When he came to town with some cash in his pocket, everbody he knew went on a binge with Scotty until the money ran out. I never met Al Johnson, although I stopped at "The Castle" several times to fill up the water jugs, etc. Later in the 70s, I stopped at the AmPot HQ in Trona to see if anyone knew anything about the two RMs, but drew a blank. Ed #15

edited btt

You mean that pair was valuable? I gifted them both to J. Edgar Hoover before he died. ****, now we are looking for three Hoover guns?

When I was in college in the 1970's I worked with a cowboy here in Northern Nevada by the name of Walter P. Scott, the professed grandson of the more famous DV Scotty. At times we would go shooting an he had a .22 S&W pistol he said he got from his grandpa. Just wonder, if he still has it. I guess I need to renew an old freindship.

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Tim

I have tryed to be a good person so I think Lee has had those 2 RM all these years. But will not tell anyone that he has them!!!

dick44

I saw that gun in a pawnshop in Victorville in 1983, it was wore slam out and wearing some beat up mustang brand rubbers, they had it tagged at 149.99.............I passed.

The hunt continues

I looked, I don't have it. I looked again, I still don't have it. I swear.

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Wayne
Torn & Frayed

I believe that gun was in the possession of Jack Ruby at one time.

It was probably inherited by someone who thinks it's called a .22 CTG!

I'm still on the trail. Clues have been followed up, mostly to dead ends, however not all. The gun has changed hands a couple of times, through gifts & inheritance. I found an elderly lady who remembers her father, an AmPot executive, letting her shoot the gun as a child in Trona. As soon as I locate it, I'll have copies made by the new 3 D printers and sell them here on the Forum to members only! Ed.

The trail goes to the northerly suburbs of Los Angeles. The lady who shot the gun as a child told me that a nephew and a friend of the nephew came to their home shortly after her father passed away and took all the guns with them, including the .22 cal Reg Mag. She said the nephew lives in a LA suburb but she has lost contact over time and does not know the nephew's location now. Ed

Uncle Ed is hot on the trail!! Good Luck!!

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PTLAPTA!

This is going to make for a fun documentary when they get found.

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Psalm 27:2

I remember reading a well respected gun writer who mentioned seeing an N frame 22 lr. He said the bbl was lined and the cylinder a custom job that would have put the entire cost much more than a K22.
Maybe there are more than two N frame 22's out there. This is a great story waiting for an ending.
To paraphrase Service "There are strange things done in the Midnight Sun", and elsewhere as well.

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Front sight and squeeze

Years ago, Ray Brazille and Gary Garbrecht advertised for the Magnum in .22 LR caliber in various papers in California (pre-internet), but nothing ever turned up. They finally discontinued their efforts.

Bill

The invoice in S&W's records may be as close as we ever get to this unique revolver.

Bill

Someone out there thinks they own a Heavy Barrel K-22 Outdoorsman, or a 22/44, or a 22/357 Little Duty. Haha too much coffee. Really hope this Little Foot is spotted in the wild someday.

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Beau
SWCA #3106 - SWHF #643

I have it on good information that this .22 RM is sitting in a collectors display case next to J. Edgar Hoover's RM...'nuff said!

I'll bet the recoil would be tolerable.

Not in a gun made of hot air.






Edit. From he who owns an N frame .22. Just not a RM.

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Expect the unexpected

Or perhaps someone took an incredibly collectible gun and turned it in at one of those gun buy back programs for a $50 Walmart gift card.
Of the horror.