So what are all of the ways you can tell a short from a long action, other than the date of manufacture? I'm curious in distinguishing between which ways you can tell visibly vs. having to physically have the revolver.

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Aaron Terry

Hammer shape.

Short: Spur in middle.



Long: Spur at top.

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No life story has happy end.

Was the short/long action change made on N frames as well? I guess the I frames would have all been long action as they didnt make the transition to the 50's, or did they?

Was this a modification of the lockwork or just the hammer spur, going from long to short action?

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Aaron Terry

My understanding is there is a difference in the location of the pivot points. may be an over simplification but if so someone will come along who knows more than me.

More than just the hammer shape. Long action was just what it sounds like, the hammer traveled further compared to the post-war short action which was thought to improve accuracy by having a shorter hammer fall but most shooters believe the old long action was smoother.

All the various models that were produced both before and after the war were made in both varieties. Some long action guns assembled after the war with left over parts are called transition models.

Long action M&P from 1942:



Short action M&Ps from 1949:



A 38/44 heavy Duty from 1940 with long action:



A 1960 (made in 1956) HD with the short action:

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No life story has happy end.

Thank ya kindly Sir, this thread answered a few questions for me I never realized I had. LOL

There was lockwork modification as well. The hammer stud moved forward a bit so that the distance the hammer traveled was actually shortened. The terms "Long Hammer Throw" and "Short Hammer Throw" are sometimes seen in place of the phrases "long action" and "short action."

Forget the I's and J's. Long and short action distinctions are fond in the K and N revolvers. I like SP's single-glance test, but I always did it chronologically, which is kind of like going the long way around the barn.

1) All prewar hand ejectors are long action, with the exception of the K-22/40.

2) Any postwar revolver with the descriptor "Model of 1950" or later in its name is a short action revolver.

3) Guns made between 1945 and 1950 may be either short action or long action, except that ALL K-Masterpiece (the ones with the K-prefix serial number) revolvers are short action.

So if I am thinking correctly this morning, the only N-frame guns that could be either long or short are the postwar .38/44s (Outdoorsman and Heavy Duty), .357 Magnum, .44 Special Model of 1926 and .45 Model of 1917.

In the K-frames only the .38 M&P can be found in long and short action. The SV or S prefix will mark long-action guns. I tend to think that the C prefix on postwar fixed-sight revolvers always means short action, but there is a fuzzy border there because the last few thousand long action guns with S-prefix numbers mostly had short actions.

The postwar long-action guns are the ones that are usually called "transitional," as they use a mix of both prewar and postwar parts in manufacture.

I'm offering this list of observations on a "rule of thumb" basis. If there are refinements that can be added to this approach, somebody please post them.

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David Wilson

And also sporting what appears to be a bobbed humpback hammer. There's another one of those over there on the non-Reg Magnum thread.

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David Wilson

In my opinion the pre WWII S&W revolvers with the long action had the smoothest DA trigger pulls. One can easilly feel the diffrence when doing double action pistol with the two side by side.

Thanks for the info guys. This is really fascinating.

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Aaron Terry

Finally, this old guy can understand the difference.

Thanks,

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NRA Instructor

For a number of years I was a Bullseye shooter using a single action 14-2 as my main platform. This was in the 70's and I thought this gun was the golden rod.




Then I started collecting M&P's and discovered something. Even though the action is "longer" it's slicker. It's the cats meow. It's an ice cream sunday with your best girl. And when it's been worked on by a class gunsmith it's heaven.This is the cleanest action I have ever pulled on. Both single and double action. 1905 early fourth change SN 291666. The cylinder is not heat treated. It's been cut up and brought back to life as one of the best pistols I own. Did I say I liked I?
DW



Did I mention I used it as a carry gun?

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"NUTS"

Don't the long action M&Ps also have a cross pin under the cylinder release that's not found in the short action ones?

Well, yes and no.
First, it is not a crosspin. It is the hammer pivot stud (upon which the hammer pivots between the uncocked and cocked postions). On the earlier frames, this stud was screwed into the left side of the frame and the end is visible just below the cylinder release thumb piece.
On January 18, 1946, a management order was sent down to the floor supervisors to change this to a pressed stud on the K frame revolvers. The change seems to have been implented pretty quickly, since guns with the pressed stud seem to have started showing up in shipments that went out in April of that year.
The end of the pressed-in stud extended to the frame side, but was polished off and is usually hidden under the finish.
The high speed hammer was not adopted until early 1948, so the two changes did not coincide. In other words, no gun with a high speed hammer would have the threaded stud. But there are some revolvers with the old long action that have the pressed stud.
Here's a photograph of two .38 M&P revolvers - the one with the threaded stud shipped in March, 1946. The lower gun with the pressed stud shipped in January, 1947. Both have the long action.

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Jack
SWCA #2475, SWHF #318

Jack,

Great post.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

Thank you, Jim. I try! Someday, maybe, I'll catch up to you in the level of encyclopedic knowledge. But only if I live long enough . . .

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Jack
SWCA #2475, SWHF #318

I hope you all live long and prosper, so I can sit back and read and store more information.

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Regards
Ray S&WCA #2810