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S&W Hand Ejectors: 1896 to 1961 All 5-Screw & Vintage 4-Screw SWING-OUT Cylinder REVOLVERS, and the 35 Autos and 32 Autos


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Old 01-18-2011, 01:00 AM
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Model 1902 HE 2nd model 32 wcf - advice needed Model 1902 HE 2nd model 32 wcf - advice needed Model 1902 HE 2nd model 32 wcf - advice needed Model 1902 HE 2nd model 32 wcf - advice needed Model 1902 HE 2nd model 32 wcf - advice needed  
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Default Model 1902 HE 2nd model 32 wcf - advice needed

I have the chance to acquire a 1902 HE 2nd model (K frame) in 32 wcf in trade for a Remington 572 fieldmaster 22lr std aka $250.

Pros - The S&W has SN 65XX, round butt, 4in and functions fine. Grips are crisp.
Cons - reblued, grips don't have a SN and one of the side plate screws is buggered. The grips almost look too nice, are there repro round butt K frame rubber grips?

So basically, the 572 I paid $250 for and the shop owner said he'd do an even trade which would make the S&W $250 out the door.

Per the SCSW 3rd, I notice relatively low production numbers and this gun is relatively early by SN.

Should I do the trade? What say you? Post answer WITH reasoning, thanks.

Also, would this gun be worth having re-done professionally?

Last edited by Göring's S&W; 01-18-2011 at 01:28 AM.
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Old 01-18-2011, 06:40 AM
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Model 1902 HE 2nd model 32 wcf - advice needed Model 1902 HE 2nd model 32 wcf - advice needed Model 1902 HE 2nd model 32 wcf - advice needed Model 1902 HE 2nd model 32 wcf - advice needed Model 1902 HE 2nd model 32 wcf - advice needed  
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Default easy

I am not a collector or an expert of any type. It seems like a re-blued gun is usually not too collectable but that doesn't mean it ain't cool. I personally would take a re-blued functioning s&w over a remington 572 all day long.

As for reasons, take apart the trigger/bolt assembly on the 572 and count all those ****** stamped parts as reasons.

Pete

Last edited by beagleye; 01-18-2011 at 08:58 AM.
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Old 01-18-2011, 08:31 AM
walnutred walnutred is offline
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I'd trade assuming the S&W is in very good mechanical condition. How is the bore? The S&W may not be a collectible but I love shooting 32's of all persuasions. However, ask him to throw in a box of ammo and see what he says. If you don't reload you might be better off with a different caliber. 32-20 ammo can be hard to find and pricey.
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Old 01-18-2011, 01:03 PM
mikepriwer mikepriwer is offline
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Model 1902 HE 2nd model 32 wcf - advice needed Model 1902 HE 2nd model 32 wcf - advice needed Model 1902 HE 2nd model 32 wcf - advice needed Model 1902 HE 2nd model 32 wcf - advice needed Model 1902 HE 2nd model 32 wcf - advice needed  
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I can offer a few comments.

First of all, there is a nomenclature issue. In the early K-frame models,
we have the Model of 1899, the Model of 1902, and the Model of 1905.
Sometimes the collectors refer to the 1899 as the First Model, the
1902 as the Second Model, but never refer to the 1905 as the Third
Model.

I think this is confusing, for a couple of reasons. First, the catalogs
of the period do no use First Model or Second Model - they just use
Model of 1899 and Model of 1902. Second, there is really two
significantly different variations of the Model of 1902; the original
Model of 1902, and then what we call the Model of 1902 First Change.
This First Change variation has the heavier barrel, a shoulder on the
barrel, a larger barrel thread, and a heavier frame nose. Its very
important to keep these differences clear.

In the 32-20 chambering of this gun, which I think is not a different
model but just the alternate chambering, s/n 65XX should be an
original Model of 1902, with no shoulder on the barrel, and the
patent date roll markings on the top of the barrel. This is a scarce
gun in the 32-20 chambering - there were probably only about 4000 of
them made this way, and maybe another 10,000 in 38 caliber. I don't
know anything about a Remington 572, but I'd guess they made more
than 4000 of them.

When they introduced the heavier barrel about a year later, the top
surface of the 4" barrel was too short for their existing patent-date
roll marking dies, because of the addition of the shoulder on the
barrel. So, they moved the patent date roll markings to the right
side of the barrel.

For this reason alone, if it were me, I'd buy this original 4" Model of
1902. From a collection perspective, it would be a very desireable
comparison to a 4" Model of 1902 First Change. Ie, one would have
the patent date roll markings on the top of the barrel, and the other
would have them on the right side.

What I'm getting at here is that this is an opportunity to capture
a siginficant engineering change, from the original Model of 1902
to the First Change variant. These changes are striking, and its not
often that we have the opportunity to have changes such as these, side by
side.

The rebluing doesn't bother me, given the price. The buggered side
plate screw can be easily replaced, and correct black hard-rubber grips
are generally available.

I'd check the bore - this was a black-powder cartridge, and if it was shot
a lot and not cleaned properly, the bore may be badly pitted. If its
really bad, I'd be tempted to pass on the gun. Also, check the right
side of the frame, for the ends of the studs. If they've been polished
flat during the reblue, that makes it less interesting, although they
can be replaced. Also check the fit of the sideplate - if the edges have
been rounded over, so that it stands out like a sore thumb, that makes
it less interesting to me.

Hope all this helps. As you can tell, I am a big fan of the original
Model of 1902, particularly with a 4" barrel. But, one has to have a
collector interest, for it to be important to them.

Regards, Mike Priwer
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Old 01-18-2011, 01:17 PM
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Quote:
In the 32-20 chambering of this gun, which I think is not a different model but just the alternate chambering, s/n 65XX should be an original Model of 1902, with no shoulder on the barrel, and the patent date roll markings on the top of the barrel.
By calling it a 1902 HE 2nd model, I simply meant 2nd issue or 2nd change. The first change was only until about 54XX I think per SCSW 3rd ed. The patent dates are on top, btw.

Quote:
Also, check the right side of the frame, for the ends of the studs. If they've been polished flat during the reblue, that makes it less interesting, although they can be replaced.
I consider the right side of the frame to the side with screws, is that what you're referring to? Or something else? I don't understand.

Quote:
and correct black hard-rubber grips are generally available.
Thats what it has ?!?!? So they're replacements? They don't have any SN written in them.


I'm leaning towards getting it due to the relative scarcity of it. The 572 remington was made into the millions and its not a deluxe or smoothbore or anything special. It was made before 1968 but its nothing great.

Last edited by Göring's S&W; 01-18-2011 at 01:21 PM.
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Old 01-18-2011, 02:55 PM
mikepriwer mikepriwer is offline
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Call it a Model of 1902. That is what it is. In about 1903, they changed
the design of the barrel, and collectors refer to it as a Model of 1902
First Change.

My mistake on the 'right side' - I meant the left side, of course.

The grips were either hard black rubber, checkered walnut, and on
special order, pearl and ivory. Generally the serial number was
scratched into the inside of the right panel, for the hard-rubber grips.
If the serial number is not present, they are probably not the original
grips, but perhaps factory replacement. There are some replicas being
made/sold today. Its hard to say what is on the gun - particularly
without pictures.

Mike Priwer
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22lr, 2nd model, cartridge, k frame, k-frame, remington, round butt, scsw, sideplate, walnut

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