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S&W Hand Ejectors: 1896 to 1961 All 5-Screw & Vintage 4-Screw SWING-OUT Cylinder REVOLVERS, and the 35 Autos and 32 Autos


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Old 02-01-2012, 11:34 AM
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Picked up a 6 1/2" non model marked,4 screw, 44 magnum in 95-97% condition several months ago. Does anyone have an idea of how many were produced in this configuration and would it be worth lettering?
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Old 02-01-2012, 01:44 PM
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Don't think there is a headcount on these. I have #181xxx in the same configuration. the window for these was pretty narrow as the model marking change was issued in 1957 and the 5th screw elimination was issued in 1955. They were "transitioning" thru the changes in the 57-58 time frame when these were most likely made.

Mine is serial numbered on the bbl but not the cyl.

If my dates are wrong, hopefully someone will help out.


Charlie
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Old 02-01-2012, 01:47 PM
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I thought the elimination of the 5th screw order was issued in September 56, but my memory is not what it used to be. That would leave a window of around 9 or 10 months, depending on the exact dates. From what I have read, there is a manufacuturing delay in implementing the changes, so the ship dates would not reflect the order issue dates. Actually, I think my 4 screw, non model marked shipped in 1958. I would have to double check the letter.
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Old 02-01-2012, 02:16 PM
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The Engineering Change to delete the upper side plate screw on N-frames was issued on September 7, 1956 and 4-screw 44 Magnums began to be shipped in early 1957. The directive to begin stamping the model number in the yoke cut was issued on June 12, 1957 and revolvers stamped MOD-29 in the yoke cut began to be shipped in late 1958 (in the high S183000 serial number range). So, non-model marked 4-screw 44 Magnums were shipped for approximately twenty plus months. The first six months of 1957 saw an intermixing of 5- and 4-screw frames.

Based on the above, I would "guesstimate" approximately 8200 non-model marked 4-screw 44 Magnums were manufactured.

Bill

Last edited by Doc44; 02-01-2012 at 04:13 PM.
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Old 02-01-2012, 03:01 PM
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I am not sure what else the letter would tell you besides where it was shipped and the date. Some people letter every gun they own, and others only letter guns that are unique or may be questionable. Unique, i.e unusual barrel length or finish or a not so common feature or option. Good luck.
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Old 02-01-2012, 03:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Doc44 View Post
The Engineering Change to delete the upper side plate screw on N-frames was issued on September 7, 1956 and 4-screw 44 Magnum began to be shipped in early 1957. The directive to begin stamping the model number in the yoke cut was issued on June 12, 1957 and revolvers stamped MOD-29 in the yoke cut began to be shipped in late 1958 (in the high S183000 serial number range). So, non-model marked 4-screw 44 Magnums were shipped for approximately twenty plus months. The first six months of 1957 saw an intermixing of 5- and 4-screw frames.

Based on the above, I would "guesstimate" approximately 8200 non-model marked 4-screw 44 Magnums were manufactured.

Bill
Bill, thank you for going through that exercise. I tried the same thing several days ago and came up with a smaller number -- but i also seriously underestimated the number of months that the four-screw Pre-29 was in production. I am sure your thinking is much better than mine.

I should know this, but don't: Approximately how many five-screw Pre-29s were manufactured?
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Old 02-01-2012, 04:12 PM
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David...Approximately 6500 44 Magnums with a 5-screw frame were manufactured and shipped during 1956 and 1957.

Bill
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Old 02-01-2012, 04:21 PM
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Quote:
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David...Approximately 6500 44 Magnums with a 5-screw frame were manufactured and shipped during 1956 and 1957.

Bill
Bill, thank you!

This upsets a long-held mistaken understanding on my part. I thought the five-screw Pre-29s greatly outnumbered the four-screw variety. Instead, I now see that of roughly 15,000 Pre-29s, about 55% were four-screw guns, and 45% five-screw.

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Old 02-01-2012, 05:22 PM
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David...I think that was a result of collectors thinking the marking of model numbers started much earlier than it did. S&W had a large number of frames "in process" and even though the directive had been issued, the company did not go back and stamp these frames.

I had a 44 Magnum with an 8 3/8-inch barrel with a serial number in the S177000 range. It was not model marked even though the revolver was shipped in August 1959. Roy pointed out to me the fact S&W did not go back and stamp the early frames.

I haven't studied other models, but I suspect the same thing is true for them.

Bill
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Old 02-01-2012, 06:32 PM
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Great information.I had been under the impression there were more 5 screw guns than unmarked 4 screws too.Thanks all.
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Old 02-01-2012, 06:46 PM
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I have a blue Pre-29 five screw with a 4" barrel which I have been told is rarer still.
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Old 02-01-2012, 08:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Badge130 View Post
I have a blue Pre-29 five screw with a 4" barrel which I have been told is rarer still.
Well if you read some of the factory correspondence there was going to be approx 2500 6.5's and 2500 4's made with the 6.5's being first. Smith made more 6.5's due to demand in the first run so the 4's didnt start until the end of 1956. We know there was at least 2-3 dozen 4" guns shipped in 56, but we only know the whereabouts of <12 or so. So, if your gun will letter to 56 it IS scarce.
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Old 02-12-2012, 02:57 PM
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Default PRE 29 4 screw S&W RARE 4" BARREL ser s180xxx

Hello all I am new to this site I was wondering if anyone could give ballpark figure on how many pre 29 's were made with 4 " barrel.I have one and was thinking of sell it.It was handed down to me took it show to and alot just gave me crazy looks when i said wanted $3500 in wood box with not the original box but is period correct thanks for anyhelp
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Old 02-12-2012, 04:45 PM
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firestorm34...Your Pre-Model 29 has a 4-screw frame and probably dates to 1958. It would have been shipped with a presentation case that has a dark blue to black exterior and a blue satin lining. The mahogany case was introduced for this barrel length in 1960.

If your 44 Magnum is 99 percent with mint coke bottle stocks, I would value it at around $1,600. If you had the original case and accessories, the total package would be valued at approximately $2,150.

Prices will vary depending on the location and situation, but the ones stated above are in the "ballpark".

Bill
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Old 02-12-2012, 07:27 PM
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Thanks thats great info what about factory reworked pre 29 how bad does that effect value.i was told it would take a 98% down to an 80
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Old 02-12-2012, 10:24 PM
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Firestorm34, I fear you have been given bad information. The basic joke in collector circles is that refinishing is a process in which you pay $200 (or more!) in order to cut a gun's value in half.

Collectors value originality. A pristine original finish is worth a lot. A pristine refinish is worth much less. In fact, a worn original finish is worth much more to a collector than a good looking refinish.

You hear a broad distinction between collector-grade guns and shooter-grade guns. No collector will value a refinished gun as anything more than shooter grade, no matter how good it looks.

In some cases a factory refinish will be considered less damaging to a gun's value than a non-factory refinish, but we are talking about old bluing processes that are no longer used. The older a factory refinish is (1920s, 1930s, for example) the less loss of value there will be to a refinish. Recent refinishes of recently produced models (in the last half century) will not be so lucky.

Here and in your other post in the separate thread you started it sounds as though you have a refinished gun in the wrong case. I am afraid the hard news is that its collector value is non-existent, but you might find someone who wants a good looking shooter who would be willing to pay a little over a thousand for it. I don't see how you can get close to the $3500 you mentioned in a different post.
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44 magnum, coke bottle grips, model 29, presentation, s&w

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