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Old 12-05-2012, 07:01 AM
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Question Smith & Wesson .32 long CTG

Smith & Wesson .32 long CTG

serial no. is 9844xx. 4" barrel.

Does anyone has an idea about the age or date of manufacture of this gun based on the serial? Also, .32 long is pretty scarce here in my area. I only have 2 rounds left when I acquired it, never fired them. Is it ok to use .32 autos on it?

Thanks!
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Old 12-05-2012, 07:22 AM
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I cannot date your gun with these details others may, can you give more details or post a picture?
32 long vs 32ACP, one is rimmed and the other rimless no they are not interchangeable.
Cheers
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Old 12-05-2012, 07:27 AM
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Welcome to the forum. That serial number doesn't sound right for a true antique, or any .32 that I know for that matter. Can you post a couple of pictures? And please check the rear face of the cylinder to see if the serial number from the butt is repeated there.

Is this the type of gun in which the cylinder swings out to the side to eject and reload? Or is there a latch on top that lets the barrel pivot down for ejection and loading?

With a little more info we can tell you about your gun; it's just not clear right now exactly what you have.
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Old 12-05-2012, 08:46 AM
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Welcome to the Forum. The 32 Long cartridge was not introduced until 1903, so your revolver must be a solid frame with a cylinder that opens to the left. If so, check your serial number, since there were no 32 Long revolvers with serial numbers approaching one million.
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Old 12-05-2012, 09:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glowe View Post
Welcome to the Forum. The 32 Long cartridge was not introduced until 1903, so your revolver must be a solid frame with a cylinder that opens to the left. If so, check your serial number, since there were no 32 Long revolvers with serial numbers approaching one million.
Why didn't I think of that? Of course this would have to be a fixed frame gun with a swing-out cylinder.

One minor refinement: the year the .32 Long was introduced was actually seven years earlier, when the .32 Hand Ejector first model (Model of 1896) was introduced.
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Old 12-05-2012, 10:26 AM
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The .32 acp will fit in a .32 Long chamber, and it is semi-rimmed. BUT, they do work at a higher pressure and it is not advisable to use them in a .32 long. .32 S&W Long is readily available from many internet sources such as Midway and Brownells, as well as most larger gun stores. It is not overly prices as 38 S&W is. It is also easily reloaded. It is a very accurate round with very little recoil. We would need to more accurately identify your gun before recommending shooting anything in it.
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Old 12-05-2012, 01:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DCWilson View Post
One minor refinement: the year the .32 Long was introduced was actually seven years earlier, when the .32 Hand Ejector first model (Model of 1896) was introduced.
David - I keep forgetting about the 1896 since I do not yet own one, but someday . . .

Also, 32 Long is readily available for purchase. You can order Federal Wadcutters in lots of 4 boxes for about $17 a box including shipping, and there are also some online dealers out there that ship that many boxes free.
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Old 12-05-2012, 05:48 PM
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Thanks for the info guys! Yes it is a swing out cylinder and not a top-break. Serial number under the butt is also seen under the barrel and is covered by the hand ejector when it is closed. No markings at the rear face of the cylinder. If you ask me, it looks more like model 10 but is in 32 long. On the top side of the barrel is the patent dates, on the left (if you are holding it and the barrel facing outwards) is the "smith & wesson" marking and on the right is the .32 S&W long ctg. So guys, any more info? Can't find my bluetooth device to upload the pics.
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Old 12-05-2012, 06:17 PM
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Mine is kinda like the one pictured in this thread but it only says "Made in USA" near the trigger guard.

5" Smith & Wesson 32 Long Ctg. question
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Old 12-05-2012, 10:01 PM
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[QUOTE=algrennathan;136839484]Smith & Wesson .32 long CTG serial no. is 9844xx. 4" barrel[QUOTE]

This is the serial number you posted. Something is wrong with the number. If it is 98XXX, it would have been shipped before 1910, but the Made in USA stamp did not happen until the 1920s. Let us know what the numbers are on the bottom of the butt frame?

Last edited by glowe; 12-05-2012 at 10:05 PM.
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Old 12-05-2012, 10:34 PM
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He forgot to tell you guys the serial number is S 9844xx.
It is a 32 M&P.
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Old 12-05-2012, 10:41 PM
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What is really under the butt is "S 984439". I thought the S stands for serial so I just didn't add that before. And when you swing out the cylinder, you will see a different set of numbers, 63xx something..... it is inscride inside the frame below the barrel and in the part the connects the cylinder and the frame. So they face each other when close. I don't remember the numbers exactly but I do know they start with a 63. I don't have it handy right now but I will take a look at it when I get home.
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Old 12-05-2012, 11:12 PM
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Never mind, the anomaly is resolved. The 63XX # is a factory "soft fitting" number and useless in identifying the gun. The only purpose it serves is to verify that the other two parts where it is stamped, the yoke (cyl swingarm) and inside surface of the sideplate, have the matching # and they are all opriginal.
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Old 12-05-2012, 11:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by handejector View Post
He forgot to tell you guys the serial number is S 9844xx.
It is a 32 M&P.

M&P? Really?

What's the value of this gun?
And whats its official name/model? Also, date of manufacture (based on serial).

Last edited by algrennathan; 12-05-2012 at 11:19 PM.
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Old 12-05-2012, 11:45 PM
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32 Military & Police Post war c.1948.
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:16 AM
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OH WOW!

If your (and our) identification is correct, you have found one of the truly rare and most difficult to obtain of the M&P variants, one some of us had never heard of and most of us have never seen! Not only is it a rare one to own, but it should be lots of fun to shoot as well!

As for your ammo question; if we are correct and it is indeed built on a M&P frame, you have the option of shooting the 32 S&W Long for which it is actually chambered, the older, shorter 32 S&W (sometimes called "32 S&W Short") and even the semi-rimmed 32 ACP, with safety. As late as that serial number shows it to be, the heat treating is such that it can withstand pressures that any of these generate and still have a nice margin of safety.

Congratulations on a great find, and by all means please post pictures, we love pictures around here!

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Old 12-06-2012, 09:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hondo44 View Post
32 Military & Police Post war c.1948.
Hondo44 - Good job on ID. Not many of these show up.

algrennathan - Hondo has give you the correct name, simply 32 Military and Police. Just before the war, there was a K-32 Target with only 94 mfg, and during the same era as your revolver was manufactured, S&W made a K-32 Masterpiece. About 5000 of your model was made from 1948 to 1950 and the last SCSW publication had $2200 for Excellent; $1000 for Good Condition. Sure the prices are up from 2006.

Last edited by glowe; 12-06-2012 at 09:33 AM.
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Old 12-06-2012, 12:45 PM
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I wish I had been smart enough to figure out the model on the basis of the first post.

Congratulations on owning an uncommon and very collectible model!
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Old 12-06-2012, 07:31 PM
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Really? Its worth that much? The condition of this gun is pretty beat up. Rusts and and spots, and it looks like this was dropped many times due to the marks. But, it can still shoot and it doesn't rattle, meaning its still ok on the inside. Other than that, someone had a GREAT idea of coating it with wood varnish. In this kind of condition how much do you think its gonna worth, and, if I get it restored, will it worth $2000? Thanks guys!
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:22 PM
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algrennathan, not to put too fine a point on it, but originality is kinda like virginity, once it's gone, you can't put it back. Your gun is a rare and desirable piece that many collectors would be happy to get... even in its present condition. At most, cleaning it up (including stripping the "wood varnish") would be the most that most collectors would suggest. A total restoration would not increase the value of the gun by much more than its cost and might not even make that much, and a simple refinishing would probably hurt the value. Such are the vagaries of collectible guns!

Froggie
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by algrennathan View Post
Really? Its worth that much? . . . if I get it restored, will it worth $2000? Thanks guys!
If you get it restored by someone like David Chicoine it would probably be worth over $2000, but you might spend close to that much to get a first class restoration. As the availability of many models is shrinking, I think collectors are softening on the restoration issue, if and only if, it is done by a first class well respected gunsmith.
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Old 12-06-2012, 10:10 PM
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So how much do you think its worth at its current condition?

I really want to restore it because it just saddens to see a fine pistol in this condition. Not to mention its rarity. This is something that I would pass down to my grandson and I wouldn't wanna give it to them looking like a piece of junk.
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Old 12-06-2012, 10:56 PM
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Hard to say without a chance to study the gun or look at photos, but I would find it hard to shell out more than about $600 for what I see in my mind's eye based on your description. That's still about three times what I would pay for a contemporaneous .38 in similar condition. Others here might have different numbers in mind.

If you are thinking of this one as a keeper, I would say that refinishing (which I usually oppose) is not a horrible idea. But go to a real gunsmith, and not some strip and dip operation that doesn't know which pieces of a S&W were blued or nickeled, and which were case hardened. That gun will never have the value of an original .32 M&P again, but with the proper treatment you can keep the value from declining further. And if you are thinking of it as a family heirloom rather than an investment, there's less point in preserving it in its present abused condition.
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Old 12-06-2012, 11:37 PM
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Don't you guys think a picture is appropriate before going any further with Id/value?
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Old 12-07-2012, 01:25 AM
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According to the factory letters on the three of these revolvers that I have, the
factory categorizes them as Military & Police, chambered in 32 Long. The collectors
call them 32 Military & Police.



Mike Priwer

Last edited by mikepriwer; 12-07-2012 at 01:29 AM.
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Old 12-07-2012, 03:04 AM
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Glowe,
HE beat me to it.
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Old 12-07-2012, 10:43 AM
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good grief, mike! i am impressed with that trio, but i am astounded by that 2-inch one-liner! spectacular!

ed
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:41 AM
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good grief, mike! i am impressed with that trio, but i am astounded by that 2-inch one-liner! spectacular!

ed
Likewise. Can't be many of those!
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Old 12-10-2012, 01:02 AM
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Here are the pics. Sorry I can't provide any clearer images than this. Don't have a digicam. Only have my phone's cam right now. Any way, how much do you think its worth? And I dropped it last night. About 1 foot high. That's ok right? As long as it doesn't rattle or any visible damage, right?
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Old 12-10-2012, 01:44 AM
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Quote:
That's ok right? As long as it doesn't rattle or any visible damage, right?
For this gun, I'm sure its OK.

The gun shows a lot of wear and tear. The way the grips overhang the butt, they
are not original to the gun.

Its a scarce gun, but the condition overwhelms the scarity.

Mike Priwer
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Old 12-11-2012, 06:55 PM
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So how much do you think its worth?
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Old 12-11-2012, 08:49 PM
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About the most original finish I can conjure up from the photos is 10% but the stocks aren't original and there appears to be rust pits. Then considering the scarceness of 4813 reportedly made and referencing the Blu Book, I would estimate $250-275 at most with a fairly limited market because of condition.
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Old 12-11-2012, 08:58 PM
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I had no idea a M&P .32 Long brought so much money. I have seen two in the last year and half, not in great shape cosmetically, but both had clean bores/chambers and tight actions.
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:16 PM
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If that's the market value fo it in that condition then I think I'll have it restored then. Not to sell it after but to keep for myself. Since I'm not getting much from it, I think I'll make look decent for carry or for like a conversation piece. What do you think guys? I mean, its not worth much, right?
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Old 12-11-2012, 09:43 PM
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If you are going to refinish it, make sure they don't blue the trigger and hammer. Those parts are case hardened and should stay that way. There are several folks that redo old S&Ws including oldwestgunsmith.com (David Chicoine), fordsguns.com (Horace and Larna Ford) and apwcogan.com (Bob Cogan). Any of them will do a good job and get that old rust bucket back to looking good.
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Old 12-11-2012, 10:38 PM
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algrennathan,

I agree with Wiregrassguy! Don't let just anyone re-blue it. Because of it's scarcity, it's the exception to the rule of not being able to get the money invested for restoration back out of a common gun.

You wouldn't get the $2800 of a 98% original finish gun, but I think the market value would easily be the $800-1000 (or whatever it cost) for a proper restoration.
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Old 12-12-2012, 08:35 PM
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If I'm not gonna blue the trigger and hammer, what is the right finish for them? I mean, I can't just let be exposed to the elements right? Anything else I should know about in restoring this gun?

Thanks guys!
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Old 12-12-2012, 09:05 PM
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Either leave them as they are or find someone who will redo the case hardening.
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Old 12-12-2012, 09:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by algrennathan View Post
So how much do you think its worth?
Take the varnish off and then show us some good pics. It is hard to judge in that condition. It may not be so ugly with a good cleaning.
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Old 12-13-2012, 01:16 AM
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Originally Posted by algrennathan View Post
If I'm not gonna blue the trigger and hammer, what is the right finish for them? I mean, I can't just let be exposed to the elements right? Anything else I should know about in restoring this gun?

Thanks guys!
I'm glad to see you use the term restoring since it is not synonymous with refinishing. As Guy said, color case hardening is the original finish for the hammer and trigger. However, if you speak to a restorer, not a gunsmith, they will know these things and many others including the correct metal surface prep, correct original bluing process used and shade of bluing for the vintage of your gun and replicate it. As someone said above I would start with David Chicoine, a vintage S&W specialist who is recommended by S&W for guns too old for them to work on.
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Old 12-14-2012, 09:17 AM
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Does the 32 long M&P always have a "S" in the serial number? I recently saw a picture of one that had a "C" in the serial number. The seller states it is a K frame revolver and has a letter from Mr. Jinks.
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Old 12-14-2012, 10:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by algrennathan View Post
If that's the market value fo it in that condition then I think I'll have it restored then. Not to sell it after but to keep for myself. Since I'm not getting much from it, I think I'll make look decent for carry or for like a conversation piece. What do you think guys? I mean, its not worth much, right?
Were it me, I'd have it cleaned professionally by somebody who knows what they are doing and then reevaluate.

In any event, I'd probably not refinish. I tend to keep the guns I acquire in their current condition and enjoy their character...

You can never tell what a gun will be worth in the future, but you do know that it is rare and IF IN IT'S ORIGIONAL CONDITION it's collectable. Refinished, not so much.

The degree to which this revolver had decayed will dictate a very aggressive polish to remove pitting and I don't think you will be happy with an overly polished result with rounded edges, dished screw ports and lost markings....

Drew
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Old 12-14-2012, 10:18 AM
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There's a company called Blue Wonder that has a cleaner they say will remove rust and grunge without affecting the blue finish. You can see videos on their website.
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Old 12-14-2012, 04:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peyton View Post
Does the 32 long M&P always have a "S" in the serial number? I recently saw a picture of one that had a "C" in the serial number. The seller states it is a K frame revolver and has a letter from Mr. Jinks.
No, the 32 M&P production spanned the S and the C serial ranges.
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Old 12-14-2012, 10:39 PM
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Ok, so, case hardening on the trigger and hammer, bluing on frame and cylinder. Anything else do I need to know? Where can I get spare grips? I'm not looking for an original but I was thinking of some wood grips that is similar to an original or that looks like an original. And anyone know where I can buy a shoulder rig like the one used by Steve Buscemi in the last scenes of the fisrt episode of the third season of Boardwalk empire?

By the way, I took the gun to the range and Green Frog was right. There's no problem in using 32 autos in it and its more fun to shoot than a Ruger Security Six.
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Old 12-15-2012, 01:16 AM
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Thanks for that answer, since Algrennathan started this post I will blame him for spending my Christmas Whiskey drinking money on the 32 M&P I saw. Mike those are some fine examples for us to stare at!!
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Old 12-15-2012, 01:30 AM
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As stated above, you need a real pro for restoring that
gun. I've only got one firearm that was done by Dave Chicoine,
and the finished product speaks for itself. Call one of those
suggested, and get a ball-park estimate. That gun will brighten
your day for as long as you have it.
TACC1
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  #48  
Old 12-17-2012, 01:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peyton View Post
Thanks for that answer, since Algrennathan started this post I will blame him for spending my Christmas Whiskey drinking money on the 32 M&P I saw. Mike those are some fine examples for us to stare at!!
hehe..... Glad you've found yourself a nice piece. Trust me peyton, its all worth it.

Any, any leads on the grips and the rig? And anything else I should know about in restoring this piece?

Here's a picture of it with the Security Six.
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  #49  
Old 12-17-2012, 10:34 PM
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To be original, you need magna grips (which are on the gun now) with a blue washer holding the medallions.
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  #50  
Old 12-18-2012, 08:31 PM
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Ok, so where to get them?
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S&W Hand Ejectors: 1896 to 1961 Thread, Smith & Wesson .32 long CTG in Smith & Wesson Revolvers; Smith & Wesson .32 long CTG serial no. is 9844xx. 4" barrel. Does anyone has an idea about the age ...
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