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S&W Hand Ejectors: 1896 to 1961 All 5-Screw & Vintage 4-Screw SWING-OUT Cylinder REVOLVERS, and the 35 Autos and 32 Autos


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Old 01-26-2013, 11:33 PM
illini24 illini24 is offline
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I have question on rarity and value of a 44 post war targeti received from my dad. its sn#s712xx shows on all the proper spots. slight muzzle wear.hope pictures come through any info would be appreciated.









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Old 01-26-2013, 11:38 PM
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Oh now, that is nice. I'm pretty sure the grips aren't original but beyond that it looks right as rain.

Somebody else will come along with value. What ever it is it won't be cheap.
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Old 01-26-2013, 11:57 PM
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Uh, wow. This is a .44 Hand Ejector 3rd model, called a "transitional" because it has a few pre-war features remaining on it, like the "Made in U.S.A." stamping and the large head on the ejector rod. The serial number puts it as a 1947 shipped gun but few were made or sold, so it could have sat on a factory shelf for a while after production.

Hope you are sitting down. The standard reference for S & W states only between 30 and 50 of this model variation were produced, and yours falls into the known SN range. It is so rare there are probably no current data on sales, but the one mentioned in the book that sold in similar condition in 2006 went for over $10000. Please don't store in the holster, as this will affect the finish.

I would strongly recommend a factory letter to document this one:

Firearm History Request - Smith & Wesson

And here is the book referenced above:

Standard Catalog of Smith & Wesson (Standard Catalog of Smith and Wesson): Jim Supica, Richard Nahas: 9780896892934: Amazon.com: Books

Hope this is helpful, and be prepared for the e-drool and envy incoming!
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Old 01-26-2013, 11:58 PM
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Welcome to the Forum.

That is a great, and fairly rare, revolver. It is a .44 Hand Ejector 3rd Model (Postwar-Transititional) target version. Estimates are that less than 50 of these were built.

I'd put the value at around 5K, or more. Probably much more.
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Old 01-27-2013, 12:05 AM
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Lordy Mercy, I feel privileged to be here on the forum when this happened.
What a beautiful Smith&Wesson.
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Old 01-27-2013, 12:06 AM
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I'll give you $500 cash right now!!!

That my friend is a nice hand gun. I bet it shoots like a dream! Partial to .44 Special anyway.
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Old 01-27-2013, 09:24 AM
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"Uh, wow"
DITTO!
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Old 01-27-2013, 09:32 AM
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Your dad had fine taste in guns. I am impressed! Those are darn rare!
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Old 01-27-2013, 10:07 AM
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Oh yeah! Very, very nice! And yes, get that one lettered.
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Old 01-27-2013, 10:18 AM
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His taste in gun leather was also outstanding.
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Old 01-27-2013, 10:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lawandorder View Post
His taste in gun leather was also outstanding.
I guess I'm not the only one thinking that.

really like the non relieved targets too...eh 410 bore

Congratulations on receiving such a fine gift from your Father
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:06 AM
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I need a cold shower after viewing that beauty:-)

Thanks for the pics and the info from the forum experts.
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:27 AM
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I think the long action hammer and the ribbed barrel is about the best looking combination of features on a revolver. Gorgeous!!
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Old 01-27-2013, 01:28 PM
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I have no idea of the value. Ask Lee and David Carroll, then average their answers. Mine is a 4" gun and I have no idea how they filter out as to the number.

At a National Gun day Show maybe 6 or 7 years ago I had mine up for sale. I had no idea how to price it, all I knew was what I paid. So I put a sign on it for $5000. Lee wandered over and told me to take the stupid sign off it. If I left it up, I'd be going home without the gun.

Postwar 3rd model Targets are kind of hard to find, if only to look at. Buying one can be painful. Not long ago someone had a Military 3rd. Thats a fixed sight version. If you look you might find the post.

Given the condition, I'd guess $10,000, plus or minus. But be careful if you price it. There are folks out and about with checkbooks. They can't get any interest on their money, but they can hold and love a gun.
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:03 PM
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Beautiful!! DEFINITELY have it lettered right away!
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:17 PM
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Thanks for the information on my 44. My dad inherited a collection 50 years ago from an older man that he helped. Now he's starting to split it up between me and my brother. I guess I lucked out with my acquisitions. As for selling, it is going to stay in the family for awhile.
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rburg View Post
...Lee wandered over and told me to take the stupid sign off it.
That made me chuckle, not so much because it's funny but because it is sage advice from one collector to another. Lee, and others, do that for all of us from time to time. That's what makes this forum and the members who willingly share their knowledge and experience very special.

Illini24, you are one fortunate guy and you possess a stunning example of a rare and important piece of S&W history. Please get your .44HE 3rd Target lettered and contact the S&W Historical Foundation for additional information. I'd wager that it was a special order and that there is correspondence and other documentation in the archives. I'd sure like to see an in-depth article in the S&WCA Journal.

And...welcome!
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:47 PM
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Welcome to the forum, your 44 is the holy grail for many of us here! I bet it is a joy to shoot.

Are there any makers marks on the holster? It appears to be very nice also.

I wonder what other gems maybe hidden in your fathers collection!
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Old 01-27-2013, 03:00 PM
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Thanks Tom and Mike I will be lettering it along with a couple others that I received. As for the holster it is a H.H.Heiser.
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Old 01-27-2013, 06:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by illini24 View Post
Thanks Tom and Mike I will be lettering it along with a couple others that I received. As for the holster it is a H.H.Heiser.
Well you get the idea of the treasure you have by now and I agree. I thought the holster was Heiser which of course is a Holy Grail of the vintage holster world.

And there is one thing nobody has mentioned. Your gun appears to have a rare transitional version of smooth presentation target stocks w/o football cutout. It would be between one of the rarest of factory target stocks which are the early 1950's special-order-only Smooth "coke bottles" or "cokes" target stocks Pg. 23, SCSW, 3rd ed. They look like this with long wood behind the trigger guard and pronounced flare at the butt:



They are not to be confused with the later standard smooth targets w/cutouts that are not "cokes" shown below:



Nicknamed "cokes" because when viewed from the rear they have a slight swell in the center on each side known as a palm swell that resembles the old coke bottles. They are much more scarce than the later 1956 checkered version "cokes" with cutout, 1st available on the then new 44 Magnums.



Do yours have the palm swell? They're worth the $500 alone that someone offered you in jest for the gun.
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Old 01-27-2013, 06:36 PM
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That is a gorgeous looking handgun. Congratulations. Great insights from the experts too. Talk about learning something everyday. I know why I stay hanging out in this place!!!
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Old 01-27-2013, 07:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Gila Bender View Post
That made me chuckle, not so much because it's funny but because it is sage advice from one collector to another. Lee, and others, do that for all of us from time to time. That's what makes this forum and the members who willingly share their knowledge and experience very special.

Illini24, you are one fortunate guy and you possess a stunning example of a rare and important piece of S&W history. Please get your .44HE 3rd Target lettered and contact the S&W Historical Foundation for additional information. I'd wager that it was a special order and that there is correspondence and other documentation in the archives. I'd sure like to see an in-depth article in the S&WCA Journal.

And...welcome!
It would be fascinating if there is documentation in the archives. If you follow through on the advice would you then post the results on the forum?
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Old 01-27-2013, 08:34 PM
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Anything I find out about the revolver I'll be sure to post. With all the info I got from all of you I feel it should returned.
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Old 01-27-2013, 08:43 PM
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Hondo yes the stocks are cokes the sn is stamped into them not penciled does that have any meaning
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Old 01-27-2013, 08:46 PM
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WOW, the stocks are numbered????

I have refrained from posting in this thread because the subject matter has me tongue tied in amazement but now I must say something.....

This is the most beautiful N Frame Revolver I have ever seen....To put it in other words, I would gladly sell my truck to fund the purchase of this fine firearm and walk to work everyday
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Old 01-27-2013, 08:55 PM
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Your dad's older friend must have special-ordered the gun with the stocks, as these would not have been the standard type. The letter may even name him if so.
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Old 01-27-2013, 09:10 PM
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I do know the mans name that bought the gun. my dad seems to think it was bought at F.A.O Shwarts in Chicago. Does having the original box have even more meaning?
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Old 01-27-2013, 09:16 PM
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illini24, uncheckered versions of the oversized or "Target" grips with no ejector relief on the left panel are seldom seen. And serial numbers were rarely stamped inside Target grips.
In your single gun there are many features which make it rare and valuable.
Thanks so much for sharing this heirloom jewel with us.
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Old 01-27-2013, 09:19 PM
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Yes, add a couple thousand or so to the value, if you also have the contents (paperwork. cleaning kit and sight adjustment tool); less than that if "only" the box.

I think FAO Schwarz is a toy store and only in NYC. Perhaps Abercrombie & Fitch or another high-end sporting goods of the period?

You're killing us!
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Old 01-27-2013, 09:30 PM
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Allen that's what I thought about F.A.O when my dad told me. But the man worked downtown chi-town so I guess I'll have to wait for a letter.
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Old 01-27-2013, 09:39 PM
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The stocks alone would pay for my mothly house and electric.
I've only seen 2 other pairs.

I've had many .44SPLs in your range but none as nice.

(If you return it who knows what will happen to it. Ask your Dad if you can auction it and split the funds with him. Now is an excellent time- the market is loaded with retired people like my self who are buying lots of collectable guns.)

Nicest ear gun I have seen !
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Old 01-27-2013, 09:40 PM
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Holy Cow! With every additional piece of information this spectacular gun just gets better and better!

This makes my day. I am absolutely delighted to see a gun as rare and special as this one surface on this forum. I am so happy to see it that I don't even mind the fact that I don't own it!
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Old 01-27-2013, 09:43 PM
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Quote:
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Hondo yes the stocks are cokes the sn is stamped into them not penciled does that have any meaning
Stocks were originally stamped in the 19th century, penciled in the 20th until 1929, then stamped again until they were no longer numbered in the late 1970's.

It's more meaningful that they are numbered to the gun at all! Another clue that they were special ordered for the gun. Very unusual for target stocks to be numbered because they take much less individual fitting (only the backstrap) and don't have to be fitted specific to each gun.
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Old 01-27-2013, 09:56 PM
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I really appreciate all of the info from all S&W lovers on the forum. I'll have to post pictures of my 357's in the near future.
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Old 01-27-2013, 09:58 PM
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Quote:
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I really appreciate all of the info from all S&W lovers on the forum. I'll have to post pictures of my 357's in the near future.
please do!
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Old 01-27-2013, 09:58 PM
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WOW is all I can come up with.



Charlie
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Old 01-28-2013, 12:34 AM
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Transitional .44HE 3rd Target...with special-order target stocks numbered to the gun...and the box.

I have to go lay down for ahwile.
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Old 02-23-2013, 07:44 PM
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Well sent in for letter on the revolver in the thread should be coming in near future. I'm excited to see what is said by Roy about the gun.
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Old 02-23-2013, 09:00 PM
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Quote:
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Well sent in for letter on the revolver in the thread should be coming in near future. I'm excited to see what is said by Roy about the gun.
You are probably looking at about a six- to eight-week wait, but the load on Roy varies unpredictably. I have had letters come back in as little as three weeks. Once it took nearly four months.

Looking forward to hearing the verdict!
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Old 02-24-2013, 11:20 AM
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The 1926 44 Target revolver posted is very rare and desirable. However, the target stocks are not original to the gun (even if they are numbered to it) unless the gun was shipped in the 1950s. Target stocks did not exist in the 40s and the type on the revolver are not the early type seen in 52/53. The stocks most likely date to 54-56 and are made of Goncalo alves.

I owned a gun like yours for several years that was NIB. It has serial number S71099 and was shipped on November 7, 1947. It was fitted with Magna stocks numbered to the revolver. The S&W monograms in the 40s are slightly different that those seen in 1950 and later.

Bill
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Old 02-24-2013, 12:53 PM
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illini24,

If the original owner purchased the gun in downtown Chicago, it is highly likely that he purchased it from Von Lengerke and Antoine, which was owned by Abercrombie and Fitch. It was a fascinating high-end sporting goods store. I visited the store several times in 1954 and 1955 when my father was getting outfitted for an African safari. David Carroll has a Registered Magnum for sale that letters to VLA.

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Jeff
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Old 02-24-2013, 04:10 PM
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The store may have been A&F, themselves. I was in Chicago in 1968 as part of a college field trip, and went to A&F. Wonderful place!

Chicago was a rude city. Many in our group commented on that. The only places that seemed polite, even friendly, were Abercrombie & Fitch and the Playboy Club. (My teacher's boyfriend was a member at the latter and we attended as his guests. I wrote a story on it for the university newspaper.)

I think it was in A&F that year that I first saw and handled Zeiss binoculars. They also sold some Randall knives. I owned a Randall by then, but it was a few years before I could afford a Zeiss, which I still have.

It was a sad day when The Limited bought the A&F name and made it into a ladies clothing store!

FAO Schwartz is indeed a NYC-based toy store. They used to have a branch in Dallas; may still have.

With all the interest in the .44 Special, they seem not to have really sold well. I think primarily handloaders were interested, because of the weak factory loads. This gun may not have shipped for years. I think a factory letter is almost imperative! My guess is that Roy Jinks will be very interested in this gun.

This rare variation is too pricey a gun to shoot, alas. It has to be viewed as an investment and as a national treasure.

Illini-

Can you clean up and lighten the photos? Many of us would like to save them, to put in our reference books. But they need to be brighter and sharper. This is a historic gun. It deserves sharp pics! I applaud your decision not to sell. Keep that Heiser holster, too. But keep the gun in the box, not n the leather. I see someone has already advised you not to store a gun in the holster..

Last edited by Texas Star; 02-24-2013 at 04:31 PM.
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Old 02-24-2013, 04:45 PM
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illini24,

Google Von Lengerke and Antoine and click on the Vintage Gun Leather link for more information about VL&A. The website notes that VL&A was an H.H. Heiser dealer.

Texas Star,
If you found Chicago to be a rude city, you are very fortunate that you did not visit during the 1968 Democratic Convention.

Best regards,

Jeff

Last edited by further12; 02-24-2013 at 04:46 PM. Reason: Misspelled my name!
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Old 02-24-2013, 04:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by illini24 View Post
Does having the original box have even more meaning?
It has about $1000 to $1500 worth of meaning!
That's what you can add to what the gun will be worth without it.
Let's see more pics, please!

As you know, you have a fabulously rare and desirable gun.
Something about the gun bothers me in the pics, though.
It COULD be the pics.
Do this please- pull the grips, and tell us if there are any stamps on the bottom left grip frame.
Tell us or show us everything stamped in the barrel shroud, please.
What is on the bottom of the butt with the serial number?
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Old 02-24-2013, 09:07 PM
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Lee on the bottom nothing is there but sn#. On the left side of frame is an S with a 4 under it. In the yoke area sn# shows then a S. Lower downis a Y 1 2439. I will try to get clearer pictures. What is it that bothers you Lee?
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Old 02-24-2013, 11:06 PM
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And in the barrel shroud behind the extractor rod?
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Old 02-24-2013, 11:23 PM
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hope the pictures come through and are clear, will post letter when I receive it.

Last edited by handejector; 02-25-2013 at 11:10 AM. Reason: fixed pic codes
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Old 02-24-2013, 11:39 PM
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This thread is the perfect reason why I love the S&W Forum ... Unexpected treasure, expert opinions, good will all around.

A fine revolver presented to as fine a group of experts and aficionados.
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Old 02-24-2013, 11:41 PM
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i fixed your image that came up as text

looks good to me

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Old 02-24-2013, 11:45 PM
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thanks410 my son needs to be here to help transfer pictures, but he's at college.
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