So I came across a pair of S&W 1917's, I think both are Brazilian contract pistols. One is a nice refinish, with all numbers matching except the yoke. The other is a bit of a basket case, as the cylinder was straight reamed for what I can only figure is to shoot 45LC. So I have to either make a cylinder or buy a replacement that will work, past that and no barrel its a complete pistol.

My plan is to build two pistols that fall into a 1950's-60's period custom build. Im going to shorten up the barrels to around 3" and build a carry/duty type pistol. I was looking for some famous gunsmiths or modifications being done to Smith Wesson pistols at that time. also looking for custom stocks designs of the era. I already have a few plans in the work, but wanted to make sure I didn't miss anything or overlook a idea. looking forward to the ideas brought up, but remember nothing modern. As for finish im thinking right now one will be case colored frame and the other nickel

USNRigger

You might want to look into "Jovino" styled revolvers. I'm not a gunsmith, but I believe it's not an easy conversion to do. You can find many examples here on the forum.

BTW, mine is a 25-2 which came out in 1961, and is based on the Model 1955 ,45 Target.

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Very Cool, not worried about the difficulty of the conversion, I have access to mill, lathe, CNC and even 3d scanners if I need it. Im currently a Gunsmithing student at Trinidad and have a revolver class next semester. I would love to do a full lug barrel, but finding a 2"OD blank has been impossible, by the time next semester starts. I will either have to do a standard profile barrel or attach a under lug via silver solder or screws and then file them to disappear(or both). I do love the look of the pistol, I have a 625 3" and looks very close to it. I assume with it being a 25 its hard chrome or something close? Lets keep em coming.

USNRigger

I believe it is hard chromed. Jovino would cut a 4", or longer barrel, which removed the lock on the ejector rod and installed a spring loaded ball in the ejector shroud with a detent groove in the face of the yoke to make the front lock. The whole concept was an inspiration for many. Good luck with your project.

Oh, yes I have seen this. I did not know who did the work though. That's very cool and I may look at something like that. I did some work tonight out in the shop as its was not as cold as it has been. Its coming along nicely but slowly. I'm doing most of the work by hand on the first one so I have a solid pattern and can cut the rest on a band saw .050" over size and do the rest with file and paper. Still have quite a bit of shaping to do on this one and then to make and fit the rubber piece. Enjoy.

My suggestion would be to try and duplicate a George Mathews custom carry revolver from the late 40's to the early 70's. You can see pictures of these in the 1970 guns and ammo annual as well as on Mike Priwars' pictures in his album pages here on the Forum. Some of the modifications performed were, thinning the trigger guard, shortening the barrel to 3 or 3 1/2 inch, modifying the hammer, smoothing the trigger, building and fitting a custom rib with an adjustable integral rear sight{one assembly} and otherwise making the revolver very easy to use for "professional" daily carry. Contact forum member SG-688 for additional pictures and advice. All my best,and good luck on your project, Joe.

USNrigger,

I'm old enough to be familiar with that period and in fact have a couple examples of custom 1917 and 455 British military contract Smiths done then.

Very popular modifications included:

1. Shortening the barrels to 4" usually, sometimes less and even eliminating the front locking lug, but this 1950 mod predated and did not include use of the replacement ball detent in the yoke ala Jovina.

2. Fitz-ized cut away trigger guard in conjunction w/# 1 above.

3. Tyler T grip adapters with Magna grips was also popular with the short barrels in #1. Some were actually clever and artistic welded-on gap fillers behind the trigger guard; as well as various home made or custom grip iterations like rounded butts for concealed carry.

4. Milling in the then new factory Micro click adjustable rear sight. Sometimes just a rear sight blade was milled into the frame in conjunction with the shortened barrels above like the S&W early 1900's Bisley match compliant installations.

5. Installing a front sight made from a rifle front sight ramp which usually extended all the way to the frame which replicated a barrel rib and provided a good base with the height needed for the blade. A front blade shaped like Smith's short barrel target Baughman 'quick draw'. I have one of these that my dad had done, but no photo.

6. Or swapping the barrel for a new 1950 target 6 1/2" barrel with shroud and front target sight and rib (later, the heavy 1955 target barrel); both to make the gun an NRA Bullseye Match competitive shooter. King and Micro Sight custom sights, ribs and cockeyed hammers were added by the more affluent.

7. Custom target grips were the norm w/#6 above.

8. 455s were converted to 45 ACP or 45 Colt in conjunction with the above.

Here's a late pre war modified 1917 I own converted to target by a former owner. Redfield front site blade milled in, pre war S&W rear site milled in, Micro site double cockeyed hammer. Stocks are early 1950s smooth cokes:







Hope that helps with some ideas.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

The S&W model 1917 is a great platform for a project revolver. I favor the .44 Special and this is my current project. It was an old gutted .455 that I got from a parts dealer at a local gun show. It was a conversion from .455 to .45acp when I got it. Amazing that the barrel, cylinder, and side plate were still together. The cylinder had been modified to accept the moon clips for the .45acp and the barrel shortened to 4" (see barrel with blue tape in photo). You might want to consider the .44 caliber for your project. Enjoy your labor of love!!!

Thanks for the input guys, im finding lots of good ideas from it. 44 Special would be cool and had considered it, but here is my question to that. What cylinders will work, can be made to work with the 1917. Ive seen some early model 27 cylinders, 44-40, and so on but do I need to look for something in a S serial number range prior to the shorter cocking change in the 40's? I need to get my but into the library on campus and do some heavy reading. I will try to put a adjustable sight on atleast one if I can find a older micro adjust sight. I guess I need to hunt down some parts.

The shorter cocking action does not affect the cyl. You can use any 44 Spl cyl with just the usual fitting, shorten a 44 Mag cyl which will give you a maximum strength cyl albeit with shorter throats, or ream any vintage 357 cal cyl to 44 which again would be a maximum strength cyl due to the heat treating.

44-40 chambers are too large for 44 spl but would make a nice extra convertible cyl if you load with .429" bullets.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

A lot of the old boys when they shortened a barrel would put a band around the end of the muzzle to fix the front sight to. Mark

Well, I really like the 44 special and I think that's what im going to go with on one of these pistols. Now to hunt down a 357/44 cylinder for it. Im liking some of the King front sights, might even try to re-make a reflector with gold bead front sight. whats the going rate for a clean cylinder these days?

"I will try to put a adjustable sight on atleast one if I can find a older micro adjust sight."

IMHO, Micro sights sit too high on a revolver, especially a fixed sighted one. Get a standard S&W rear sight and have the frame milled for it. I fitted a post WW II sight into a 1917 using a file and a Dremel tool.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

usnrigger,

PM sent.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

Here's a couple photos of a cool custom piece. Not mine so not sure which model Colt it is, but I think it's a 1917 or maybe a New Service. I'm not wild about a fitzed trigger guard but the rest of it is sure cool. This one's short butt is pretty extreme but if you put a k-sized round butt on yours you'd have some good grip options. Chamber it for 44 spl or 45 Colt, or maybe even 45acp. Personally I would make it more of a belly gun and just stick with fixed sights. And a nice low-profile matte blue or parkerized finish.

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I'm just salivating over the possibilities for this project!

Since you put your "target dates" in the '50s, I would suggest that you forego the pre-War adjustable sights and go with the mechanically superior and much easier to obtain post-War adjustables since they would be what was available and current at that time.

On the gun with a ruined cylinder (and if you are replacing the barrel anyway) a 44 Special would be far beyond cool, especially in a target model. Making your own King-style rib for it would also add to the curb appeal and score style points with your instructors.

Another non-standard added feature that would set your finished work off would be to checker the grip frame (a la the Colt target models) to practice and demonstrate your skills in that regard. Remember, this is going to be a statement to all who see it that you are a revolversmith who deserves notice!

All the best and may all your efforts be crowned with success.
Froggie

Green frog, I have made arrangements for a 44 special cylinder and will be putting that on the one I have to replace/make a barrel for. I need to order a 30lpi checkering file as I only have a 20lpi and 40lpi in my box right now. This is what I will be doing to the backstrap. I really like a lot of King Gun Works stuff, from the reflector sight, Super Target Rib, Cockeye'd Hammer all is very cool and I think it would really turn heads.

Does anyone have photos of a King Reflector from multiple angles a could give me a few dimensions; width, length, LPI on the serrations? A photo with the sight insert out would also help a lot.

Edit w/ Update: Ive been running around the web on this Sunday and have come up with a basic game plan. The one I have with the buggered cylinder I have been graced with a 44 Special replacement from a Member here. Im going to do a target model with some King Gun Works inspiration and some extras pulled from other smiths of the time as well as other models of the day.

The complete gun will be made into a carry/duty gun with a 3-3.5" barrel and be retained in 45acp. Im looking at doing some grip rework/recontouring, and will keep the fixed factory sights but might add a cool front sight to the mix.

Now im in the one hunt for a 44 spl barrel blank and more research and photo hunting on the things id like to do to these two classics.

USNrigger,

Here's an actual example in this thread:
Unique Modified Triple-Lock

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Jim
S&WCA #819

Also, please consider the copy of the pre-war adjustable sight that Dave Clements makes.

Clements Custom Guns

You also might find this of interest.

Smith & Wesson Forum - bmg60's Album: 4 inch triple lock - Picture

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S&WCA 1729

Chech out posts by Keith44.
rayb

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"cumplo pero no obedezco"

As far as barrel length goes, the 3 1/2" model 27 is sweet lookin. I think the same length would be nice in the heavy non-tapered barrel also. Good luck with some cool ideas. Larry

keith44 has consistently amazed me with very well done custom guns.

Various calibers, various barrel lengths and both fixed and adjustable sights.

Highly evolved and great choices.

His guns are an education in knowing your way around function and
beauty for N frames.

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I Love This Site

Going to do a King Cockeye'd hammer. Will sit down on the TIG tomorrow morning and see what I come up with. I will get photos up Friday night

USNRigger

How about a King "Double Cockeye'd Hammer"? Those are far more rare! Wide on both sides, they're very cool.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

Do they look like a target hammer? I didn't get a chance on Friday to sit down on the TIG. I did get the piece im going to weld shaped out, it will most likely Monday.

Yes, it does. Extensions to both side.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

I think im going to stick with the Cockeyed hammer over the double. My reasoning's are im not D.W. King and I will not mark my work to look like his. My goal is to bring back a time on a classic pistol when things had simple elegance. I think if someone saw it they be like oh cool a target hammer and not "Wow! well researched redux cockeyed hammer". Not trying to forge a mans legacy only respectfully add his influences to my works. As with time all things come back into fashion. look at the automobile lines of today, they are modern takes on old classics.

Since it's your gun, the best thing is, you get to choose. They don't look at all like a modern target hammer except of course they are wider. The key to the cockeyed and/or double cockeyed hammers is retaining the original hammer side profile with the top curve and teardrop under the tip as shown above in post #7. That's why I like them. But of course you don't have to do that either.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

I'm going to try and get the profile right. I may have to go off the hammer in my 1917 as someone at sometime brazed or soldered some sort of extension onto this hammer....

I did get started on the polishing. This is 120grit hand polish and I still have a long way to go. Lots of little corners and nooks on these things. I also pulled out my set of stones to work some of the heavy dings and pits. I will work the hole thing up to 240grit and just hold there till I get everything in place, modified ext.. before I go higher. I have most of the dings pits our as she sits and I will go back and take the handful of large dings and pits out as I will have to blend and re-contour radius and flats to keep those nice sharp lines and corners. I did stay away from the area where the side plate goes in as Im in the works of hunting down one that I can save the S&W logo as the one I have I would have to leave it faint or wipe it out. Since this pistol does not have the small left side logo, nor the Made In USA I think it would be nice to have some sort of marking nice and strong. Also, what is the little "W" looking thing on the left side right above the front of trigger guard?

Enjoy!

I've not seen a W or any stamp in that location from the factory. I have seen import marks in that location when a US importer brings a gun back into the country; usually the importer's logo or name. I understand that it's required these days.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

Okay, so alittle update on parts. I found a barrel and it should be in the mail Monday, as well as the cylinder. Like I said earlier im going to rebuild this one in 44spl. The barrel I found is a 6.5" 44 with out the under-lug and setup for fixed sights. So as of right now I have all missing parts for this classic. Im still going to try and find a nicer sideplate to substitute for the worn one I have.