|
|
12-31-2013, 07:01 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 360
Likes: 0
Liked 425 Times in 110 Posts
|
|
U.S. Navy Victory Model…The Rest of the Story. - FOLLOW UP ADDED!
I purchased this S&W Navy marked Victory revolver along with the pilot holster from a local dealer about 2 years ago and the adventure began there. Amazingly enough, there was a name (Bert Morgan) and flight group (VT-1) still inked on the back of the strap. The revolver is the standard issue U.S.NAVY marked version.
The strap, clearly a riggers addition, holds 31 rounds...have no idea why 31.
After two years of researching military records, identifying the location(s) of VT-1 in WWII (carrier USS BENNINGTON by the way), I was able to contact some of the original surviving crew members. They were able to confirm AMM3 Morgan was indeed on the USS BENNINGTON and provided an "on deck" photo. He was the third crew member on an "Avenger". Planes from the USS BENNINGTON also helped sink the Japanese Battleship Yamato and also overflew the Japanese signing of the surrender onboard the USS MISSOURI.
The only other info they had was he was listed as a student/farmer from Aredale, Iowa. The wife and I saddled the Electra Glide and traveled to Iowa one weekend, just on the off chance we could find more info. After many "have you heard of" and "do you knows", we were able to locate AMM3 Morgan.
We were able to meet his wife and she supplied the "rest" of the story along with a photograph of her husband. Emotional day. As we rode back toward home, I couldn't help think how bittersweet this was. This chapter on my Victory Model and holster was closed, but more importantly, I came a little closer to a common man from Iowa that stepped forward one day when we needed him...and he flew into history.
Thought you might enjoy this story. Rarely do we get to tie the gun to the man. Makes it just a little more "special".
Last edited by 2K7; 07-12-2017 at 01:43 PM.
|
The Following 124 Users Like Post:
|
.455_Hunter, 1blindref, 2ndshift, 30-30remchester, 357magster, 4506517, 824tsv, Aquarik, AZretired, Bat Guano, bbqncigars, beagleye, bettis1, bgrafsr, Big Cholla, BigMuddy, blockislander, bob1956, britbike1, bruce5781, BUFF, Butch447, C Broad Arrow, Camster, Chuck24, Class III, cmj8591, Collects, coogan, CordWood, da gimp, Darryl C., Davwingman, delta-419, deltazulu334, desi2358, deyomatic, Diamondtreo, Donald Paul, doowtag, Douglas8860, DWL, epj, firemanhank, Foxtrot40, Frank121, gaucho1, george_lehr, gkitch, Glashaus, Goblin, Grayback, Green Frog, Guero, GUNMIKE, gunnails, hardscrabble, Hoosier45, Iggy, j38, JayCeeNC, jhde69, Jimmy1973, JOBYT, JPriest, jrs70, jsfricks, JustinL, K Frame Keith, kimporter, lebomm, Lee Barner, LOBO, loknload, marinevet, Mike Q., model17, Monte_Northam, moosedog, Mr Pokeyman, MrTrolleyguy, Mtnfolk325, Muddyboot, Muley Gil, murphydog, NavyFrank, nedlate, nevada duke, OFT II, Ohsheepdog, OIF2, opoefc, Oscar Zulu, PALADIN85020, PH-2, ralph7, retiredbadge8091, richcory, samandglove1, Semper Fi 57, Seven High, sholsclaw, shouldazagged, skeetshooter, sophie, Southernboy, specialist44, STCM(SW), sureshotbob, Sverre, Texas Star, THE PILGRIM, tjpopkin, tom32, Toyman, TRE, Trooperdan, two-bit cowboy, Waidmann, Watchdog, Welder1, wmd1940, wundudnee, zoisrus |
12-31-2013, 07:08 PM
|
|
SWCA Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Central TX
Posts: 2,617
Likes: 998
Liked 4,494 Times in 1,232 Posts
|
|
Very cool! Thanks for posting.
__________________
Kevin Williams SWCA1649 HF208
|
12-31-2013, 07:17 PM
|
SWCA Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Sunny Florida, USA
Posts: 1,824
Likes: 120
Liked 4,127 Times in 812 Posts
|
|
2K7:
Neat revolver and great history. Thanks for posting.
BTW, what is the serial number on your nice Victory? (I'd like to add it to our Victory Model Database.)
__________________
Charlie Flick
SWCA 729 HF 215
|
12-31-2013, 07:19 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Oregon
Posts: 668
Likes: 1,138
Liked 646 Times in 255 Posts
|
|
Wow.......
|
12-31-2013, 07:35 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Massachusetts, USA
Posts: 2,743
Likes: 1,161
Liked 4,451 Times in 1,598 Posts
|
|
Great story!
|
12-31-2013, 07:36 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 360
Likes: 0
Liked 425 Times in 110 Posts
|
|
Charlie,
Sent you a second pm with another one and pictures. Forum message says your message quota is to full to receive it until you delete a few.
Enjoy the pics.
Jed
|
12-31-2013, 07:41 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 91
Likes: 2
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
|
|
Thank you for posting this, and Thank you ,AMM3 Morgan , for your service. Happy New Year all.
|
12-31-2013, 07:41 PM
|
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: E. Washington State
Posts: 5,476
Likes: 1,321
Liked 10,568 Times in 3,212 Posts
|
|
Nice story!
Only thing I don't understand is what does a snipe need a revolver for?
__________________
Only difference Fool/Mule-ears
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
12-31-2013, 07:54 PM
|
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Birmingham, Alabama
Posts: 4,481
Likes: 227
Liked 2,397 Times in 1,081 Posts
|
|
Aircrew. AMM= Aviation Machinists Mate 3rd Class. E-4. The guy in the back seat manning the gun or torpedo needed a sidearm just as much as the guy in the front seat driving.
|
12-31-2013, 07:57 PM
|
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Texas
Posts: 2,999
Likes: 181
Liked 2,719 Times in 724 Posts
|
|
Thanks for doing some outstanding research. Whenever we can link one of these old workhorses to the warriors who used them we are touching the face of the past. Good work!
Bob
|
12-31-2013, 07:58 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Birmingham AL
Posts: 578
Likes: 358
Liked 273 Times in 156 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by STCM(SW)
Nice story!
Only thing I don't understand is what does a snipe need a revolver for?
|
Issue for aircrew. Besides self-defense (many preferred revolvers for reliability in a salt-water environment), but also (and perhaps primarily) for signalling; there was a tracer round issued for the revolver.
__________________
Registration? NEVER!
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
12-31-2013, 08:00 PM
|
SWCA Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 7,852
Likes: 11,782
Liked 13,763 Times in 3,347 Posts
|
|
Great post. Good job on your research too. Thank you.
|
12-31-2013, 08:02 PM
|
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Homerville, Ohio
Posts: 5,394
Likes: 28,584
Liked 9,201 Times in 2,374 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by STCM(SW)
Nice story!
Only thing I don't understand is what does a snipe need a revolver for?
|
Okay what is AMM3 and a snipe?
|
12-31-2013, 08:30 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Birmingham AL
Posts: 578
Likes: 358
Liked 273 Times in 156 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by bgrafsr
Okay what is AMM3 and a snipe?
|
AMM3 is an Aviation Machinist's Mate 3d Class
A 'snipe' is slang for a ship's engine room crewmember. They are also known as 'the black gang', due to coal dust or fuel oil.
__________________
Registration? NEVER!
|
12-31-2013, 08:33 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 360
Likes: 0
Liked 425 Times in 110 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by epj
Aircrew. AMM= Aviation Machinists Mate 3rd Class. E-4. The guy in the back seat manning the gun or torpedo needed a sidearm just as much as the guy in the front seat driving.
|
One of the perplexing questions I had to ask as well, not being a Navy guy. Why would the guy that "wrenched" the plane need a revolver.
After speaking with "old crew" members from the USS BENNINGTON, they schooled me on the issue, damned fast!
AMM3 was the 3rd crew member on the plane and his position was facing backwards in the belly of the plane manning the rear machine guns just forward of the tail wheel.
|
The Following 5 Users Like Post:
|
|
12-31-2013, 08:35 PM
|
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: E. Washington State
Posts: 5,476
Likes: 1,321
Liked 10,568 Times in 3,212 Posts
|
|
And a fellow sailor would think I don't know what a AMM3 is?
Sad.....
__________________
Only difference Fool/Mule-ears
|
12-31-2013, 08:53 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Birmingham AL
Posts: 578
Likes: 358
Liked 273 Times in 156 Posts
|
|
From Wiki on the third crew-member, who was also the bombardier/radio operator:
"his gun was fired by the radioman/bombardier while standing up and bending over in the belly of the tail section, though he usually sat on a folding bench facing forward to operate the radio and to sight in bombing runs. Later models of the TBF/TBM dispensed with the nose-mounted gun for one .50 caliber gun in each wing per pilots' requests for better forward firepower and increased strafing ability. There was only one set of controls on the aircraft, and no access to the pilot's position from the rest of the aircraft. The radio equipment was massive, especially by today's standards, and filled the whole glass canopy to the rear of the pilot. The radios were accessible for repair through a "tunnel" along the right hand side."-- Grumman TBF Avenger - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Enlisted rank didn't directly correlate to duties. For example, my father was an Aviation Metalsmith, but flew as a gunner in SBDs.
__________________
Registration? NEVER!
|
12-31-2013, 08:53 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Birmingham AL
Posts: 578
Likes: 358
Liked 273 Times in 156 Posts
|
|
BTW, this is a most fascinating thread drift!
__________________
Registration? NEVER!
|
12-31-2013, 09:01 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: kansas
Posts: 568
Likes: 415
Liked 486 Times in 226 Posts
|
|
What a story…..great research,…. a great weapon, and rig…… that helped win WW2……Thank you AMM3 Morgan….for your service to this country……
Semper Fi!
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
12-31-2013, 09:27 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: The Old North State
Posts: 2,219
Likes: 2,866
Liked 3,200 Times in 1,081 Posts
|
|
This is probably the best thread if its type I have read here.
Truly the Greatest Generation.
__________________
Un-Reconstructed Southerner
|
The Following 3 Users Like Post:
|
|
12-31-2013, 09:37 PM
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: OR
Posts: 3,521
Likes: 5,496
Liked 1,026 Times in 350 Posts
|
|
What an edifying post! Thanks for sharing your work.
Jerry
|
12-31-2013, 09:47 PM
|
|
SWCA Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: N GA
Posts: 4,466
Likes: 204
Liked 3,613 Times in 1,498 Posts
|
|
Did you ever get a factory letter? You are a lucky man to have found that rig and then the rest of the story. I especially like the gravesite photo. Well done!
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
12-31-2013, 10:21 PM
|
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: atlanta ga
Posts: 639
Likes: 240
Liked 286 Times in 158 Posts
|
|
That's awesome.
the original point and click interface, by Smith and Wesson
|
12-31-2013, 10:28 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Texas Panhandle
Posts: 7,183
Likes: 5,551
Liked 3,392 Times in 1,706 Posts
|
|
Great story and thanks for sharing.
__________________
James
On the Llano Estacado
|
12-31-2013, 10:48 PM
|
|
SWCA Member Absent Comrade
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Land of Lakes
Posts: 895
Likes: 1,299
Liked 953 Times in 408 Posts
|
|
Thank you for your research and for sharing this perspective on a piece of our country's history.
Dave
__________________
mr mom
Fire Chief, Retired
|
12-31-2013, 10:57 PM
|
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: S.E. PA
Posts: 1,370
Likes: 71
Liked 1,167 Times in 521 Posts
|
|
The amazing thing about these old vets is how humble they are. I had an older gentleman thank me for my service when he found out I was a retired Chief. I said your welcome and noticed a ring on his hand as I was shaking it. I asked "which academy?". Turns out he was a Naval Academy grad, class of 43 (I think) and had ended the war onboard a sub in the Pacific making war against Jap convoys. I was awestruck (being a submariner myself) and told him I should be thanking him instead. His reply was "But I only served 4 years"!
|
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
|
|
12-31-2013, 11:06 PM
|
|
SWCA Member
|
|
|
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Rhode Island
Posts: 188
Likes: 407
Liked 592 Times in 77 Posts
|
|
Great story!
|
01-01-2014, 12:19 AM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Birmingham AL
Posts: 578
Likes: 358
Liked 273 Times in 156 Posts
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by pineappleshooter
The amazing thing about these old vets is how humble they are. I had an older gentleman thank me for my service when he found out I was a retired Chief. I said your welcome and noticed a ring on his hand as I was shaking it. I asked "which academy?". Turns out he was a Naval Academy grad, class of 43 (I think) and had ended the war onboard a sub in the Pacific making war against Jap convoys. I was awestruck (being a submariner myself) and told him I should be thanking him instead. His reply was "But I only served 4 years"!
|
But in those four short years he and his mates established the traditions and standards you lived by during your career. As you so well know, the US Navy Submarine Service suffered proportionately the most casualties (almost all fatalities) of all US service branches.
I honor you as well, Chief!
__________________
Registration? NEVER!
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
01-01-2014, 09:30 AM
|
|
Absent Comrade
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: PA.
Posts: 9,773
Likes: 50,901
Liked 44,476 Times in 8,620 Posts
|
|
Great story thanks for sharing it!
That would have to be a prize to my collection.
Happy New Year............
|
01-01-2014, 09:45 AM
|
|
SWCA Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: St Augustine
Posts: 2,356
Likes: 2,305
Liked 5,683 Times in 844 Posts
|
|
Outstanding post, gun, and story!
That must have been quite a conversation with his wife. I'm sure it must have stirred up many emotions for both of you.
You should go into the private detective field
__________________
Rick
SWCA #2727 , SWHF #435
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
01-04-2014, 01:58 AM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 86
Likes: 1
Liked 41 Times in 17 Posts
|
|
2K7:
Thank you for your superb detective work in recreating the context in which a historical artifact, a Navy Victory Model, served one of the Greatest Generation as he did his duty for us. I hope and trust that Mr. Morgan's widow appreciated your efforts to perpetuate a fuller account of her late husband's World War II service in naval aviation.
And thanks to the other contributors to this thread who explained, in words and photo, what his duties as an AMM3 were in World War II.
I learned a bunch!
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
04-02-2016, 01:21 AM
|
|
SWCA Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 2,062
Likes: 1,112
Liked 1,865 Times in 440 Posts
|
|
I hope no one minds me reviving this thread. It is such a great and interesting thread I figure others would appreciate reading it. I don't know how I missed it the first go around.
Last edited by LOBO; 04-02-2016 at 01:22 AM.
|
The Following 6 Users Like Post:
|
|
04-02-2016, 08:45 AM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: South Texas & San Antonio
Posts: 33,483
Likes: 236
Liked 28,948 Times in 14,015 Posts
|
|
In the U.S. Navy, a Machinist's Mate general rating essentially means a mechanic, someone who maintains and repairs engines or equipment, in this case associated with aircraft. Many think it means being a machinist, i.e., someone who runs machine tools such as a lathe or milling machine. But the Navy calls those guys Machinery Repairmen. Go figure.
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
04-02-2016, 08:46 AM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Earth
Posts: 3,222
Likes: 3,749
Liked 3,780 Times in 1,388 Posts
|
|
Posts like this are the reason why I keep coming back!
|
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
|
|
04-02-2016, 10:40 AM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Utah
Posts: 1,310
Likes: 2,916
Liked 3,099 Times in 859 Posts
|
|
Great story and a great gun. This is what the gun grabbers/haters don't understand, the way our interest in firearms is so much more than just the gun. The twists and turns through history, the ties to heros, family and friends. Though nowhere as colorful, I hope my grandsons will handle my service weapons from my career in law enforcement and my stories will come alive. Living on through my descendents fond memories. Thank you Bert Morgan and thanks to all the other Bert Morgans who kept America free and preserved our rights, especially our Second Amendment Rights.
__________________
Join the NRA today
Last edited by retiredbadge8091; 04-02-2016 at 10:46 AM.
|
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
|
|
04-02-2016, 10:51 AM
|
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: trail's end in ol' Wyo
Posts: 7,205
Likes: 17,362
Liked 18,217 Times in 5,014 Posts
|
|
I loved Paul Harvey's tales, but 2K7 you've got him beat.
And, LOBO, thanks for bringing this one back to the surface.
I'm proud to admit my eyes are still a bit blurry.
__________________
Wrangler of stray Chiefs
Bob
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
04-02-2016, 11:42 AM
|
Banned
|
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 12,572
Likes: 21,054
Liked 32,463 Times in 7,773 Posts
|
|
I just now stumbled across this thread. Talk about bringing a tear to the eye. I don't know what to say. Really. I don't.
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
04-02-2016, 11:58 AM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 203
Likes: 433
Liked 349 Times in 104 Posts
|
|
This is a great story and a reminder that a gun with a DL#, SS#, or name engraved under the grips or a leather rig with a name can allow a story to be put to a firearm that makes it all the better! Thanks for posting this and putting in the effort to find out more.
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
04-02-2016, 12:28 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 3,795
Likes: 993
Liked 1,923 Times in 956 Posts
|
|
It took plenty of guts to be in one of these planes during an attack run,with loads of anti aircraft fire headed your way.
If any of you would like to read more about the subject,allow me to suggest,"A Dawn Like Thunder".
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
04-04-2016, 06:09 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Southside
Posts: 919
Likes: 280
Liked 1,278 Times in 417 Posts
|
|
Nice work,senior President Bush flew a Avenger.
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
04-04-2016, 09:53 PM
|
Absent Comrade
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Louisville, KY, USA
Posts: 19,336
Likes: 53,737
Liked 38,386 Times in 11,801 Posts
|
|
Fascinating and moving story. The trouble you took to research it and document it so beautifully are greatly appreciated.
I wish I could have been an invisible observer when you spoke with his wife. It must have been very touching.
__________________
Oh well, what the hell.
|
The Following 3 Users Like Post:
|
|
04-04-2016, 10:15 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 107
Likes: 5
Liked 77 Times in 36 Posts
|
|
Excellent post. Thank you very much. Folks looking for such stories will find them in abundance at the National WWII Museum in New Orleans. In addition to the many artifacts, full scale planes and tanks, and interactive exhibits, they have screens set up where you can view videos of thousands of WWII vets telling their accounts of the war. Truly galvanizing.
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
04-05-2016, 11:47 AM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Marietta, GA
Posts: 79
Likes: 497
Liked 29 Times in 24 Posts
|
|
Having recently purchased a '43 Victory (no Gov marking) and doing research online, I came across this thread.
Amazing...thanks for sharing.
|
04-05-2016, 12:30 PM
|
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: IL
Posts: 1,064
Likes: 1,986
Liked 2,356 Times in 560 Posts
|
|
Awesome! Literally had goose bumps reading the story. Thanks for sharing.
__________________
Cory
SWCA #3015 SWHF #465
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
04-05-2016, 01:07 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Florida
Posts: 379
Likes: 1,280
Liked 931 Times in 196 Posts
|
|
...very well done, Thank you.
|
04-05-2016, 01:29 PM
|
|
US Veteran
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Arizona
Posts: 10,440
Likes: 3,924
Liked 50,373 Times in 6,009 Posts
|
|
Somehow I missed this thread when it was originally posted. A very good read! Matching a specific firearm with its service user is a tough task and very rarely done. Good show.
John
__________________
- Cogito, ergo armatus sum -
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
04-05-2016, 03:08 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Northern Illinois
Posts: 883
Likes: 958
Liked 431 Times in 185 Posts
|
|
Thanks to all who contributed,,, A magnificent tale.
God Bless AMM3 Morgan
__________________
NOT SO FAST,, NOT-- SO-- FAST
|
04-05-2016, 04:16 PM
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 12
Likes: 0
Liked 15 Times in 5 Posts
|
|
This is quite possibly one of the coolest forum posts I have read in a long time.
Treasure that revolver as its previous owner did.
|
07-12-2017, 01:40 PM
|
|
Member
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 360
Likes: 0
Liked 425 Times in 110 Posts
|
|
As a follow-up to my original post here from some time ago, here is just another excellent example of the tough job the Assistant Machinist Mates performed and sometime giving it all for their Country!
Loyce Edward Deen, an Aviation Machinist Mate 2nd Class, USNR, was a gunner on a TBM Avenger.
On November 5, 1944, Deen's squadron participated in a raid on Manila where his plane was hit multiple times by anti-aircraft fire while attacking a Japanese cruiser. Deen was killed. The Avenger's pilot, Lt.; Robert Cosgrove, managed to return to his carrier, the USS Essex. Both Deen and the plane had been shot up so badly that it was decided to leave him in the plane.
It is the only time in U.S. Navy history (and probably U.S. military history) that an aviator was buried at sea in his aircraft after being killed in action.
Go to this website to view the burial:
< http://loyceedeen.webstarts.com/uploads/GoingHome.mp4
|
The Following User Likes This Post:
|
|
|
Thread Tools |
|
Display Modes |
Linear Mode
|
Posting Rules
|
|
|
|
|