Please tell me about my Brazil Contract Model

Oyeboteb · #1 02-11-2015, 12:40 AM

Recently acquired, "BRAZIL" Emblem.

Serial No 182361

Quite a few tiny dings but otherwise quite nice and about as new Mechanically and Bore wise.

Can you all please tell me more about these? and or about this one particularly?

Finish is a dark Blue-Black and is quite striking, if diffcult for me to photgraph well indoors ( night time here so, can not do any outdoor images ).

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Hondo44 · #2 02-11-2015, 01:06 AM

It's a beauty, that's for sure with original vintage stocks. If the serial # stamped on the back of the right side matches the butt #, they are "thee" original stocks.

The serial # indicates it's most likely from the 1st contract, 1938 shipment, #s 181983-207043 with squared off top strap and sq notch sight instead of the earlier round top and U notch sight style like most of the 1946 contract shipments.

The 1st contract guns like yours have the 2nd style hammer block safety that can be seen at the top, right inside of the hammer channel when the hammer is cocked.

That is the second type of hammer block, the wing type that yours has shown on the inside of the sideplate. It was replaced after WWII with the current style, sliding bar hammer block.

Is there an importer's stamp somewhere on the gun? Perhaps inside the cylinder frame window.

Oyeboteb · #3 02-11-2015, 01:54 AM

Thank you Hondo44!!

Stocks appear to have the Revolver's Serial Number stamped in to the right sidepanel.

On removing the Stocks to see about this, I do find an importers stamp thereon the front lower inside flat of the Grip Frame.

Rear sight is indeed a 'square' sort of channel.

So, would my example then be the 374th one made? ( or serialled, anyway ).

I had previously thought these all had the 'plain' un-checked Walnot Stocks, like the m1917s...but apparently they came with the then usual Commercial Revolver type Stocks?

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Hondo44 · #4 02-11-2015, 02:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oyeboteb

So, would my example then be the 374th one made? ( or serialled, anyway ).

I had previously thought these all had the 'plain' un-checked Walnot Stocks, like the m1917s...but apparently they came with the then usual Commercial Revolver type Stocks?

Bravo.

Could be, but more likely the 378th shipped, assuming all serial numbers were used in that shipment range anyway, which is not common. This leaves gaps in the serial range.
And there are always anomalies with serial number order. For example, guns were not produced in serial # order.

The SCSW would have us believe the stocks were smooth, however a majority of observations like yours, contradicts this.

Oyeboteb · #5 02-11-2015, 02:36 AM

I am sure glad the Importer placed their obligatory 'Stamp' in about the most inconspicuous place possible!

Oh man, I hate 'import stamps' ( when they are visible in normal viewing ).

I have seen quite a few of these with the Commercial Stocks, and where the Stocks had about the same wear and so on as the rest of the Revolver, appearing then to have been with it since new.

So, it does seem like some, or how-ever many, shipped with usual Commercial Stocks instead of the smooth plain no Medallion walnut 1917 type.

beagleye · #6 02-11-2015, 05:59 AM

Nice gun. I bet you will find it to be a highly accurate shooter. Brazil had excellent taste in firearms back then. Unfortunately I think the climate there was not super duper for metal surfaces so most of the beautiful weapons they acquired turned to rust. I have a 1935 banner mauser short rifle with the same stamp which, like your .45, dodged the corrosion bullet.

Oyeboteb · #7 02-11-2015, 06:35 AM

Hi beagleye,

That is NICE!!

You have inspire me in fact - now I am thinking, I really ought to see if I can find one of those, to go with my Revolver..!

I am sure the often rugged, rural or wild conditions down there, High Mountains to low humid swamps, and the various climates and elevations and Sea shore, made for a hard life for Firearms.

It is a pretty large Country -

http://geology.com/world/map/map-of-brazil.gif

None the less, Brazil seems to have taken much better care of their Arms than the C.C.C.P. ( U.S.S.R. ) ever did!

Muley Gil · #8 02-11-2015, 08:09 AM

The early contract Brazilian 1917s had commercial checkered grips. The 2nd contract 1917s from the '40s used WW I surplus frames and parts, including smooth grips.

Of course, as soon as I post this, someone will put up pictures that will contradict me.

Never say never or always when it comes to Smith & Wesson!

Oyeboteb · #9 02-11-2015, 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hondo44

Bravo.

Could be, but more likely the 378th shipped, assuming all serial numbers were used in that shipment range anyway, which is not common. This leaves gaps in the serial range.
And there are always anomalies with serial number order. For example, guns were not produced in serial # order.

Ohhh, yes...( how did I manage to subtract that wrong like that?? Eeeesh! )

But it is a fairly 'early' one at any rate...and that makes me happy somehow...I like 'early' examples of just about any long or longer production Gun.

Quote:

The SCSW would have us believe the stocks were smooth, however a majority of observations like yours, contradicts this.

Interesting...I wonder if Brazil had requested the usual Commercial Stocks? Or if the specification were merely that of the Commercial 2nd Model HE leaving the election of Stocks merely implied as being the usual Commercial ones? Then later on someone changed their mind or prefered to save 15 cents-a-pop ( or whatever ) by going with the plain Walnut ones..?

Innards are just as you say - has the Safety Bar of the kind you had described.

Serial Number is stamped on the inside of the Side Plate, as usual for the era, also.

Nice innards! Still quite a bit of lively Case Colors on the Hammer.

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I so admire how finely these were designed, made and fitted.

I am very happy I took the plunge and got this example.

Its a joy...

jmace57 · #10 02-11-2015, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oyeboteb

I am sure glad the Importer placed their obligatory 'Stamp' in about the most inconspicuous place possible!

Oh man, I hate 'import stamps' ( when they are visible in normal viewing ).

Just wanted to give a hearty "Hear Hear" on this statement.

And that's about as nice a Brazilian as I have seen!

And thirdly, it's nice to see/hear what the correct stocks (probably) are - I have two pre-War Brazilians that had incorrect, much-later stocks, and I have been looking for the 1917 style grips to replace them.

Oyeboteb · #11 02-11-2015, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muley Gil

The early contract Brazilian 1917s had commercial checkered grips. The 2nd contract 1917s from the '40s used WW I surplus frames and parts, including smooth grips.

Of course, as soon as I post this, someone will put up pictures that will contradict me.

Never say never or always when it comes to Smith & Wesson!

The more I think on it, the more it seems that the ones I had paused to look at over the last fifteen years or so, which I felt were likely the earlier ones ( with the tiny Patent info on the back of the Trigger and Hammer ) tended to have the Commercial Stocks.

So, this would seem to have been the case as far as my own impressions.

Now that I am learning a little more about these I will be sure to look critically, or more informedly, at any more examples I may run across.

I did own one once before, in the mid 1990s, but I gave it to a friend ( soon after I had got it ) who had admired it.

And I have no idea what it's details were, other than finely pitted ( and no 'finish' left ) all over on the outside, but darn-near fresh and excellent Bore and internals...and that it had the 'plain' Walnut Stocks, I am quite sure, since I remember it being 'just like' an m1917 in looks.