All the forum members probably already know this; but, a lot of collectors who just browse this site may not. I got me the Wheeler Gunsmith Screwdriver set last week. . .the big set. So, of course, I'm gong to replace me some screws. The Gun Garage on EBAY sells about every screw you would ever want for any Smith produced over the past 100 years. We all know that when you look at a gun the first thing you look at is the gun and the second thing is the screws. Until last week I mostly left the screws alone because they don't come out easily in many cases. Also, I didn't know where to get new replacement screws. So if you were like me, this brief post is for your information. Make any Smith look better and make that almost like-new one new again. The screws do cost about $8.00 each so have your checkbook ready. It's worth it.

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Dr. B

The Screws sold on E-Bay are reproductions,Correct?

Original and reproduction screws are available on eBay from various sellers, but the tough part is getting screws that have the right slot width and blue finish.

A 1960's screw will look quite a bit different than 1930's, in polish and in color.

They are newly manufactured screws; but, the way Gun Garage makes them I can't detect any difference between them and the original ones using pretty good magnification. Now color is another matter. George is right! You may note a color differential. For example, with a satin finish post war gun for sure. In most cases the color match is right on or so close it won't bother you. They sell stainless and nickel screws too. I figure that 99% of the people looking at a gun or looking at one to buy will not notice or care. People always notice a screw that has been messed up by an amateur screwdriver operator. I don't sell my guns so I just get them because I like the way they look and how they make the gun look.

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Dr. B

Thanks for the info.Any Time I have Messaged them to ask if they are repro's or not they just ignore me.

My bad. Their user name on EBAY is gun-garage. I just looked it up. If that doesn't work just search "smith screws" and you will find them as the ones who have so many and have sold so many.

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Dr. B

In March of this year, I purchased sideplate screws for a 27-2 from three sources: Numrich, Brownell's, and gun-garage. The domed screws from Numrich were in a dull finish and incorrect thread size - they wouldn't fit. The domed screws from Brownell's were a high-polish finish and the correct thread size (5 x44) - however, the diameter of the head was just the slightest bit small. This showed up visually when installed but I did not measure them. The screws received from gun-garage were high-polish, correct thread-size, and fit beautifully. They are gorgeous and look exactly like OEM screws.

Before spending $8 per screw, I emailed gun-garage with the following:

"Good morning. I am guessing that these replacement screws are not OEM and are not from S&W. (S&W may out-source these and other parts for all I know). I don't have an issue if these are after-market, but I would like to know if these are made to the same specifications as OEM, particularly in regards to the hardness of the steel used in the screws. The screws should be softer than the steel of the frame so that if any threads fail, it will be the threads of the easily replaceable screw rather than the threads in the frame. (This is like the difference in materials of lug nuts versus lug bolts on automobiles.)

I realize you may not know the answer, but I thought I would ask. Thank you much much for your help."

Here is the response from Al at gun-garage:

"Here is the best answer I can muster.
Due to Smith and Wesson's lack of screws over the last 15 years or so, we decided to have some made.
We looked for 3 years for a shop that would make these screws to the exact mean dimension of the assortment of S&W screws that we had on hand from Smith and out of our own revolvers.
I even measured the hole depth of the sideplates and contemplated having some made with taller heads for cosmetic reasons. The 29 sideplates that I measures had holes that varied from .069" to .095" deep. Rocket science is not a S&W strong suit.
We finally settled on trying to get someone to make them as close to factory mean dimensions as possible.
After countless blueprints and samples, these are what we have come up with.
We had 23,000 screws made.
We have sold thousands and not had one complaint except for the occasional individual that didn't realize that one sideplate screw had a flat head, and other little items like that.
The shop that manufactured these screws did a magnificent job. Allegedly using the same materials as sent to them.
Best I can do on a Sunday morning before I go play tractor for food plots.
Have a great day-Al"

Pricey?* Yes. Quality replacements? Yes. Worth it? Yes.

Sorry for such a long-winded post for such small components.

*Shipping is included in the price of the screws.

"The screws should be softer than the steel of the frame so that if any threads fail, it will be the threads of the easily replaceable screw rather than the threads in the frame. (This is like the difference in materials of lug nuts versus lug bolts on automobiles.)"

I hope no one will mind a bit of engineering theory about bolt/thread failure, since the topic is screw threads.
A nut (or threaded hole) of a particular thread size will *not* fail before the equivalent bolt does, even with a significant mismatch of the material strengths. In other words, a Grade 8 (high-strength) bolt will fail (break) before a plain hardware-store nut if you deliberately over-tighten it until failure. (Even though the bolt is ~3x stronger)

The failure situation is an apples and oranges one - the nut must fail in shear over a larger area and the bolt must fail in tension over a smaller area.

I use this exact problem to illustrate engineering-analysis skills for my first-year mechanical engineering students.

(The situation changes if the material mismatch gets great enough - a steel bolt in aluminum threads, for example. Even in that case you can predict the behavior if you know the theory involved.)

Thanks for the short engineering theory lecture. I've read your post several times but just now was able to truly understand what you said. I'd like to lay the blame on not reading carefully or being tired when I read it before, but I probably need a couple of prerequisite courses to get up to speed.

"Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects." -Will Rogers

Thanks again. Glad I finally got it! Learning is the main reason I read this forum - it covers quite a range of subjects.

thanks for posting this. $8 a screw is pricey, but sounds like the guy did his home work and will probably sell all 23,000 ... eventually.

Charlie

I wonder how much it would cost to have 23,000 screws made, compared to the $8 a piece price tag. Wonder where the profit margin ends up.

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1st smiles,lies.Last,gunfire.

rjb1,

Great tutorial, thanks. Very interesting to us mechanical types.

One question of clarification I have:

You posted: "The failure situation is an apples and oranges one - the nut must fail in shear over a larger area and the bolt must fail in tension over a smaller area."

And failure for the bolt was explained as "bolt will fail (break)" which I presume means snap in two, or the cap separates from the threaded length.

But what does the shear failure of the nut 'look like'? I'm presuming it means shearing off all of the threads from the nut at once, (not splitting the nut which would be a tension failure and not at all likely). If I'm correct, you've explained the engineering theory clearly and it makes complete and perfectly logical sense!! Thank you.


My concern with gun screws and maybe Nesmith's concern as well, is more about thread deformation in a "stripped"installation. The preference is for the screw threads to deform before the hole threads! Much easier to replace screws than to replace holes.

Hence, harder material for the hole and softer material for the screw so the screw threads deform 1st.

Total failure of the screw is in effect, actually a total failure of both screw and hole from a practical stand point of having to remove a broken screw from the blind hole of a gun.

Another takeaway from your explanation is; with the screw already being the weakest link, one might not be wise to use screws softer than the threaded holes, lest one invite premature screw failure based on the engineering theory!

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Jim
S&WCA #819

Nesmith,

Excellent research and recommendation!

Thank you,

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Jim
S&WCA #819

this man has replacement screws. if he don't have original he makes them. i just bought some for a 5 screw at around 6.00 per screw and they are nice.
Jack First Gunshop - 1201 Turbine Drive, Rapid City, South Dakota
(605) 343-8481