Long time ago (not really) when I was 16. At the local market. I got to demo a revolver for the first time. It was for sale by an real old man that looked like he stepped off the ark. BUT HE STILL LOOKED LIKE HE MEANS BUSINESS! This was a strange gun. It was a hand ejector, and was chambered for the 44-40. The caliber was stamped on the side of the gun. The rod was covered by lug.
It was blue coated. No model number. The gun looked like it was made before flood. That how old it looked. But it felt real good in my hand. Very heavy. Do y'all know what model that is?

Sounds like a Triple Lock (First Model Hand Ejector), they did make SOME in .44-40. Started making them 1907.

There are at least three possibilities - a .44 Hand Ejector 1st model (Triple Lock) from the early 20th century, a rare gun in .44-40; a model 544 from 1986 (this would have been model stamped), or not a S & W. There may be more foreign S & W copies/knockoffs than originals in .44-40.

Looks like there may be "Noah" way to be sure .

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

Sound like a 44 hand ejector first model, a.k.a triple lock. Very rare caliber. I remember somebody posting on this forum about buying one at a gun show.

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George Jamison

A lot of Spanish copies of S&Ws made in 44-40 before the war. That's my bet.

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No life story has happy end.

It was old, but not in **** condition. I remember he was asking over 300 for it. My Dad was there to get chickens and live stock so we did not get it. How much do triple locks go for?

In the mega off chance I come across it again by him a relatives of him that was around during the parting of the red sea. How would I tell its a real smith and not a knockoff?

That's a pretty cool old memory.

If as you say 44-40 was literally stamped "on the side of the gun" instead of the barrel, it raises other possibilities like a converted TL.

If you were 16 after 1926, it could also have been a .44 HE 3rd model, Wolf & Klar, especially in Texas, in which case it had to be converted to 44-40.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

I'm 24.

"If as you say 44-40 was literally stamped "on the side of the gun" instead of the barrel, it raises other possibilities like a converted TL.

If you were 16 after 1926, it could also have been a .44 HE 3rd model, Wolf & Klar, especially in Texas, in which case it had to be converted to 44-40."

What is Wolf & Klar and TL?

Never mind, TL=triple lock.

Why would someone convert a 44 S to a 44-40?

A cosmetically similar gun to the Triple Lock (shrouded ejector rod) was made starting in 1926, the 3rd model. Many of these went to Wolf and Klar, a major Fort Worth dealer of the era. These were not factory made in .44-40. Perhaps they already had an 1873 Winchester in the same caliber?

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

There were some .44 HE 2nd models built in .44-40. I owned one of them once, and not realizing how scarce it was. I traded it off, I had only paid $60 for it, and got more in trade, so I was not hurt financially, even though it appeared unfired.

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Tom
1560

Well, It was a strange gun. It looks like some of the smiths I can find. But its different. As a teenager, I was already surfing the web drooling at pictures of revolvers. I guess I may never know the history of the gun. Even if I do see it again. But I keep an eye out for it. Sadly, I see more model 19 and generics.

You didn't say it was a S&W, although if the extractor rod was shrouded it certainly suggests that it may have been. I am not silly enough to assume by "on the side of the gun" that you meant not on the barrel as some seem to be! It would seem that given your age (He says he is 24 YO guys!) the description of "really old" is quite subjective, You might think someone in their 60s, and a gun that was 25 years old were "Really old!", but few on this forum would.

My money is on three possibilities. These are the Model 544 "Texas Wagon Train Centennial" S&W that may have been well used, a Belgian knock-off of a S&W Model 1907, or the same from Spain. In .44-40 the Belgian is more likely than Spanish. The least likely is that it was a 1st Model .44 Hand Ejector, as this is one of the rarest S&W revolvers there is, but stranger things have happened.

As you might deduce, it is impossible to do any more than list the possibilities, and flat guess, given the information you have provided.

You still wouldn't want to discount the faint possibility that Noah had an actual Triple Lock in original 44-40, in which case the offered price of $300 would be a bit low. Offhand, you could add a zero, maybe more, maybe less, depending on condition.

What the others are telling you is that if it is a conversion from 44 special, they might have stamped that on the frame. The factory location of the stamp would be on the barrel. The tip off for a foreign (low value) knockoff would be patent dates or other inscribed stamping that is non-standard. Or, the SW logo, while often imitated, is not quite up to snuff. I hope you get a second look. If it is an actual SW of any flavor, I would pay the $300 quick and worry about the particulars later.

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Some collect art; I shoot it!

VERY FUNNY!!! No, strangely enough, Growing up hearing story's of war, crime and muscle cars and so on. I consider "old" means pre 1970. I was home schooled. and did carpet cleaning with my Dad. So I SPENT ALLOT OF TIME WITH OLD PEOPLE!!!

I cant count the time when I am talking about hot rods and the old timer ask, "What do you considered old" lol

I know that sounds stupid. But thats how I grew up.

Well, the home schooling part certainly explains your appreciation of fine revolvers .

Perhaps the old gentleman, or one of his friends, is still around to discuss the gun at the next market meeting...or still has it.

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

I hope so.
I'm always liked revolvers. I'm an odd ball for my age. My Dad would tell my stories of when he was growing up. He told me about a dumb friend of his whom thought he could free hand a 44 magnum. It does not take much to figure out what happen to him. Dad told me that his friend had to get stitches. lol. There was a doctor that paid use to clean his carpet that had REAL SAA on display.

Hell, I listen to ZZ Top and drive a Muscle car. lol. I spent my child hood watching crime and military documentaries. Hell, I wear a vintage western duster jacket, and I just cant find my self using wonder nines.

Dirty Harry and Smokey And the Bandit is on the list of my top ten favorite movies. So I am not like most my age.

Sadly, you guys may be right,it could be a knockoff. But I am keeping an eye out for it.

You mean like this.




Charlie

Above is pic of 2nd model. Now belongs to another forum member. The 3rd edition std cat suggested 565 made in 44-40, but Roy suggested much fewer, ie 50 -100. Most went to South America.

Charlie

Possibly to be a companion handgun to all those Winchester '92 44-40 Trapper models that went to the South American rubber plantations.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

The late Ray Brazile had a 2nd model 44/40 in Kansas City several years ago. In conversation with him he told me he had travelled the South West for many years and had only seen a hand full of S&W 44/40s. He thought the production numbers were lower than Roy's estimate and most went to Mexico. I now own the one Charlie shows in above post, I now have seen 2.

At least two of the .44-40 Second Models went to Australia, and I have one of them. Part of a two gun shipment to dealer Peter Anderson of Launceston, Tasmania, in August 1929. The other gun in the shipment is (or was) in the collection of an "old time" California collector (and I don't mean Ed. C.).
This is one of my favorite guns because of the Australian connection. Apart from military triple locks and second models, N frames were relatively unknown in Australia until the 1960's.
Also shown in the photo is a '92 Winchester in .44-40. Australia was an important market for Winchester, particularly '73 and '92 lever actions and the 1885 single shot.

Attached Images

image.jpg (61.7 KB, 97 views)

Does anyone know if S&W used the same barrel diameter for .44-40 that they used for their .44 Specials or the smaller diameter (.427") that Colt used?

Sasha Siemel had one of those M-92's and was shown holding it by a jaguar that he shot with it.

He never said which models his S&W .44's were, but I suspect that at least one was a Second Model.

There's a pic of him in a jungle camp wearing a flap holster, but the barrel length was probably 6.5-inches. Consistent with a TL or a Second Model.

If his revolver was a .44-40, it may have been because the factory ammo was loaded hotter than a .44 Special and because the ammo would also fit his Winchester.

I have no idea if he reloaded or if that was even practiced in Brazil then, about 1920.

one I found in Tulsa

Dan

Now that is a BIG TIME WOW


Charlie

That is awesome!

A tapered smooth bore? For shot shells?

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~ S&W aficionado in training ~

It reads "taper bored" in the letter but the dimensions don't indicate a taper.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

cant remember but it was surmised he was a fast draw trick shooter. the Gun was quite a conundrum when I found it because it is now a 38 special. it made a trip back to S&W when smoothbore handguns were outlawed and was converted to 38 special. I thought I had found the earliest known HD.... :-)

Why would a trick shooter use smooth bore?

So they don't miss or miss as much.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

A lot of trick shooters shot at glass balls thrown in the air while performing inside of circus tents. Easier to hit and the owner of the circus tents wasn't fond of .44 and .45 caliber holes in his tent!!!

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

I believe I would use one for a snake gun.

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Regards,
Bruce

I dont understand, wont smooth-bore be less accurate for trick shooting.

They used shotgun loads instead of a single bullit

HAHA, its not a trick!

Howdy

This is a 44 Hand Ejector 1st Model, also known as the Triple Lock, manufactured from 1907 until 1915. This one happens to be a target model, most had fixed sights. This model could be ordered from the factory for $21.





The reason it was called the Triple Lock is because it is the only revolver Smith and Wesson ever made with the distinctive third cylinder latch at the front of the frame.

There was a hardened steel insert screwed into the yoke.







When the cylinder closed, the cone shaped plunger at the bottom of this photo rode up the inclined surface of the insert, then spring pressure popped it into the deep hole in the insert. At the same time, the normal looking plunger in the recess in the barrel shroud popped into a hole in the end of the extractor rod.

This Triple Lock is chambered for 44 Special, the most common chambering of the model. The caliber was called out on the left side of the barrel, over the shroud.





This photo shows the front of the barrel shroud, and the details of the assembly. This is the only model that had the rectangular shaped button poking out of the front of the barrel shroud. As the action was opened or closed, the rectangular button would extend out of the barrel shroud slightly, and then withdraw again to this position.






This is a 44 Hand Ejector 2nd Model. Manufactured from 1915 until 1941. Smith and Wesson eliminated the third latch on this model, never to use it again. The cost savings of eliminating the 3rd latch was $2. Of course, those are 1915 dollars, worth a lot more than that today.





This is a 44 Hand Ejector 3rd Model, made from 1926 until 1941. At the request of Wolf and Klar, a large distributor in Fort Worth, Texas, the barrel shroud was reinstated, however the third cylinder latch was not. This particular well worn 3rd Model was made in 1929 and carried by an officer in WWII. At some point it was nickel plated, the nickel finish is not original.

Do you shoot it?

S&W Trivia = Triple Lock, serial number 1, is in caliber .44-40 and has extra cylinder in .44 Special. Ed.

Using an inflation calculator on the internet, I was able to determine that $2 in 1915 would have been worth $47.29 in 2015. You always hear that the cost of the third latch was the cause of its demise, but it seems hard to believe that, in today's dollars, $47.29 one way or the other would ever really matter. Then again, using this calculator, a .44 Hand Ejector First Model, Target variation, at $21 in 1915, would cost $496.53. So, obviously the inflation rate of firearms has exceeded the general rate of inflation over the last century. $500 can barely buy you a run of the mill N-frame in moderate to poor condition these days, let alone a Target Model Triple Lock!

By the way...just thinking about this a bit more...

Let's say that Smith & Wesson had never discontinued the Triple Lock, so all the equipment is still set up, still cranking out Triple Locks after all these years (so that, in this example, the cost to set up initial production does not have to be factored in). What do you think the cost would be of a standard Triple Lock (OR Target Model)? The best "guess" I would have for this is that, comparing apples to oranges, a Colt Single Action Army NIB, is around $1400 today. I would guess that, very roughly, a standard (non-target model) Triple Lock might run the same??? Doesn't seem like an out of the ballpark price to pay for something of this quality these days...

mrcvs,

Excellent analysis. Although with firearms there's more than simple dollar inflation at work. The cost increase of today's Smiths has to factor in technological improvements as well, such as modern steel costs, labor rates, increased regulation costs on manufacturing companies, and a few other things.

But I believe you're right about the cost of making a triple lock today. Of course it would have MIM parts to be at that ball park price point, and an internal lock.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

Multiple pellets instead of a single projectile. ...the object in trick shooting is the visual, not pinpoint accuracy
..pop the baloon of knock over the target..

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Robert
SWCA #2906, SWHF #760

Or more likely back then, break glass balls thrown in the air.

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Jim
S&WCA #819