I bumped into this little 38S&W revolver at a pawn shop. As best as I can determine from the s/n 880xx it is a late 1950's gun with an improved I-frame. Any additional info would be appreciated.

We need the serial number to give you any intelligent feedback. Ed.

Hi Willie,

That's a beauty!

It's later than an Improved I frame which ended by 1953. It's the "Model of 1953 Mew Model I Frame" .38 S&W Terrier. It has the larger trigger guard and 1/8" longer grip frame; both the same size as the New Model J frame.

If it's stamped Model 32, it's from between 1958 and Jan 1961 (when I frames were eliminated) and could have been shipped even as late as a couple of years passed that.

If not Model # stamped in the yoke cut of the frame, it's from between 1956 (when the 4th screw on the side plate was deleted) to early 1958.

__________________
Jim
S&WCA #819

GREAT PHOTO as well!! CONGRATS!!

Sweet little revolver. Nice find.

__________________
Oh well, what the hell.

Boy if that one has been fired it wasn't much. I have a blued one that I carry for backup no where as nice as that one.

Mod 32 is stamped under the yoke. I was under the impression that the improved I-frame was the precursor to the J-frame. The design change from leaf to coil spring was the distinguishing characteristic of the "Improved" I-frame. The later modifications of enlarged cylinder window, trigger guard and grip were still considered Improved I-frames.

If I'm understanding Hondo 44 correctly, he said the Improved I-frame ended in 1953 but I'm having difficulty finding references other than info on post war transitionals and descriptions of the Improved I-frame prior to the switch to the J-frame. I've compared the M32 directly to a J-frame and the dimensions are definitely different. Any clarification would be appreciated.

It's a common misperception, mostly generated by the SCSW which erroneously jumbles the Improved I frame and the 1953 New Model together. My study was submitted to Jim Supica and will hopefully make it into the SCSW 4th edition due out late spring.

The next modification after the Improved I frame did not enlarge the cyl window, only the trigger guard and grip frame and it's the 1953 New Model I frame made from a new frame forging. The 1953 New Model J frame had the same exact changes and also used a new frame forging. Of course the J already had the larger cyl/cyl window form its introduction in 1950, now known as the 'Baby J'.


Only your cyl window /cyl dimensions are different from the J frame.

There's only two references available: click on my commentaries above and an excerpt from my study included below:

COMPARISONS OF IMPROVED I, NEW I, AND NEW J FRAMES USING 22/32 KIT GUNS:

The frame size is determined by the main frame cylinder window length, not the trigger guard and grip frame length. There are versions of I frames with both the small TG/short GF and also the Model of 1953 new frame with large TG and long GF.

Also there are J frames with both: the (Baby J) with small TG and short GF, and the Model of 1953 New J with large TG and longer GF.

Here are a few pix to help illustrate the differences between the pre war I/post war Transitional I, "Improved I”, the “New I” frame, and the "J" frame revolvers:

Top gun shown is a post war Transitional I frame, what the I frame and the Improved I frame .32 and .38/32 look like (no Improved I frame .22/32s were ever made). 'Improved I' frames in .32 and .38 S&W will have a round sight on the early versions and have a ramped front sight with ribbed barrel on the late versions. The Transitional I frame is a 6 screw. It looks like a 5 screw Improved I frame, but the improvement being the coil mainspring.

Bottom Kit Gun is a Model of 1953 "New I frame" (the true Pre-Model 34), with coil mainspring, and only had 4, and after 1956, 3 screws. It still has the I size main frame cyl window length, but the New I forging trigger guard size and round butt grip frame length, 1/8" longer than the pre war, post war transitional I, Improved I, and Baby J frame. To see the difference, compare the amount of un-checkered wood below the checkering field on the stocks. The new Model of 1953 sq butt available option for all the New I frames is an additional 5/32” longer (not shown).



This photo below, compares the cyl/cyl windows which are the same:




Next, this photo is a comparison of a .22/32 Kit Gun "J-Frame" (Model 63 stainless Kit Gun, top), and a Model of 1953 "New I-Frame" (Pre-Model 34/Model 34 22/32 Kit Gun, bottom). Same size trigger guards and grip frames, but note the 1/8” difference in frame length in front of the trigger guard and top strap, also compare the cylinder length and cyl window length. which are different.



I hope this is helpful,

__________________
Jim
S&WCA #819

Buffalo Bore makes a good .38 S&W self defense load.

Thanks Hondo44 for the reply and informative references. I was using SCSW 3rd ed as my primary source and it is confusing. Hopefully, your study will be included in the next edition.

It seems my M32 is built with a 'New I-frame' from the Model of 1953.