I have recently found a fairly early 274xxx 4th change snub. While researching here, I seem to find that folks tend to believe that the earliest snubs did not show up until 1933 or so.....Am I missing a crucial piece to the puzzle?

Who else has an early snub? Have you lettered it or received a ship date from Roy?

I would love to know the whole story if anyone would care to share

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On the Oak Savannah

Some things to consider:

1. Once the snubbie barrels came out, older guns can have gone back to S&W for a 2" retrofit. In this case you'd have a matching serial # barrel with a diamond following the #. Does your barrel # match the gun?

You'd also have a rework date on the left side of the grip frame under the grip, near the toe. And a star following the serial # on the gun butt.

2. If serial # of the barrel doesn't match the gun, or has no serial #, it was swapped in by a gunsmith.

3. The least likely is that your frame is original with 2" barrel, but was a very late (for it's serial #) produced and shipped gun, and after 1933. Only a letter will confirm that.

I suspect you'd know if it was chopped. Of course a soldered on front sight base, no front locking lug or soldered on lug, or extractor rod with a knob (non-straight rod) would all be clues.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

A 274xxx serial number on that revolver points to 1917. At that time S&W was making absolutely NO hand ejectors of any frame size with two-inch barrels, though you could find some top-break snubbies. It's worth noting that Colt, which usually got to market first with new configurations that had some commercial potential, didn't introduce the Detective Special until 1927. In the 'teens and early '20s there was simply no significant demand for short-barrel revolvers, and even into the '30s the increasing public and agency interest in such guns did not lead to huge production volume.

I consider it a virtual certainty that the gun you ask about has been rebarreled. I would be delighted to be proved wrong.

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David Wilson

Gentlemen,

Many thanks for the insights. The barrel is properly roll-marked. There is a re-work date somewhere in '48, but no star with the SN and no diamond on the barrel. I need to drag it out and double check for a SN on the barrel....I am almost certain that I saw one when I first acquired the gun, but I have slept since then and all things numeric become fuzzy after a few days.

I'll re-check the SN on the barrel and get the magnifying glass out to be sure about things this evening. Did the patent roll-mark change between pre and post war barrels?

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On the Oak Savannah

It is virtually certain from the SN that yours shipped in 1917, but there were no M&P snubbies being made at that time by S&W. It is puzzling that the matching barrel SN does not have the diamond after it to indicate a rebarreling, but of course the diamond's absence could simply be an oversight. It would be worth getting a factory letter to establish without doubt how it originally left the factory.

It's rebarreled.
Front sights are forged with barrels on non-ribbed barrels. That requires a forging die. No die, no barrels.
The forging dies were not made till the engineering order of June, 1933 ordered that 250 barrels be made.

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Regards,
Lee Jarrett

Thanks Lee. That is very useful information. If I had to bet, then I would say that the re-work in '48 was likely when the barrel got swapped.

It does make a really neat looking gun with the Steer Head MOP stocks with Ruby eyes however

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On the Oak Savannah

You are tormenting everyone with that tidbit... where are the pictures?

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Randy
Provenance nerd

Here's mine from 1917 with a letter. The 2" barrel is numbered to the gun with a star preceding the serial no. as on the butt of the gun. The letter kinda tells the story. Oh, I have just a little more than $250 into this. Rich.

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GOD BLESS THE USA

Interesting that the letter says that the 2" barrel did not exist until 1936, when the conventional wisdom is that the earliest known 2" M&P shipped in 11/1933. I have several M&P snubbies listed as shipping in 1934 and 1935.

It's just an error. S&W 1857-1945 By N&J, pg.137 confirms July 1933 as the date when the 2" was added.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

Roy stated that the ship date is April 1917, so it is definitely too early for the snub barrel.

I have found no service date on the frame, nor serial number on the barrel flat.

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On the Oak Savannah

Everything points to a non-factory conversion. The extractor rod would also necessarily have been replaced with a short one with a knurled tip, not the earlier mushroom or barrel-shaped extractor knobs.

Gentlemen,

I apologize for the tardiness of my reply with the photos, but sometimes life gets in the way of progress

Here it is shown with vintage S.D. Myres floral carved holster.

It does have the correct numbered service stocks, but they are worn almost smooth.

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On the Oak Savannah