32 HE 1st Model Parts Source

Barbarian-CBX · #1 05-26-2016, 06:41 AM

I have a 32 Hand Ejector first model in nickel. It's missing the knob on the end of the extractor. Is there a source for replacement parts for this model? I've already tried Numrich. Thanks.

glowe · #2 05-26-2016, 09:03 AM

There are just no parts for sale at any gun-parts company that I know of, plus you are looking for the most sought after part for the Model 1896 HE. Often, that part would work loose and simply fall off without notice and many for sale today has a crudely fashioned replacement. I have seen parts for sale on ebay from time to time. I picked up a cylinder assembly a few months ago, since I needed an ejector star, and of course the ejector pin had no knob.

Your best bet is to find a machinist to have one manufactured. That would, of course, require you to buy another Model 1896. Since we are always looking for reasons to buy more S&Ws, this is as good a reason as any.

Barbarian-CBX · #3 05-26-2016, 12:59 PM

Oh well. I was afraid of that. Thanks, Mark

hardcase60 · #4 05-26-2016, 03:55 PM

You might try Jack First Gunshop. Google for the website. They don't do online orders so you have to call. They do have a catalog that can be ordered, but it's not a requirement. I personally have never used them however the occasional reviews/comments are always positive. hardcase60

Hondo44 · #5 05-26-2016, 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barbarian-CBX

Oh well. I was afraid of that. Thanks, Mark

Mark,

Welcome aboard this forum!

These missing knobs are also common on the K38 M&P 1st Models. So much so that at least one member had them reproduced for sale IIRC; "mikepriwer".

The 38 knob looks similar in next two photos, but not the same.

Shown here:

Photo by H Richard

Photo by FatChance

I'm also sending you a private message with a list of early S&W parts sources; a few of which reproduce parts.

Don't give up,

merl67 · #6 05-26-2016, 11:24 PM

I can attest to them working loose. The one on my lone 1896 would work loose each time I shot it so I used some loctite on it problem solved.

DWalt · #7 05-26-2016, 11:45 PM

I don't know what the thread size is (probably something proprietary to S&W) but if that were known, anyone with a lathe and some skill in using it could turn out a reasonably close facsimile of the knob using a picture of one to go by. I did that once with one of my early Colts with a missing knob. I found a metric thread that was fairly close to what Colt used (but a little sloppy), and some Loctite kept it in place (I have lots of metric and English taps and dies of all sizes). It wouldn't fool anyone who knows what the real thing looks like, but not many do.

Hondo44 · #8 05-27-2016, 12:28 AM

At least Barbarian has the threaded tip (male end) to determine the thread pitch. In the worst case he could have the threaded tip turned off, drill and tap the extractor rod for a common thread and have a knob made with a stud on it threaded to match.

glowe · #9 05-27-2016, 08:23 AM

Thread pitch is immaterial to the discussion. The two knobs are different in shape and attachment. Onw cannot be made to fit the other. The Mode 1896 is held in place by a small screw into the rod, while a Model 1899 is threaded and has no screw in the head of the knob. The knurling is much smaller on the 1899 as well that knob being quite a bit longer and a different shape.

We all hope you are able to get the part you need, but it is not as easy as some might suggest. You could have a money making opportunity by having a machinist manufacture a few dozen knobs and sell them on ebay. You would get your investment back quickly with all those who need such a part.

gmborkovic · #10 05-27-2016, 12:34 PM

Gary, thanks for clearing that point up. Folks that have never stood in front of a 4' Lathe all ways assume the part makes itself.

Hondo44 · #11 05-27-2016, 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glowe

Thread pitch is immaterial to the discussion. The two knobs are different in shape and attachment. Onw cannot be made to fit the other. The Mode 1896 is held in place by a small screw into the rod, while a Model 1899 is threaded and has no screw in the head of the knob. The knurling is much smaller on the 1899 as well that knob being quite a bit longer and a different shape.

We all hope you are able to get the part you need, but it is not as easy as some might suggest. You could have a money making opportunity by having a machinist manufacture a few dozen knobs and sell them on ebay. You would get your investment back quickly with all those who need such a part.

Gary,

Great informative photo, thanks. Based on that, you're right, having correct knobs machined is the way to go if an original knob and screw can't be found.

Hondo44 · #12 05-27-2016, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmborkovic

Gary, thanks for clearing that point up. Folks that have never stood in front of a 4' Lathe all ways assume the part makes itself.

Hmmm, 'always' is kind of a strong statement, maybe true with some. But for sure, those that have, never "assume the part makes itself."

Barbarian-CBX · #13 05-28-2016, 04:37 PM

Uh THREADED END! Dang! Mine doesn't have threads. After a closer look, I think think the end of the rod is broken off. Add that to my list of needed parts.uploadfromtaptalk1464467777000.jpg

Barbarian-CBX · #14 10-24-2016, 12:01 PM

Back on this again. Is the end supposed to be threaded, or does the knob have some type of set screw?

Hondo44 · #15 10-24-2016, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barbarian-CBX

Back on this again. Is the end supposed to be threaded, or does the knob have some type of set screw?

Go to post #9 in this thread for a photo of the attachment screw and knob for the 1896.

Hondo44 · #16 10-07-2017, 04:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glowe

Thread pitch is immaterial to the discussion. The two knobs are different in shape and attachment. Onw cannot be made to fit the other. The Mode 1896 is held in place by a small screw into the rod, while a Model 1899 is threaded and has no screw in the head of the knob. The knurling is much smaller on the 1899 as well that knob being quite a bit longer and a different shape.

We all hope you are able to get the part you need, but it is not as easy as some might suggest. You could have a money making opportunity by having a machinist manufacture a few dozen knobs and sell them on ebay. You would get your investment back quickly with all those who need such a part.

Gary,

Today I spoke with the proprietor of Simmons Custom Services. They specialize in making old gun screws of all types. I bought some for a Winchester. They are excellent quality, blued, and worked perfectly.

They'd be happy to make reproduction 1896 extractor knobs and screws. They'll be a lot cheaper made in volume which he'll do and stock them.

All I need is dimensions to send him. I don't own an 1896.

Would you be willing to share the dimensions and thread count? And I'll take care of the rest.

Thx,

S&WsRsweet · #17 10-07-2017, 08:21 AM

Welcome to the S&W forum you now understand why I say these guys are amazing .Please keep us informed of your progress as it will help us newer folks especially finding deals if we know we have a source for any missing parts as a accumulater/ shooter I don't really go for the collector grade or investment grade guns but I have passed on a couple of examples because of missing or broken parts.Thanks for posting and thanks to the experts for very informative and interesting posts also.

Skeetr57 · #18 10-07-2017, 09:10 AM

Can't believe that Hondo, the Guru of all things I frame doesn't have an example of the first I frame S&W!

Hondo44 · #19 10-29-2017, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skeetr57

Can't believe that Hondo, the Guru of all things I frame doesn't have an example of the first I frame S&W!

LOL. Well, it would be no fun anymore if I had everything I wanted! It's the fun of the hunt and anticipation as much as the owning.

Hondo44 · #20 10-29-2017, 10:46 PM

Well we seem to be progressing. I will have an example soon to get measurements from along with photos to send to the supplier for production.

Hondo44 · #21 10-30-2017, 12:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barbarian-CBX

I have a 32 Hand Ejector first model in nickel. It's missing the knob on the end of the extractor. Is there a source for replacement parts for this model? I've already tried Numrich. Thanks.

Hi,

While I'm working on the reproduction of the knob and the screw, I also assembled a list of possible suppliers of an extractor rod for your 1896.

If you haven't found one yet, you may want to try these;

George Dye (at David Carroll's) for old Smith parts, sight blades, etc.

GUN GARAGE on Ebay (for screws)
http://stores.ebay.com/Gun-Garage

"elysianfield!" on Ebay, lanyard swivel $20 shipped and nicely blued. Specify for S&W

"Aonepawninc" http://stores.ebay.com/aonepawninc
has a bunch of old S&W parts for sale. I just ordered a complete hammer for my pre model 30 from them. They are very customer oriented and have very reasonable prices. 1/10/16

Dave Bennett: Parts and guns from 1900 up to 1970's.
e-Mail: [email protected]
Web Site: www.22ammobox.com

David Clements - Clements Custom Guns
PH: 276-238-8761
2766 Mt. Zion Rd.
Woodlawn, VA 24381
[email protected]
Clements Custom Guns

Jack First: Large selection of Pre- and Post-WWII parts. Sells working
parts to FFL dealers only.
Phone: 605-343-9544
Reproduced firing pins for 22/32 Kit Gun and HFT

Gun Parts Corp: Successor to Numrich Arms; many guns parts.
226 Williams Lane, West Hurley, NY 12491
Phone: 845-679-2417
e-Mail: [email protected]
Web Site: Gun Parts & Firearm Accessories | Numrich Gun Parts

Jim Horvath: Many parts for all S&W's (large and small) from 1860 up;
can reproduce parts.
e-Mail: [email protected]

Jeff Lee: Lee's Gun Parts (an extensive supply of gun parts, including S&W)Mike who works for Lee has 45 M25 barrels.
(Open to the public on Tuesdays, Wednesdays and Thursdays).
3401 W. Pioneer, Suite 2, Irving, TX 75061
Phone: 972-790-0773
www.leesgunparts.com/‎

Jan Matlega: Parts for Pre-WWII S&W hand-ejectors.
Mail Address: 528 Eddy Glover
New Britain, CT 06053
Phone: 860-229-6872

Poppert's Gun Parts: http://www.poppertsgunparts.com/
P.O. Box 413
Glenside, PA 19038
Tel: 215-887-2391 Fax: 215-887-5816
Email: [email protected]

Charlie Pate: Provides screws (original & reproduction) for S&W Tip-ups and Top-breaks; author of books and articles on S&W guns.
Phone: 703-533-8057
e-Mail: [email protected]

Phil Saccacio: Phone: 540-456-6405
e-Mail: [email protected]

Dave Szilagy: Manufactures parts for older S&W's.
Mail Address: 3107 Electric, Lincoln Park, MI 48146
e-Mail: [email protected]

Mike Veilleux: Guns and Gun Parts
All Parts inc. for Pre- and Post-WWII S&W's.
Phone: 413-732-9938
e-Mail: [email protected]
Web Site: www.gunsnparts.com

Liberty Tree Collectors Phone:207-285-3111
139 Main Street, Corinth, ME 04427
Email:[email protected]
Liberty tree collectors has original, CCH lanyard rings (but without the retaining pin) for $25.

S&W Parts; antique and new
[email protected]
Ph: 352 394-7412

Good hunting,
Jim

Barbarian-CBX · #22 10-30-2017, 02:44 PM

Great job keeping up the interest guys! I'm still looking for a knob. Plus, I think I need a rod too. If you look closely, my rod doesn't have threads. It has a small slot in one side. If it did have threads, a piece of the rod must have broken off and be in the missing knob.

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glowe · #23 10-31-2017, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barbarian-CBX

. . . I think I need a rod too . . .

Not sure what parts are altered in your picture. The ejector rod is the outer housing and should measure about .87" from the frame. The center pin is threaded to accept the knob and also is drilled out to accept the cone shape of the end screw.

There is rearward tension on the center pin to allow it to snap into the recess on the recoil shield, plus there is a larger spring to enable the star extractor to return to the rear of the cylinder after pushing on the rod. The center pin should not be showing the pin end beyond the rod, but rather only the small threaded end should be showing. Make sure you have both the springs you need. A couple pictures might help you out.

The ejector rod/center pin knob assembly is assembled with very small diameter fine threads and all parts fit together perfectly. I continue to be amazed at the skill and craftsmanship of gunmakers in the 1890s. This design was a belt & suspenders approach to keeping everything in place. The knob screwed onto the center pin, and the end screw placed pressure on those threads to keep it from loosening. Too bad it did not work as designed for far too many 1896 revolvers.

Barbarian-CBX · #24 10-31-2017, 11:37 AM

Thanks for the explanation and images. The center pin appears to have the threaded end broken off where the knob attaches. Hence, I'll require both the pin and knob. Right?

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Barbarian-CBX · #25 10-31-2017, 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barbarian-CBX

Thanks for the explanation and images. The center pin appears to have the threaded end broken off where the knob attaches. Hence, I'll require both the pin and knob. Right?

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Oh. I'll need the end screw also. I wonder if I have the wrong pin anyway since it sticks our about 3/16" from end of extractor.

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battle · #26 10-31-2017, 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glowe

Not sure what parts are altered in your picture. The ejector rod is the outer housing and should measure about .87" from the frame. The center pin is threaded to accept the knob and also is drilled out to accept the cone shape of the end screw.

There is rearward tension on the center pin to allow it to snap into the recess on the recoil shield, plus there is a larger spring to enable the star extractor to return to the rear of the cylinder after pushing on the rod. The center pin should not be showing the pin end beyond the rod, but rather only the small threaded end should be showing. Make sure you have both the springs you need. A couple pictures might help you out.

The ejector rod/center pin knob assembly is assembled with very small diameter fine threads and all parts fit together perfectly. I continue to be amazed at the skill and craftsmanship of gunmakers in the 1890s. This design was a belt & suspenders approach to keeping everything in place. The knob screwed onto the center pin, and the end screw placed pressure on those threads to keep it from loosening. Too bad it did not work as designed for far too many 1896 revolvers.

Is this an original finish 1896? I ask because I'm curious if the nickel guns hammer and trigger are originally case hardened or nickel? Nice example BTW.

I'm also in need of a hammer if anyone has a spare. The gun I have has had the hammer bobbed.

glowe · #27 10-31-2017, 04:54 PM

I am near certain that the gun is original nickel. I have three nickel 32 HE, 1st revolvers, in all three available barrel lengths, and they all have case colored hammer and trigger.

It seems that just about every vintage model S&W is found in all nickel and many could well be special orders from the factory, some with annotations in the factory records have been confirmed by letters. It is speculated that one reason why the factory did not nickel these parts was because the nickel plate added enough thickness to these parts to cause binding.

Hondo44 · #28 11-01-2017, 02:55 AM

Gary,

Thx for the excellent photos. These will help greatly in getting the knob and screw reproduced!

I also notice the threads on the center pin have a split on the end so the cone tip of the lock screw can expand to tighten inside the knob.

battle · #29 11-01-2017, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glowe

I am near certain that the gun is original nickel. I have three nickel 32 HE, 1st revolvers, in all three available barrel lengths, and they all have case colored hammer and trigger.

It seems that just about every vintage model S&W is found in all nickel and many could well be special orders from the factory, some with annotations in the factory records have been confirmed by letters. It is speculated that one reason why the factory did not nickel these parts was because the nickel plate added enough thickness to these parts to cause binding.

Are they 4,6,8" ?

glowe · #30 11-01-2017, 09:03 AM

Actually, the standard barrel lengths for this model have rather odd dimensions: 3 1/4", 4 1/4", and 6". Unlike many other early S&W models that show up with very long barrels, I have never seen anything longer than 6" barrel on this model.

Hondo44 · #31 12-04-2017, 04:14 PM

UPDATE: We're making progress on reproducing the 1896 ejector knob and screw.

I have delivered dimensions to Sam who has completed the screw. He'll be working on the knob soon.

Barbarian-CBX · #32 12-05-2017, 11:07 AM

It appears the front end of my center pin is broken off. Can someone point me to a replacement source for 32 HE 1st model center pin? Thanks.

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Hondo44 · #33 12-05-2017, 05:56 PM

Post # 21 above.

wundudnee · #34 12-05-2017, 10:24 PM

I've been following this thread with much interest. I have my grandfathers first model and it's missing the knob and the threads on the rod are damaged. An old gunsmith put an off breed knob on it and it's not really secure.

It was the first revolver I ever shot.

Hondo44 · #35 12-06-2017, 01:38 PM

UPDATE:

The first knob is now complete in addition to the screw. The screw and knob is being sent to an owner of an 1896 for testing.

Because there are so many nickel plated 1896 models, these parts will be offered in nickel plate as well as blued.

Hondo44 · #36 12-06-2017, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wundudnee

I've been following this thread with much interest. I have my grandfathers first model and it's missing the knob and the threads on the rod are damaged. An old gunsmith put an off breed knob on it and it's not really secure.

It was the first revolver I ever shot.

We'll have the correct knob and screw available for your gun soon. Notice in the middle photo in post #23, the threaded end of the extractor rod has a small split in the threads.

The split in the end of the threads on the center pin is so the cone tip of the lock screw can expand the threads to tighten inside the knob. Hopefully this will compensate for worn threads on your extractor rod.

handejector · #37 12-06-2017, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hondo44

Well we seem to be progressing. I will have an example soon to get measurements from along with photos to send to the supplier for production.

Jim,
I strongly recommend sending him a knob and screw.
I would talk to him first and make sure he'll send it back.

Drawings are great IF they are a true schematic drawn to scale with all dimensions noted accurately. Otherwise, the part in hand is the best way to go.
Just trying to save you some disappointment here....

Kudos for doing this.

handejector · #38 12-06-2017, 02:12 PM

I just read the whole thread.
I'm way behind.
Never mind.....

glowe · #39 12-06-2017, 06:25 PM

We had a couple of threads running together for some time on this subject, but one got left behind. Since they overlap in information and intent, I thought I would add the link for additional information on Jim's project.

S&W first model 1896

Muley Gil · #40 12-06-2017, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hondo44

We'll have the correct knob and screw available for your gun soon. Notice in the middle photo in post #23, the threaded end of the extractor rod has a small split in the threads.

The split in the end of the threads on the center pin is so the cone tip of the lock screw can expand the threads to tighten inside the knob. Hopefully this will compensate for worn threads on your extractor rod.

Any chance of getting some knobs made up for the 1899 revolvers? My 1899 .32-20 needs one.

Hondo44 · #41 12-10-2017, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muley Gil

Any chance of getting some knobs made up for the 1899 revolvers? My 1899 .32-20 needs one.

I don't see why not. We'll know how the 1896 knobs came out real soon.

Two 1896 knobs and screw have been sent to a member for testing.

Barbarian-CBX · #42 01-04-2018, 07:50 PM

Any updates on knobs and screws?

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Hondo44 · #43 01-04-2018, 08:00 PM

The producer, Sam, of the knobs has purchased a Model 1896 to confirm his prototype knobs and screws will work properly.

He was waiting for receipt of the gun. Update soon.

Hondo44 · #44 02-01-2018, 11:00 PM

Model 1896 reproduction knobs with lock screws are now available on our classified section here: 1896 Hand Ejector Rod Knob

Barbarian-CBX · #45 02-07-2018, 06:04 PM

Well... I've checked everywhere. I can't find the center pin so the knob won't help. Can we get a pin made like we got the knob/screws made?

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Hondo44 · #46 02-08-2018, 02:47 AM

Contact Sam who made the knobs and is selling them above in his ad. by private message. I bet he'll make you one. He now owns an 1896 so he has a center pin to copy.

Barbarian-CBX · #47 02-08-2018, 11:04 AM

Great idea! Just sent Sam a PM.

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Barbarian-CBX · #48 02-28-2018, 08:45 PM

Here is my revolver now. Turns out the ejector was shortened so one could get a grip on the cylinder pin (broken) to swing out the cylinder. Sam Simmons fabricated a new ejector, pin, and knob for me. The new parts look perfectly matched IMHO. Thanks Sam!

Barbarian-CBX · #49 02-28-2018, 08:46 PM

See the first post of this thread for the before pic.

Hondo44 · #50 03-01-2018, 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barbarian-CBX

See the first post of this thread for the before pic.

That's a nice 1896. It came out great! Sam does excellent work.

I bought my first M 1896 from Sam. It had some corrosion where the nickel was worn/corroded away leaving dark patches on cyl and yoke in front of the cyl much worse than yours.

I used Navel Jelly to remove it and carefully polished the bare metal and it blended right in with the remaining nickel. The Naval jelly does not affect the nickel at all. Took the corrosion off the sides of the hammer as well.
I had the non-factory pearls.