I need to stay out of a certain LGS... I find something cool every time.
Today was no exception. I found a 5-screw .38 Masterpiece with a factory 4" bull barrel. Think "Dayton," but older - K223315. 1954 vintage. It has the Patridge sight on a grooved heavy barrel. The barrel is numbered to the gun. The grips seem original (haven't looked under yet) but have some wear or filing on the bottom corners, and they've been given a gloss finish.
I'm not finding anything in SCSW 3 or 4. Am I missing something? Any ideas???
Pics to follow later today! Thanks!

Unusual to see a Patridge sight on a 4-inch barrel Combat Masterpiece.
Possibly a cut barrel or a special order?

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John

Had one made in the 60's that was ordered by Olympic Wholesale, it was one of 10 made and sent to them. Had a heavy bbl but not as heavy as the Dayton guns. The 14 you are asking about probably looks cool with a 4" bbl and tall front sight. What's the price? Larry

Cut? I don't believe so. It's the same heavy profile as a later-model 10/13. Special order? Maybe.
Price? Under $400. It caught my eye like a hot redhead at a topless beach.

LAPD and USAF gunsmiths made up some that sound a lot like that, but not the bbl profile, exactly.


I think photos are needed.


This does sound like a gun you should have grabbed. I don't care for redheads; dated just two in my life. Prefer blondes or brown hair. But I grasp your analogy and see how it'd apply to a desirable gun.


Get your camera. We're waiting. This is a lot better post than, "Can I shoot Plus P in my S&W?" (I can't access the Smilies here. Imagine a laughing Smilie.)


Oh: what's a Dayton gun?

Yes, there was such a gun as described by the OP: 4" HB with Patridge front sight. One of my supervisors carried one in the 1979-80 era. There was a previous thread mentioning this gun IIRC.

Kaaskop49
Shield #5103

I was wondering the same thing: A search dredged up this.......


"Dayton" guns?

IIRC member "Linde" has alot of info on 4" five screw wide rib Masterpiece revolvers.


BTW, Although commonly referred to as "Dayton Guns" the Model 14-2 HB was actually advertised as the "Hanen Special"

Let me start with a couple profiles. I also took a few closeups of details.

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	IMG_3446.JPG (111.0 KB, 258 views)

There have been a number of good discussions on several iterations of 4" K-38 Model 14s . . . including the Dayton guns with their unique bull barrel as well as several batches of 4" Model 14 contoured barrels . . . here is one:

Model 14 with 4-inch barrel

The key distinction with the OP example is the Patridge front sight. I don't recall seeing factory 4" runs with other than the Baughman ramp front sights other than those modified by the factory for the U.S. Air Force pistol teams which are generally marked A.F.P.G. (Air Force Premium Grade).

Will await pictures to help identify.

Russ

edit to add: pictures came in while I was typing . . . pictures of the muzzle crown may help. Check out post #13 in the above link . . . it shows an early 5-screw pre-14 s/n K2317XX that shipped to the U.S. Treasury but it too has the Baughman ramp front sight.

A few closeups of details. Note the finish is completely gone at the muzzle.
I took the grips off - they do number to the gun. That's an old Tyler T-Grip, too.

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	barrel front.jpg (26.1 KB, 204 views)
	barrel length.jpg (51.4 KB, 225 views)
	barrel serial.jpg (36.2 KB, 178 views)
	front sight top.jpg (34.6 KB, 187 views)
	front sight.jpg (46.2 KB, 176 views)

Looks cut to me....

LOL, from the pictures that looks like light muzzle wear. I could post you a couple of mine to show you what "finish completely gone at the muzzle" really looks like!

Anyway, nice gun. I like the Patridge sight...

Could be. I make no claims either way. The shiny muzzle made me look more than a few times to see if I could find anything that would tell me it's not original. But I don't know of any .38 barrels with this profile, other than the 4". Any thoughts?

I think it's real.

Here's my 5-screw K-38 with a barrel cut to 4" (came to me like that as a "pre-15") with patridge site. You'll notice the roll marks are offset from where they are on the OP's.








Here's the link to the post about mine, with some comments.

K-38 ? Masterpiece

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SWCA #2817

The barrel on the 4" definitely looks cut in the profile picture. Usually the rib is a tad shorter at the muzzle. Russ is the K-38 guru on the forum. Larry

I looked at that one at AJI's last week... and almost bought it. It is a cool gun, but it looked cut to me as well - however I could not determine how they affixed the sight. I did not see any pins in the rib. A very reasonable price. If it is not cut - GREAT GREAT price, if it is cut, still a great price and a fun shooter.

Congrats!!!

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Richard
Engraved S&W fan

You're correct, Richard. It was sitting there between a couple stainless revolvers (and I was so focused on this one, I don't even remember what they were!) I looked this one over very carefully.... seemed to me that the roll marks at least appeared to be centered properly. I also looked for the serial on the cylinder, extractor and barrel. Everything matched. At that price, well worth taking a chance. Thanks for not adding it to your "museum"!!!

Never tried a Tgrip, not sure I'd like one.

Love the red headed bull barrel

I'm not sure if Roy Jinks can tell from the shipping records what model the gun was when it went out. If someone here would give the EXACT serial number to Roy it may answer some questions.
Just a thought;
Mike

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Mike
S&WCA #2470

What, you noticed the color of her hair? ........ :-) .......

Mike, I edited the first post to show the complete serial number..... no sense in playing that game when I'm showing how the number is on the barrel!

Finally got around to doing some closeups of the barrel-sight area. I'm hoping what I found will give some indication of whether or not this is genuine.
I used a dental pick and pulled away some sort of "putty"-looking material out from the front of the sight on the barrel. What I found is that the grooves extend to the end, and there is some solder-like material visible. I'm thinking this means the barrel WAS cut and the sight soldered on. Any opinions?

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	CM sight closeup.jpg (61.7 KB, 83 views)

I could see from your first set of pics that the rib grooving extended under the front sight. I have replaced a front sight or two myself by grooving the base of the new sight to match the grooves on the rib and then low temp silver soldered the sight onto the rib. I have no explanation for why the roll marks on both sides seem to be centered as though this is the original barrel length. The bluing is gone from the muzzle because if it ever had any it was no better than cold blue.

I also think that this frame was originally a fixed sight frame. IMHO, The milled ledge the rear of the sight set in is not as deep as the factory would have made it. That indicates to me that a gunsmith did this very nice job. I would really like to examine this handgun in person. Are you going to attend the 'Antique Arms Gun Show' in Las Vegas later this month?

Anyway, that is a superb job on a very nice old S&W. Buy it and enjoy it. .....

...Dayton Gun Headquarters...2308 North Main Street...Dayton Ohio...now a Dollar General...

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A Country Boy Can Survive

Oh, I bought it, all right!
I'm thinking now that this was a 6" Target Masterpiece originally. In person, the rear sight installation looks correct to me, at least it matches my others.
By the way, I measured the barrel with an electronic caliper: exactly 4" end to end.
Hadn't planned on Vegas because of commitments here, unfortunately. If you make it down here to Phoenix, though, let me know!