I've noticed a different looking model of 1917 on Gunbroker. It is basically unmarked except for S&W D.A. 45, there is a serial number in the 15000 range with a large S stamped at the ending of the number. It has a hammer with concentric rings which the seller mentions something about being available into the 30's. I read both Jink's book and the 3rd edition S&W book and could find no information regarding this odd-ball. It does not have a lanyard loop, has smooth military type grips and a military looking finish. Gives me all the indications of it being a military issue without the proper stamps. Just curious...

If there's no "United States Property" marking, or US Army on the butt, then it's a commercial model. The S stamp usually indicates the gun has visited the Service Dep't of S&W at some time in it's life ( after it left S&W originally). Are the stocks numbered to the gun? Are there rework/repair dates stamped on the left grip frame? The concentric rings are seen on the Model 1917 hammers from WW1 up to WW2 era on N frames. Not really an oddball - just a Model 1917 that had work done on it. The lanyard swivel hole was nicely plugged at the factory. Ed.

Alot that makes sense, I was under the impression that commercial models had the small logo on the left side, this appears to be missing in the photos, the condition of the blue represents an original finish. Still learning...

Is it the butt serial #15000 the # that's followed by the S?

Or is it the cyl # that's followed by the S?

Is there a logo on the side plate?

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Jim
S&WCA #819

On all of the locations that I can see from the pictures the large S is stamped well after the 15000 number, even on the yoke there is a large S stamped above the assembly number. Under the barrel, on the bottom of the grip frame and on the yoke the S appears, I cannot see the number well enough on the cylinder. There are no logos visible on either side, the only roll marks visible are S&W D.A. 45 on the left side of the barrel, no armory/proof marks anywhere that I can see. I have not questioned the seller regarding marks on the inside of the grip frame, I intend to do that as well as any other identifiable marks. Also on the bottom of the grip frame it does not appear as if there ever was a lanyard ring.

Kinman,

It's clearly a WW I produced frame in the 1 to ~175,000 military serial numbered 1917s. WW I 1917 revolver numbered frames were not all used and only 163,476 revolvers were actually produced, completed, and shipped to the Army or sold commercially until 1/5/1921. These therefore do not have the MADE IN U.S.A. stamp (introduced in mid 1922) on the right side front of the frame like the gun at issue. The gun at issue is also most likely one of those because of the missing logo, but could very well have been assembled and shipped much later. The lack of the small left side logo is an anomaly but we’re very used to this sort of thing on S&Ws.

Another early shipment indicator is the hammer with concentric grooves on the side which started a transition to smooth sided hammers at ~ #15000 and was generally completed by ~ #20,000.

The large S stamped following the serial #s in various locations indicates it’s below ~ serial #42,000 which were inspected under the auspices of Colonel Gilbert H. Stewart whose initials would be on the upper left side rear of the frame had it been assembled and sold under the military contract.

It also indicates the gun was shipped prior to WW II. After WW II a larger S prefix to the serial # on the butt was stamped to indicate N frames that had the new post war sliding bar hammer block safety.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

Thank you Jim

Oh, and I agree, it never had a lanyard ring because the serial # is centered. If it was made with a ring the # would be off center like post war guns, (unless added by the factory before shipping the gun new, in which case it would be drilled thru the centered number).

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Jim
S&WCA #819

I was thinking about your thread/gun and just remembered something regarding the lack of the left side logo:

As you correctly posted, war time 1917s did not have S&W trademark logos (nor even commercial models like yours or did any hand ejectors following the war until ~ 1920).

S&W took awhile to get back to pre war practices and 10 years before all hand ejectors had bright blue finishes again.

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Jim
S&WCA #819