Brazillian M1917

charley co. · #1 10-15-2017, 02:58 PM

I acquired a quite nice S&W M1917 revolver with the Brazillian Crest. This is a definate 'old style' WW1 type frame. The serial # is 480xx. Another web site id'd this as a 1918 frame. The cylinder number, however; is 2082xx! The gun is in excellent cond. with perfect bore, shoots and functions great, parkarized. From what I gather, this would be of the second shipment made up of a bunch of Older unused frames from WW1 and finished with 'spare' parts? It is import marked under grip.. Is it legitimate to have mixed numbers like this...or is this a 'repaired' piece? Any estimate on value

murphydog · #2 10-15-2017, 03:06 PM

Is the 480xx from the flat bottom of the grip frame? If so it may be a put-together gun, but if the number there matches the cylinder you have your answer. Many of these were Parkerized as part of arsenal rebuilds.

Wiregrassguy · #3 10-15-2017, 03:23 PM

Welcome to the forums from the Wiregrass! Look under the barrel on the extractor flat, on the face of the cylinder and on the bottom of the grip frame (also behind the extractor star and on the inside of the yoke arm...Jim?) for the serial numbers. These all should match for it to be an original configuration. If the 48xxx number is inside the yoke, that's an assembly number.

charley co. · #4 10-15-2017, 03:53 PM

The 48xxx number is on the bottom of the grip frame (where the lanyard loop is), the number beneath the bbl. is the same. There are no other marks on the bottom of the grip frame (US GI guns are marked model 1917 or some such there) The number on the yoke is 119xx and that number is on the frame where the yoke fits. I can find no inspection marks or initials. The grips are plain old style tho I'm sure they are re-pros.

Wiregrassguy · #5 10-15-2017, 04:04 PM

Well, apparently the cylinder was replaced with the current one. Open the cylinder and look through the charge holes for the SN on the back of the yoke arm. If it matches the cylinder, the whole yoke/cylinder assembly was replaced.

charley co. · #6 10-15-2017, 04:10 PM

The # on the yoke arm matches the cylinder. Does that mean I paid too much at $350. ????

murphydog · #7 10-15-2017, 04:13 PM

A working N frame in .45 ACP? Don't think $350 is a bad price

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Wiregrassguy · #8 10-15-2017, 04:16 PM

. Ya dun gud, Pard. The folks here have said before that $500 is basement for a decent N frame. And yours doesn't have a cut barrel or plated hammer and trigger.

charley co. · #9 10-15-2017, 04:21 PM

Ah well, I had hoped for the best when I read about the old frames out of storage and spare parts etc. but it is a fine old butt-kicker proud to roar as the large lion it is. Thanks for the info

Wiregrassguy · #10 10-15-2017, 04:24 PM

You might want to consider posting the entire cylinder and frame SN's to see if someone else has your cylinder assembly on their gun. It is possible they got swapped in the armory during refurbishment.

Here's my mutilated 1917 that I got for $200 cause it had a hitch in its gitalong. I've since replaced the hammer and trigger and it shoots just like it did on the battlefield.

charley co. · #11 10-15-2017, 04:51 PM

Not a great pic I guess....but...give ya an idea....

kthom · #12 10-15-2017, 05:05 PM

If that nice old revolver shoots and functions well, you got a bargain, even if some parts are changed. If the timing is right and the cylinder/barrel gap is good and things are relatively tight, I doubt if it would shoot any better if all part were matching.

Jack Flash · #13 10-15-2017, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by charley co.

... The serial # is 480xx. Another web site id'd this as a 1918 frame. The cylinder number, however; is 2082xx! The gun is in excellent cond. with perfect bore, shoots and functions great, parkarized. From what I gather, this would be of the second shipment made up of a bunch of Older unused frames from WW1 and finished with 'spare' parts? It is import marked under grip.. Is it legitimate to have mixed numbers like this...or is this a 'repaired' piece? Any estimate on value

This web site says it left the S&W factory in April, 1918. That would have been easily in time to be sent to France. But who could know for sure? Maybe it was held back due to a problem (?)
U.S. Military Dates of Manufacture

It could have had the cylinder & yoke replaced anywhere along the line. Same thing for who/when/where it got Parked. It passed through a lot of hands before it got to you.

It may well have been in the second (1946) shipment to Brazil, but it doesn't fit neatly into the "standard" serial number ranges for 1946 (see below). But what else is new? S&W was clearing out all the old frames they could scrounge up / shake loose.

This information was gleaned from the two Roy Jinks letters I have and the SCS&W by Supica & Nahas (see pages 163-165).

S/N Range for Brazilian contracts, 1 to 210,000

1) First Brazilian Contract Group (25,000 units), 1938+, serial number range: 181,983 to 207,043

Delivery began 2/15/38, usually in lots of 1,000 units.

2) Second Brazilian Contract Group (12,000 units), 1946

Two s/n subgroups
166,000 to 175,150
207,196 to 209,878