I picked up a pre-war 38/44 Heavy Duty revolver with ivory grips this weekend. It does not have the center grip screw & I would like to remove and test them. Any ideas?

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It appears that there is not a screw holding the grips. The grips may have been glued to the frame. I would, carefully, use a shaving blade with one side only and slip the blade between the grip and the frame. They should come apart or try to heat the grips with a hair dryer and try to soften the glue and then try the blade insertion and try to pry them apart. Go slowly and carefully not to crack the grips. I have never encountered that problem but it is the best way I know to remove the grips without a screw.

Nick

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NRA Instructor\GCA Gunsmith

The only thing I can think of is there is some kind of friction fit. Try this. Take a screwdriver or hammer with a plastic or wooden handle. Hold the gun in your off hand by the barrel and cylinder then rap the knuckle of the frame with the handle to jar them loose.

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Guy
SWHF #474 SWCA LM#2629

Take the side plate off and I suspect you may find the key to what is holding the set on the frame.

Huh, neat. I don't have a suggestion but am curious how they are held on there. Looks cool.

However they are secured to the revolver, the fact is that they are not S&W. I am wondering if they are faux ivory?? They look brand new and are poorly fitted to the frame, so suspect that a previous owner found some stocks they liked and stuck them on, certainly they were not hand fitted to the gun.

It appears they might be glued on, since there is no internal way to secure top and bottom of the stocks?? There could be some sort of spring catch mechanism that simply snaps the two stocks together, but in any case, a single edged razor blade carefully applied should get them off.

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Gary
SWCA 2515

I would bet they were done with a filler block or 3 in the same way one piece grips are done on a SAA
Looks like real ivory to me,I'd leave them be

They look like ivory to me, they have grains & have yellowed and have been on for a while. The old owner of the shop I bought it from said he thought they were ivory. They were on consignment & I can probably take it back, I paid $950 for the revolver; he is a good guy.

My first thought also. But then---a nagging second thought: The so-called "one piece" grips for a SAA are installed/removed by assembling/disassembling the SAA grip frame around the grips----that would be the SAA's two piece grip frame.

And so-------------------------------??????????

Ralph Tremaine

I had some Ivory grips fitted to my revolver awhile back and the guy who did them said it was a shame that there were already grip screw hole in them. He uses rare earth magnets to hold the grips on.
I've never heard of this before and he showed me some revolvers he made, yes he makes his own revolvers (single action).

They were very tight fitting.

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Vietnam 1969-1971

That's the downside of doing them that way on a s&w if the glues any good ;-)

I guess I've led a sheltered existance. The thought of gluing anything to a blued surface strikes me as fraught with peril.

What is the effect of the glue on the bluing? I don't know either, so what's the plan----stick it on there and hope for the best? What's Plan B after Plan A fails?

Ralph Tremaine

The first thing I would try would be to contact the old owner of the store if he knows or ask him to ask the consignor if he knows how they were put on. If he doesn't, it looks as though you have a lot of options to carefully attempt.

I would start by removing the sideplate to see if it might provide a clue as to how it was done. I have never heard of gluing grips to the frame, but there is always a first time. I have no idea if acetone or MEK will harm ivory (I suspect not) but it might work if someone has used Super Glue as an adhesive. Interesting about the high-strength magnets. I didn't know about doing that either.

Why not contact a custom grip manufacturer for their opinion?

I also think that removing the sideplate will lead to a clue.

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Expect the unexpected

why not have the gun & grips x-rared and see what if any metal attaches them to the gun,then if not i would look for adhesive of some type . Remember that the locating pin might have been used to align and help hold them.
that would be better than breaking IVORY

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age is just a number

Had a set of wood grips with same problem. Took a screw driver to them, they snapped apart. There was a big button snap epoxied to each grip halve. Just like ones on my heavy denim coat.... I’m not recommending the screwdriver, just an example of how grips could be attached.

My opinion is to keep it as is and enjoy the gun. Looks like real ivory to
me.

Yes. But rust could be eating it from the inside!

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S&W Accumulator

Looks like ivory to me.

Hi Joba:

Welcome to the Forum. First off, what a beauty! I too think the grips are ivory - also, is that some engraving on the back of the hammer in photo #1? FWIW - I bought a nice Model 642-1 Ladysmith once with a nice set of very tight fitting grips. Once I removed the single grip screw, I could not get the grip panels off of the frame. My solution was to use some waxed dental tape - not floss - and slide it slowly and gently under one of the grip panels, and then gently lift up on it. "Pop" - the grip panel easily came off without any damage, and then it was simple to reach through the frame recess and pop out its counterpart. A coating of old, dried oil was all that had held the grip panels to the frame.

Good luck,

Dave

I don't know about gluing.........

But, Brownell's Acraglas will stick em...Purty much forever and a day.


.

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"IN GOD WE TRUST"

Before you do anything that extreme, why not ask the shop to have the previous owner contact you. Ask the seller how they are attached. The gun looks well cared for, so I doubt they been on it forever.

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I need ammo, not a ride.

You won't have to remove them if you just want to confirm that they're ivory. They're clearly ivory in my opinion and the best evidence is already accessible. You don't need to test them with a hot pin.

Schreger Lines must be present to qualify pieces as elephant ivory. The lines are most easily seen on the butt of grips, or anywhere cuts are made at right angles to the grain. Look for a fine diamond or triangle pattern. Schreger Angles are used to establish whether ivory is from present day elephants or extinct elephants such as mammoths.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

I do believe I mentioned this above in Post # 13. We must have like minds and try not to reinvent the wheel all over again.

My Plan B has always been the same.........and I have to use it more than you may think!

Attached Files

Plan B.pdf (362.1 KB, 163 views)

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Charlie B
SWCA#3083, SWHF#570

Just smack the butt of the gun on the ground with a few good whacks, they should come off then.

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Dave Ramsey Cultist

I have no good idea as to how they are attached but a close up of the butt will show the tell tale real Ivory end grain markings.
I have real ivory grips , fake ivory , polymer and Micarta and have gotten fairly good at spotting the real stuff.
Show us the butt. You know that button attachment method sounds plausible for old grips....never saw one piece grips on a S&W before.
They are neat ,
Gary

"... also, is that some engraving on the back of the hammer in photo #1?"

Some hammers have the patent info on the back, as does that one.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

The top of the grips will move from side to side. The bottom of the grip is solid. The side plate looks like it have never been off & I have never done that. I will have a local gunsmith take off the grips for me.

At the bottom there will be an alignment pin which goes through the grip frame and fits into holes drilled into the bottom faces of the grips. Sounds like your grips are pivoting on the alignment pin so at least it appears that they are not glued in place. Be very careful as trying to force the grips off the pin can break the grips at the hole, and you do not want that to happen with any grips, let alone ivory ones.. Removing the sideplate is not much more involved than removing the screws and tapping in the right place to pop off the sideplate (do not pry it), but you need to be careful to use the correct screwdriver that fits tightly into the screw head slot to avoid buggering the slot.

Remove the screws with hollow ground gunsmithing screwdrivers. I buggered up a few heads with a regular screwdriver before learning this.
You can hollow grind a driver(s) tips to fit the screws...this is what I did until I bought a little gunsmith set with handle and assortment of bits.
If you don't have proper screwdriver go see the gunsmith.
I can also tell you how to fix buggered up heads and slots...as I got good at doing that .
Following thread with intrest
Gary

Sure hope we get the solution to this puzzle,they really look good!

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Hue 68 noli me tangere

I'd load it up and try to shoot them grips off . I'd quit worrying about how they went on and just be glad they did .

Eddie

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Grumpy Old Man With a Gun

I never saw a set of stocks installed like this. Stocks seem too nice to be glued on. I think the glue theory is all wet. But, ANYTHING is possible.

Perhaps being held on by a snug "press-fit" on the bottom guide pin ?

Like some older auto moldings had just pins / studs (tapered to a point) sticking out of the back of the molding, then just pressed fit into circular metal , one-way type, gripper spring clips ? Usually done in blind areas where it could not be reached by hand to install a self threading cutter nut onto the smooth studs. Does not necessarily need the metal clips could just be a very "snug" press fit, I think.

A screw driver blade is too aggressive and will likely do damage. A single-edge razor blade ... perhaps OK to get under but kind of dangerous even if done with care. Cannot lift up on the blade.

Slide a brass or spring steel "feeler gauge", thinnest possible, then once the thin feeler blade is under, try pull up lightly on both sides.

Make sense ?

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ANTIQUESMITHS
LM1300 SWHF425

Have you tried just grasping with fingertips and yanking the grips from the grip frame?

I can see looseness in fit at the top 1/2 round of the grip. Can you slide the grip sideways at all and feel some play?

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Jim
S&WCA #819

+one on the pin fitting snug in the grip hole at the bottom. A replacement screw and a light tap and they likely come right off.

This may sound silly but here is a trick I picked up over the years. Put your hand inside a balloon then grip it firmly.Ive used this trick to get many sets of tight grips off .

What are you proposing he do with a replacement screw and no screw hole?

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Jim
S&WCA #819

try using some dental floss to get under the stocks.

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Mike
S&WCA #3065

Say what ???? "Put your hand inside a balloon and grip it firmly "
Just how do you grip a balloon firmly with you hand inside the balloon.
Us slow people need an explanation of this.
Gary

The suspense is KILLING us. LOL ! Let's see what you have there.

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ANTIQUESMITHS
LM1300 SWHF425

Tear a hole in the side of a deflated balloon ,then insert hand. Then grip firmly using fingertips.This allows you to use and angel grip without your fingers slipping off of the grip .Dont worry I thought the same thing as you did til I tried it on a few tight fitting grips.

You know i didn't look at the second picture. I thought they were one sided with the screw hole like Fuzzy Farrents.:

I can only think of magnets for a likely source of keeping these on now?

Please post a photo, of the butt where the serial number is, showing how the stocks fit / seal.

Some exotic thinking here but perhaps a concealed push to lock pull to release lock mechanism based on a grove or slot machined into the alignment pin ?

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ANTIQUESMITHS
LM1300 SWHF425

I am going to vote like some others. I believe they are in fact real ivory and likely glued on. You mess with them and you may end up kissing a nice set of stocks bye bye .

Many years ago, I saw a similar grip installation. There were added
alignment pins on the frame with blind holes drilled in the grips.
The owner said he just kept tapping the frame till they came off the frame. The pins had rusted and formed a bond to the grips. Or they are glued to the frame.

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Mike 2796
SoFo Bunch member

See what we get because the Romans burned the Library of Alexandria !

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ANTIQUESMITHS
LM1300 SWHF425

You know, those Egyptians just irritated some of my ancestors.

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Mike 2796
SoFo Bunch member