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Old 07-07-2018, 07:15 PM
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Default Model 15 - Cop Gun Help

At the local gun show today, I bought a "heavily used" police M15 no-dash CM. From the SN, it likely shipped around mid-1959 (last three digits masked in the attached picture). I paid a pittance (I'm ashamed to give the price) for it (including a full box of ammo) as it struck me as a good project gun. The original grips on it were in about as beat-up condition as I have ever seen and it had a fair amount of rust, especially around the grips and some heavy cylinder and muzzle holster wear. I stripped it down completely and cleaned all internal parts thoroughly and went over the cylinder, barrel, and frame with copper wool and bore cleaner. That removed most of the rust, except for some pitting under the grips. I went over the holster wear areas with Oxypho Blue, and it blended in very well. I also put on a much better pair of non-diamond Magna grips. After I put it back together and lubed all moving parts, it's as sound and tight as a new gun with an exquisite SA trigger letoff. I imagine it was carried a lot and fired very little.

My question is this. There is a "DPD" stamping between the K and the SN on the butt - see picture. Just based on this, are there any cop gun collectors out there who can venture a guess as to what the "D" might mean? There are probably thousands of cities beginning with "D" (Dallas, Dayton, Denver, Detroit, etc.) but perhaps the style and location of the stamping used might provide an indication as to which one. As it's purely a shooter, I am not inclined to pay for a letter. Just curious if anyone might know the city.



Last edited by DWalt; 07-07-2018 at 08:11 PM.
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Old 07-08-2018, 08:24 AM
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You live in Texas? I would suggest it's a 99% probability that gun hasn't gone far in its life (most don't). I would assume a Texas city that starts with D. Dallas would be an obvious possibility. Ask around if Dallas PD ever issued the M15.

PS: I did a quick read on a forum post regarding the Dallas PD and apparently the officers supply their own sidearms. As this revolver is stamped I think it was issued. Think of another Texas city starting with D.
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Old 07-08-2018, 08:40 AM
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Down here near us...Dayton? I was expecting WAY worse based on your description. That cleaned up great!
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Old 07-08-2018, 11:47 AM
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I humbly submit Dilley Police Department

Seriously the stamping looks similar to what I remember seeing on a couple of 5 screw M&Ps that were said to be Dallas PD Revolvers.

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Old 07-08-2018, 11:49 AM
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I would letter the gun and see what you can find out that way.
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Old 07-08-2018, 12:48 PM
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Defiantly not a Detroit PD gun. They were stamped "Detroit Police" with and inventory number on the back strap and were 5 inch nickel model 10's and Colt Official Police revolvers in the 1950's up until the Glocks came along.
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Old 07-08-2018, 12:59 PM
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Dennis: Guess Scott and I just missed you at Mike's table yesterday Great find for you... the "D" probably stands for Dimebox just outside Coledge Station.
Did you see the 3.5" 27-2 Pinto that came out just before noon? Interesting gun, correctly marked on the grip frame, but definitely not a safe queen...
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Old 07-08-2018, 01:35 PM
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Do I correctly see a 3 digit serial number? K342?


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Old 07-08-2018, 01:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quinn View Post
Dennis: Guess Scott and I just missed you at Mike's table yesterday Great find for you... the "D" probably stands for Dimebox just outside Coledge Station.
Did you see the 3.5" 27-2 Pinto that came out just before noon? Interesting gun, correctly marked on the grip frame, but definitely not a safe queen...
No, I left about 11:30. I showed Mike the M15, and I gave him those beat-up grips. Does Dimebox even have a PD? It's more than a few years since I have been that way, but as I remember it was not much more than a wide spot in the road with a funny name.

Last edited by DWalt; 07-08-2018 at 01:51 PM.
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Old 07-08-2018, 01:53 PM
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Dallas would be the logical guess - due to their potential order volume.
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Old 07-08-2018, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
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Do I correctly see a 3 digit serial number? K342?


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No - I masked the last three digits.
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Old 07-08-2018, 02:19 PM
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I think Dallas PD is the best bet.

I looked into the DPD acronym once in another context. Here are two snips from old threads.
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Old 07-08-2018, 02:25 PM
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...did an image search for DPD...

...Dallas comes up the most by far...
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Old 07-08-2018, 02:36 PM
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Not knowing any better I assumed Dallas as a strong possibility. But I have no knowledge about what kind of revolvers Dallas cops used in the late 1950s (and later) or how they were marked.
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Old 07-08-2018, 02:44 PM
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...found this...

...
Quote:
Detective Paul Bentley of the Dallas Police Department was carrying these Smith & Wesson service revolvers on Nov. 22, 1963, when he helped arrest Lee Harvey Oswald in the assassination of President John Kennedy
...

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Old 07-09-2018, 10:32 AM
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That at least establishes that some Dallas cops had CMs at that time.
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Old 07-09-2018, 04:44 PM
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This is in no way definitive, but may be a possibility. I have an M3 Greasegun with a brass plate with DPD on it. DPD is also stamped on the dust cover. I have seen two other M3's with the same plate and DPD stamp and am aware of at least (1) Thompson SMG with he same plate. After a few years of wondering and researching, finally determined it was Dayton, Ohio PD. A letter may help solve the mystery, but thought I would at least include my 2 cents!
Could you PM me the complete number for my database? Thanks
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Old 07-09-2018, 04:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KEN L View Post
This is in no way definitive, but may be a possibility. I have an M3 Greasegun with a brass plate with DPD on it. DPD is also stamped on the dust cover. I have seen two other M3's with the same plate and DPD stamp and am aware of at least (1) Thompson SMG with he same plate. After a few years of wondering and researching, finally determined it was Dayton, Ohio PD. A letter may help solve the mystery, but thought I would at least include my 2 cents!
Could you PM me the complete number for my database? Thanks
Here are pics of two other DPD plates showing how they are obviously hand stamped and letters are not in alignment.
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Old 07-09-2018, 05:03 PM
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Another vote for Dallas. They did issue them then, and they were also popular with officers buying their own. I recall one detective who wore a nickel one with Franzite "stag" stocks.

They were succeeded by Model 64's. Currently, several SIG models are authorized in 9mm or .357 SIG. I think all are now private purchased, but if an officer is involved in a shooting and his gun is held as evidence, they'll issue a temporary replacement. SIG P-320 is not authorized, for safety reasons.

The Model 64's went to the city security force. I haven't seen one of their officers in a long while. Don't know if they still have them.

Holsters for Models 15 and 64 were the old Border Patrol style designed, I think, by Askins in the 1930's.
This is the holster that Bill Jordan revised to his own desires. TX DPS also used such holsters, but their sidearm then was Model 28, four-inch barrels.

Alas, many cops are not really into guns and their holsters, especially if issued ones, are not exceptional quality and are unlined. They wear a blued finish badly.

I'm glad you rescued that old Model 15. I carried one as a USAF cop and liked it. I didn't like the issued .38 ammo, which was on the weak side. We used unit funds in my section at Lowry AFB in Denver to go off base and buy commercial .38-44 ammo, 150 grain FMJ, to comply with the Hague Accords,although we were not fighting a formal enemy in that location. We were more likely to be shooting a bank robber or BX bandit or rapist, plane saboteur, etc. But I was once on a detail to protect JFK, assisting Secret Service. This was the summer before his murder.

I don't know which ammo DPD issued. A cop I knew carried his onn ammo, often Super-Vel after that arrived. I suppose that it was authorized, not likely issued. If your revolver hasn't got a cylinder endshake issue, they probably used standard speed ammo, with wadcutters for practice and maybe, for qualification. The more gun-savvy officers tended to carry .357's or heavier guns.

I met one man who shot a fleeing felon four times in the back with a M-29. The big .44 Magnum bullets all penetrated completely, but that suspect ran for over a block before dropping. The officer then went to a M-19 .357.

This is more info than you requested, but may interest someone here.

Last edited by Texas Star; 07-09-2018 at 05:31 PM.
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Old 07-09-2018, 09:07 PM
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Another Dallas vote. From retired Captain Eddie Walt:
That gun has all the hallmarks of a fifties era Dallas PD gun. If it is, it should letter to Dave's Pawn Shop, 2544 Elm St. in Dallas. My 1956 DPD S&W Combat Masterpiece and my 1958 Colt Trooper both came through there, each as one in a lot of 50. Neither letter mentions a factory DPD roll stamp and, from the unevenness of the stampings, I believe they were done one letter at a time, either by Dave's or by DPD range personnel, before they were issued.

Roy Jinks told me that Dave's Pawn Shop was a S&W distributor in the forties and fifties and he thought they later became Dave's House of Guns. The pawn shop was located just six blocks from Police Headquarters at 106 S. Harwood.
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Old 07-09-2018, 11:46 PM
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It's been a long time (close to 30 years) since I have been in the east end of downtown Dallas, but I do remember once going into a sort-of pawn and gun shop place not too far from the Dallas police station. I seem to remember they sold a lot of cop stuff there also, and I think it was on Elm.

I'll go with Dallas PD as the most likely source.

Interesting to think it could have been on some downtown Dallas cop's hip when the JFK assassination occurred. I was in Dallas that day, but on the far east end of downtown. I didn't even know that JFK was in town until after the shooting.
---------------------------------------------------------------
"If your revolver hasn't got a cylinder endshake issue, they probably used standard speed ammo, with wadcutters for practice and maybe, for qualification."

No endshake at all with the cylinder. The barrel-cylinder gap is very thin, can barely see a sliver of light through it, and the cylinder locks up tight on each chamber without any wiggle. Timing is perfect.

If I were still bluing guns (I haven't done that for about 10 years), this is one I would definitely blue. I'm leaving it as-is, I am not inclined to throw any money toward getting it refinished as it won't make it shoot any better.

Last edited by DWalt; 07-10-2018 at 02:38 AM.
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Old 07-10-2018, 04:35 AM
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Detroit had Detroit Police down the backstaps of all the revolvers I have seen. They did have DPD incorporated into the SN# of their Glocks, then SW MP's. I do not know what they carry now. DPD on the butt-- Dallas would be a good bet. Be Safe,
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Old 07-10-2018, 05:02 AM
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With a good Plus Pee load, the M15 was a good stopper. A dependable and trusty service weapon, as good and in many ways better as any Glock today.

The Air Force used the M15s to good effect against intruders. It was their guard gun up into the 1990s.
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Old 07-10-2018, 06:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ParadiseRoad View Post
...found this...

......

He had a great taste in nickel and grips
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Old 07-10-2018, 08:48 AM
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I really like those old cop guns and one from the Dallas PD from that era makes you wish it could talk .Congratulations on being its new caretaker .
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