HELP IDENTIFY A FRANKIN GUN

walter o · #1 07-12-2018, 08:44 PM

Just bought a N frame that has been nickled
the S/N is 57448 No letter preceding S/N, looks like the hole for lanyard swivel has been plunged, barrel and frame S/N match ,the barrel rib looks like a m-27 (checkered) 3-1/2 long ,marked s&w 357 magnum right side and Smith & Wesson on the left
5 screw frame,hammer has a patent date,and radial groves
Rear sight is the old 2 screw adjustable sight _(not micrometer)
No Smith & Wesson name at the front bottom on the frame

S&W ucla · #2 07-12-2018, 08:52 PM

Sounds like pre-war magnum. Is top of frame checkered like barrel? If SN 57448 is correct it should have REG- xxxx on the frame when you open cylinder. Does cylinder number match? Pics would be great.

Something like one below?

Hondo44 · #3 07-12-2018, 10:26 PM

Nothing Franken about that one, the Queen Mother of S&W revolver design, their 'Flagship' at the time. Some consider it a Holy Grail gun and they are highly sought after especially in that barrel length, and sell for many $.

Just as S&W ucla described above. And very likely from 1939.

22hipower · #4 07-12-2018, 10:33 PM

Everyone here wants to see pictures!

Jeff
SWCA #1457

walter o · #5 07-13-2018, 12:12 AM

It is not stamped reg.# .it has been put together ,as i said i am thinking it is an older frame with a 357 barrel .Sorry to get people drooling Will post some pictures in the A.M.

not good at taking pictures ,it is too bright outside today

Muley Gil · #6 07-13-2018, 12:48 AM

Is the top strap checkered like the barrel rib? If so, it is a pre WW II .357. S&W stopped the registration process a few years after the introduction.

Hondo44 · #7 07-13-2018, 03:30 AM

The only way a pre war N frame would have the S&W name on the right front frame is if it has a rework date on the grip frame.

You stated the barrel and frame serial # match; how is it a put together?

Are one or both of the serial #s obviously not factory stamped?

It would be an awfully strange coincidence for a 455 Frame or 1917 commercial frame to be #s matching with a 357 Mag barrel.

Is the frame # from the butt?
If not it would be an even stranger coincidence for the barrel # to match the frame assembly #.

one eye joe · #8 07-13-2018, 04:17 AM

C'MON walter o,WHERE ARE OUR PICTURES ? ? ?

THIS SUSPENSE IS KILLIN' US......

cgt4570 · #9 07-13-2018, 10:20 AM

It's a .38/44 or .44 Special target frame with an RM barrel.

The area between the rear sight and the checkered barrel rib would be raised and checkered for on an RM frame. There wouldn't be the weird 'step' as seen on this one. The areas on either side of the top strap around the rear sight would also be checkered.

The hammer has RM style knurling on the spur but looks like it lacks the concentric oil grooves on the sides.
Still a nice combination. Stick to .38 Special loads since it isn't a Magnum frame.

S&W ucla · #10 07-13-2018, 10:43 AM

If you carefully remove the rear sight it should be numbered to match the frame if an original target model. Interesting piece, we were all excited for you it was a RM. May even be made off a 1917 frame if target sights not original. Many good gunsmiths back then could do that work, and the factory would too. We enjoy "drooling" over interesting puzzles too!

Wiregrassguy · #11 07-13-2018, 11:23 AM

If that is a 1917 frame, it was made in May 1918. Hence, the missing Made in U.S.A. However, the butt is not stamped for the Army 1917 or is the 57448 stamped over a plugged lanyard swivel hole? That could be why the barrel has the same SN. Someone stamped the butt the same number as the barrel. What is the SN on the cylinder or are the chambers sleeved?

Also, the sideplate has the large trademark stamp from 1937 onward til after WWII. Hmmmm.

one eye joe · #12 07-13-2018, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by one eye joe

C'MON walter o,WHERE ARE OUR PICTURES ? ? ?

THIS SUSPENSE IS KILLIN' US......

SORRY 'BOUT THAT, walter o. I JUST WENT BACK TO YOUR POST #5, AND SAW THAT YOU HAD ADDED SOME PICS......

I THINK THAT ITS A VERY COOL PIECE ! ! ! YOU WOULD PROBABLY BE BEST SERVED BY SHOOTNG MILD LOADS OUT OF IT. THERE'S NO SENSE IN BEATING THE OL' WAR HORSE UP......

IN ANY EVENT, THANKS FOR SHARING IT WITH US. PLEASE KEEP US ABREAST OF YOUR FINISHED PROJECT, WITH SOME "AFTER" PICS......

M_conrad_0311 · #13 07-13-2018, 11:52 AM

I have not read or seen if the cylinder numbers match. Photos of the barrel SN, better one if the butt SN, a photo of the Left side grip frame. It could be that a problem occurred with the original frame and a smith transfered parts to a different frame. I can see the concentric grooves on the hammer in one of the photos. As mentioned before, if the numbers on the rear sight assembly match, then the RM frame has been liberated of its components somewhere along the way. A letter request may let you know which SN is correct, the frame or barrel.

walter o · #14 07-13-2018, 12:49 PM

the barrel S/n is the same as the butt of the frame .but it does not take a specialist to see that the #on the butt are stamped over the plugged lanyard swivel hole plug. Yes i do think that the registered magnum parts were put into and on a 1917 and heavily buffer before plating years ago..close inspection of the left side by the sight (behind the cyl )appears to be a lite ordnance flaming bomb stamp.Thanks for all of the help.Again sorry about getting others confused also i sat down last nite and figured out some things .
It will be shot with lite loads .

keith44spl · #15 07-13-2018, 01:23 PM

Someone had a set of number stamps...…

And it weren't me !!!!!!!!!!!

.

Hondo44 · #16 07-13-2018, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by one eye joe

SORRY 'BOUT THAT, walter o. I JUST WENT BACK TO YOUR POST #5, AND SAW THAT YOU HAD ADDED SOME PICS......

I THINK THAT ITS A VERY COOL PIECE ! ! ! YOU WOULD PROBABLY BE BEST SERVED BY SHOOTNG MILD LOADS OUT OF IT. THERE'S NO SENSE IN BEATING THE OL' WAR HORSE UP......

IN ANY EVENT, THANKS FOR SHARING IT WITH US. PLEASE KEEP US ABREAST OF YOUR FINISHED PROJECT, WITH SOME "AFTER" PICS......

You were right, the photos were added this morning at 6:58 AM.

Hondo44 · #17 07-13-2018, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by walter o

the barrel S/n is the same as the butt of the frame .but it does not take a specialist to see that the #on the butt are stamped over the plugged lanyard swivel hole plug. Yes i do think that the registered magnum parts were put into and on a 1917 and heavily buffer before plating years ago..close inspection of the left side by the sight (behind the cyl )appears to be a lite ordnance flaming bomb stamp.Thanks for all of the help.Again sorry about getting others confused also i sat down last nite and figured out some things .
It will be shot with lite loads .

I don't see a plugged lanyard swivel hole, and don't think it had one, there's no retaining pin hole for the swivel.

The side plate is not a 1917, it's a post 1936 with large logo stamp. Does the assembly # on the inside match those on the yoke and frame cut out in the yoke?

We need a shot of the left grip frame side,
a photo of the flaming bomb on left side frame,
photo of cyl #,
and better photo of the butt #, try indoors.

I 'smell' a factory rework.

The frame is fine for 357 Mag, it was the cyl that received special heat treating for 357.

29aholic · #18 07-13-2018, 03:40 PM

If you want to get rid of it some day PM me.

Wiregrassguy · #19 07-13-2018, 03:51 PM

Jim,
That circular hole looks like remnants of a weld up. I think the OP has mentioned the lanyard hole was filled in.

Hondo44 · #20 07-13-2018, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wiregrassguy

Jim,
That circular hole looks like remnants of a weld up. I think the OP has mentioned the lanyard hole was filled in.

Thx Guy, you're right. I thought it was too low and just an inspector's 'O' stamp. But you're right, looks like it has a pin in it.

walter o · #21 07-13-2018, 08:42 PM

won't be able to post any more pictured as the gun is at our local show and i will be too out of it after today

one eye joe · #22 07-13-2018, 11:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by walter o

won't be able to post any more pictured as the gun is at our local show and i will be too out of it after today

IS IT FOR SALE AT THE SHOW, OR MERELY ON DISPLAY ? ? ?

I'M CERTAIN THAT IT WILL SPARK INTEREST, AND GENERATE MUCH CONVERSATION. IF ITS DISPLAYED WITH SOME GRIPS ON IT, PLEASE POST A PIC......

HAVE FUN ! ! !

walter o · #23 07-16-2018, 11:21 AM

more pictures as requested & it was at the show for display only.

image of bomb stamp?

left side of frame

with grips

also noticed that crane(yoke) has hole for spring loaded plunger
back of cylinder I cant make out the serial # but cyl. is recesed

Hondo44 · #24 07-16-2018, 12:47 PM

Yep, looks like a non-factory gunsmith rebuild with 1917 frame.

Both the 1917 and 357 Magnum have the yoke plunger cyl hold open device.

Can't make out the cyl # with magnification?

walter o · #25 07-16-2018, 12:51 PM

not with my eyes today. maybe i can get some help to look at it