Ran across this consignment piece in the pawn shop I use for firearm transfers. I'm killing time looking around while he does the NICS check for the gun I'm there for (Nickel 4" 27-2). I go past all the polymer and I see a hump-back hammer N-Frame with moon clips next to it, tag says it's Model 1917 in .45 ACP. That means I'm definitely going to want to look at it. But the barrel is wrong for a 1917. Looks too new, like a post-war (WWII) gun. Have them get it out of the case, and sure enough barrel says 45 cal. Model 1950. So it's had the barrel replaced, if it is in fact really a Model of 1917.

Pull off the obviously not factory grips and sure enough the bottom of the frame says US Army Model 1917, No. 147904.

It's obviously lost whatever collector value it may have had due to the barrel replacement, and the finish is only average. But for a fun shooter, that came with a load of moon clips, I think I did okay for $545.

Any recommendations for a moon clip tool?

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That is not hump back hammer just a regular pre war hammer. Look like some one wanted a 45 ACP target gun and got it. If it shoot good then it was a good deal.
This is a gun with a hump back hammer.

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SWCA 1932 SWHF 135

I can't see anything much wrong with that at all. Let us know how it shoots.

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Pisgah

I'd say you did well. My recommendation for a moon clip tool would be to forget it and shoot 45 auto rim.

I would have bought it too! Hope it shoots good. Those may not bee factory but they look good.

old 1911 fan

There used to be some DIY home made tools on YouTube, maybe some survived the purge. Buying the tool will save you a bunch of money if you shoot it much given the price difference of 45ACP and rimmed brass even if you do reload. There are some plastic moon clips available that are supposed to be easy to use without a tool but I have never tried them.the tool I had came from Dillon, the reloaded people. It worked well enough and was not expensive at all. Look around, find the one that suits you, shoot the Hell out of it.

I like it, especially for the money.

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Made it, Ma! Top of the world!

I like it to. For someone with a mill and some machining skills cutting a fix sight gun to take an adjustable rear sight is not difficult. 1950 barrels mate up to 1917 style frames fairly well.

Your gun looks great and should be a great shooter.

I have a couple Brazilians and recently found a chopped 1950 barrel, so will have another one like yours with a short barrel. I already have one with a cut down 1950 barrel on a 1917 frame.

Before the introduction of the Model of 1950 the S&W factory experimented with making the 1917 into a target model . . . the front sight didn't turn out near as well as the one on your ribbed 1950 barrel.

Below is a 1917 Commercial Model 1917 that the factory converted in July 1949 for a customer.

Russ

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I love a good frankengun! I have a mix and match 1911 always ready and close at hand in the bedroom.

No collector value...........but if it shoots where you point it.......you did good!

As I am a shooter , I would be tickled pink to have it !
$545.00....Not a bad deal at all , I would have jumped on it.
45 acp N frame with adjustable sights and a nice barrel...AWESOME !
Gary

Personally, I think $545.00 was too much to pay for a cobbled together gun, but that's me. Get a BMT tool for the moon clips. It is the best one, bar none. If you spent that much for that gun, you won't mind paying the price for it. 45 auto rim is really expensive and hard to find. Moon clips are cheap and 45acp is everywhere. Enjoy your new revolver. 45acp is fun to shoot out of a wheel gun. I have five in my collection.

Starline in Sedalia, MO has 45 auto rim brass @ $102 for 500 with free shipping, not much more ($8) than 45 acp brass. You can use ACP dies. Moon clips may be cheap but I find them to be a PITA.

I have the Mooncliptool which is not as fast as the BMT but is less expensive.
MOONCLIPTOOL - Home

The Rimz plastic clips are easy to use without tools. They SAY the -25 will not lose rounds if dropped. The -625 is softer and easier to load but less secure. Samples available.
Sample Pack..45 acp

I keep a batch of dedicated revolver .45 ACP brass so I don't run into problems with rims burred and bent by automatic extractors and ejectors binding up cylinder rotation. A friend used the @#$%^& .45 small primer brass for his revolver shooting.

Here is a picture of my homemade moon clip loader. I grabbed up a scrap of two by four and some hardware scraps out of a coffee can. I wrapped some electrical tape around a bolt as a comfortable grip handle. Took ten minutes to make and it works great. The yellow handle de-mooner came free with some moon clips I purchased off of Amazon.

Ain't it pretty.

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[QUOTE=chiefdave;140130749] . . . You can use ACP dies. . ./QUOTE]
With Auto Rim shellholder?

[quote=Marshal Kane;140130844]
Yes, you use acp dies with an auto rim shell holder.

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Sheriff Russell Cottle. ret

As said by a couple of other people, if you wanted a collector gun you did not do well (which you knew up front anyway). If you wanted a shooter, and assuming it does shoot OK, you did real well.

I have a Model of 1955 that shoots great, but really like the tapered barrel.
You did good.

Moonclips are no big deal....still fastest way to load and unload 6. The loading of a moon clip is simple ..use a standard pair of pliers and snap them in....unloading....I use a tool I got from California Custom through Dillon...unloads 2 with every squeeze.

The often touted answer of using .45 Auto Rim seems just unneeded to me when .45 acp is SO readily available just for the picking up, why buy more brass?

Randy

I use the plastic moon clips that are for sale. They make it very easy to load and unload moonclip. I also purchased 45 autorimmed brass by Starline and reload them and that is easy as it gets. I really like the gun you purchased. As many said it does not retain any collector value but is a cheap way to shoot 45 acp from basically a S&W 1950 target gun. For the price I would have thought long and hard and probably would have purchased it too. Enjoy and don't forget to update us on how she shoots and the accuracy of your new "Frankengun".

The ribbed barrel clashing and gaping with the fixed sight frame would turn me off and drive me away in about .07 seconds.

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No life story has happy end.

That was a great buy and will be a fine shooter.

No doubt you didn't buy it to put more money into for target sights. And not everyone wants target sights.

But it's a natural for a post war Micro click rear sight installation.

The long tang N frame sight with square tip (actually the K frame sight for the short barrel models is 1/16" longer than the N frame), milled into the top strap just a little farther forward than on the 1950 models and slightly deeper than shown below, will meet up with the barrel rib. It will look factory and eliminate the Frankengun look.

Actually looks better than the factory installation with the gap between the front end of the sight tang and the rear end of the barrel rib!



The snubby barreled Model 15s, 19s and 66s actually have the nicest factory sight installations extending all the way to the front of the frame.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

I don't disagree with your sentiment. When looking down the sights, I don't see it so it won't affect my shooting, and it was purchased to be a shooter. You can't get a Model of 1950 or a 25-2 for that money unless they're beat to death.

A few weeks ago i also posted about a frankin gun , I am happy to report it is a great shooter .I love it ,some craftsman put it together from at least 2 guns
! a registered magnum and a 1917" N" frame with old style adjustable sights It feels good in the hand and i'll keep and enjoy it, looks like you also have a keeper

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age is just a number

There's a pretty decent sized difference in the height of the rear sight assembly and the ribbed barrel. You are without doubt more knowledgeable than I on this matter, but it's hard to see how it would be safe to mill that much off the frame to get them to match up.

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I'm pretty sure any inaccuracy will be caused by my index finger rather than a fault of the firearm itself... that's pretty much true for every firearm I own. All of them are better at their jobs than I am at the trigger.

[quote=Marshal Kane;140130844]Yes, it goes a lot quicker with the appropriate shell holder.

You bring up a worthy consideration. The extra depth of the sight channel amounts to about .031" which is small relative to the top strap thickness that remains and we're dealing with low pressure cartridges. So no worries in that regard.

And the rear sight tang does not have to be exactly flush with the barrel rib to look good. In fact the factory installations are not either. It just has to be low enough to not leave a light space between the top of the frame and bottom of the sight tang.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

This sort of thing is fairly common.
A friend converted three (that I know of) .357s to .45 Colt. He got Bob Snapp to rechamber the cylinders which meant he had to watch his .45 OAL but he had the proper mould so it was not a real problem.

Two got NOS 1950 .45 barrels which looked fine; the serrated ribs didn't match the checkering of the M27 or the matte of the M28 but alignment was good.
The third got a 1955 barrel which did not blend, but it kicked less so he was happy.

[QUOTE=Jim Watson;140133067]This sort of thing is fairly common.
A friend converted three (that I know of) .357s to .45 Colt. He got Bob Snapp to rechamber the cylinders which meant he had to watch his .45 OAL but he had the proper mould so it was not a real problem.

Here is a franken-pinto in 45 Colt. 28-2 frame. 25 barrel and cylinder have no s/n's so I guess NOS parts were used. Ugly as hell but very accurate and is a great revolver for Missouri's alternative arms deer season

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If you don't already reload for .45ACP I would go straight to .45Auto Rim, do not pass go, do not collect $200. I own a few .45acp pistols but have enough ammo to last the rest of my natural life considering I shoot them rarely. Auto Rim is so much more convenient and sure-fire, moon clips have caused problems for people like a buddy of mine that lost an important state tournament because of a bent moon clip. Noone can argue about the speed of the fast reload of a moon clip but realistically its a moot point, the speed strips from Dillon are very fast and easily fit in your pocket.
If you want to go down that road you can make a simple de-mooner using a piece of 1/2" copper pipe, you simply solder a cap on one end, drop six empty cartridges down the tube or measure what that length is, cut the tube to fit all six, then take a file and remove about 1/2 of the open face, allowing it to fit over the fired round but when rocked right or left will allow the cartridge to release from the clip. If you need a picture I can put one up for you, its pretty easy if you think about it. The neat thing is all your rounds are in the tube, dump them in a bag and hop on top and go dog go.

[quote=chiefdave;140134762]how well has that scope mount held up?

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Merle, retired
western PA

[quote=M E Morrison;140134976]It's an old Williams mount and is really well built. Hasn't shot loose after about 200 rounds.

I appreciate the suggestion. If posting the picture isn't too much trouble, I'd be interested in seeing it. I haven't investigated the cost of .45 Auto Rim. I don't reload, but I already have .45 ACP out the wazoo for my autoloaders.

I spent a bit of time this morning loading half of the 50 moon clips that came with the gun, just doing it by hand while on the computer. We'll see how onerous it is to get the empties back out after the trip to the range next week.

[quote=chiefdave;140135631]
OK, thank you

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Merle, retired
western PA

Yep, you bought a frankengun. It does look like a nice build and it might turn out to be a great shooter. If it shoots well, take care of it, but shoot it to your heart's content, there's no collector value to be lost.

As for ammo, I'd stay away from +P stuff and the hotter European stuff, no need in beating up such a nice looking, old revolver. Moon and half-moon clips can be difficult to deal with, especially if they get bent. If you are thinking of reloading for this piece, I'd suggest reloading 45 Auto Rim cases. Starline does make them and it eliminates those pesky clips.

Looking forward to the range report.

[quote=chiefdave;140134762]That is a cool set up ,what kind of scope mount did you use it looks like it would be very stable .I seem to be clumsy in the woods and always find a stump or root to trip over lol.Sorry I didn't see the post where you already answered this question ,still a cool set up .

Everytime I tell my wife well this is it this is my last gun I'm going to "need" so don't worry about it every time I run across a thread like this and think man I wouldn't mind having something like that . Invariably I'll run across something and next thing I know om telling the wife this is it this is the last gun and she don't even argue anymore she just rolls her eyes and say yes I know it's the last one you'll ever "need" .She says this all started back in the 80s when you bought that big old long 44 magnum because you want to be like dirty Harry ( actualy it's a 629-1 8 3/8 but you know how girls are) then your great uncle left you that old cowboy gun ( its an old M&P in 32/20 beat up but shoots pretty good) and this last one remember you traded for it and that target gun you .Then you said but hon these laser grips cost more than the gun I traded so yea yea I know .Just go get back on the computer and you fellas tell each other how nice your guns are and look at pictures and find one more you just "need" I guess I should be happy those guys don't collect women .

Not a god idea - women are a LOT more expensive than guns....

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Merle, retired
western PA

I agree. And often times, they either take your guns WITH them or you have to sell the guns.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

I agree! And with guns, you can legally and ethically trade an old 44 for a pair of new 22's.

I bought a de-mooner from Brownells years ago. It looks like a nut driver. One can easily be made from a piece of pipe with a 1/2" ID. Grind away about 3/4 of one end, leaving a small teat. If you made it long enough, you can plug the other end and capture the empties.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

Some of us prefer 44's to 22's...

[IMG][/IMG]

That's the best I can do for a picture of my homebuilt de-mooner.

Thank you kindly.

This is the crude but effective way my system works. The first part is showing adding the last of 6 each .45 ACP rounds to the clip. You lay the clip over the lower nut which is the size of the inner ring of the clip. You line up an open slot and place a single round in front of it and then slide your little handle with the electrical tape on in against the round and push it into the clip.

To de-moon, you lay the open end of the demooner over the spent brass or in this case a live round and twist it which dislodges the piece of brass or a live round from the clip.

All of this is not my idea. It was just the crude but effective way I carried it out. It works for me. The de-moomer with the yellow handle came free with some clips I bought off Amazon. I simply attached a leather strap to it and then attached it to my mooner so they would stay together.

Pictures should make it easier to visualize.

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Here is the de-mooning:

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