Triple Lock logo change survey

[delcrossv]

It seems that sometime before S/N 13XXX, S&W changed the logo on the side plate of the 1st Model N frame (Triple Lock) from the large "outlined" logo like this:




To this:
This is mine, letters nickel SN 13657 shipped 12/17



And here's lamarw's close S/N to mine:



Just trying to get a handle on when this change occurred

[andy52]

Can't give a date of the change but for reference here's my TL shipped 1915, the books actually shows a manufacture date of 1911 for this ser# and it has the large logo.

[EarlB]

S#10,572 which did not ship till Nov 1917 has large logo and was originally nickel. Still is but was renickeled t some point. Earl

[delcrossv]

Originally Posted by andy52

Can't give a date of the change but for reference here's my TL shipped 1915, the books actually shows a manufacture date of 1911 for this ser# and it has the large logo.

Hey Andy, what's the S/N range for that?

[andy52]

Originally Posted by delcrossv

Hey Andy, what's the S/N range for that?

6614, it has a interesting background I'm not sure how accurate the book is on TL ser#s but it shows that one as manufactured in 1911 and shipped according to Roy in 1915 which seems like a long time to sit at the factory.

[Muley Gil]

The TLs were kinda expensive and were slow movers. I have a commercial 1917 that shipped about 6 years after most of them in their serial number range did. Of course, mine was built during the Depression.

[hibbs]

TL #7436 shipped Dec.1913, Special Order .44/40 has small emblem

TL Target #14285 shipped Jan.1918 also has small emblem

Richard

[raljr1]

My nickel TL serial number 11701 shipped in February 1916 an has the outlines aroun the words trade and mark

Robert

[delcrossv]

Originally Posted by hibbs

TL #7436 shipped Dec.1913, Special Order .44/40 has small emblem

Richard

That seems to be an exception to the S/N correlation. Maybe because it was a Special Order?

[bmcgilvray]

11906 has the large logo. Need to get a factory letter on it.

[mrcvs]

I have data on the following 5 triple locks. All 5 have the larger logo with the encased "TRADE MARK":

No 225, shipped 23 Jan 1908, 6 1/2", blued, medallion stocks, probably a later replacement.

No 3459, shipped 02 September 1913, 6 1/2", blued, non medallion stocks, believed to be original and a production date of pre-mid 1910 on this one.

No 1219, shipped 16 May 1910, 5", nickeled, medallion stocks (replacement stocks courtesy of myself).

No 10094, shipped 01 July 1915, 4", nickeled, medallion stocks (replacement set courtesy of myself).

No 11826, shipped 23 October 1915, 6 1/2", nickeled, medallion stocks (replacement set courtesy of myself).

[410bore]

No 2243, Shipped March 1914, 5", Blue, and has the large logo.

[delcrossv]

Messer's 4" s/n 140XX has the small logo.

[TripleLock]

No.12064 has the large logo. 6-1/2", nickel, gold medallion stocks. Shipped September 1, 1915.

[delcrossv]

Originally Posted by TripleLock

No.12064 has the large logo. 6-1/2", nickel, gold medallion stocks. Shipped September 1, 1915.

Thanks TripleLock, I was looking for some in the 12000 range.

[WCCPHD]

Here's 5642

Shipped in April of 1915

[delcrossv]

Keep 'em coming! Anyone have one in the mid to upper 12000's?

[LEO918]

Here's TL #6971 - Shipped 1910...

[CptCurl]

I have a .455 Triple Lock with the same logo. s/n 12787.







I must admit, I hadn't noticed the difference in the logo before I read your post. I have three .44 Spl. Triple Locks, all earlier serial numbers, and all with the older style logo.

Curl

[delcrossv]

So, working with the assumption that the change correlates with serial number, it was between 12064 and 12787. That's pretty focused! Thanks everyone! If we can narrow it more, even better.

I'm thinking the special order gun was an outlier due to the odd caliber (?) Early frame/later sideplate?

[The Gila Bender]

TL Target 7133* (shipped 9/26/12) has the large outline logo. TL 12742 (.455 assumed assembled from surplus parts in 1916 and shipped to Shapleigh Hardware 12/29/17) and TL 13623 (.44 shipped 11/14/16) have the small logo. All were shipped with blue finish. The Target wears a factory 1950's reblue, the .455 was nickeled long before it found me, and old 13823 is a rough 'n' ready shooter from El Paso, TX.
1st Model Target 7133.JPG 035.JPG TL .455 12742 right.jpg TL 13823 Right.jpg

[Club Gun Fan]

Originally Posted by andy52

Can't give a date of the change but for reference here's my TL shipped 1915, the books actually shows a manufacture date of 1911 for this ser# and it has the large logo.

Could you tell me how you know it was manufactured in 1911?

[andy52]

Originally Posted by Club Gun Fan

Could you tell me how you know it was manufactured in 1911?

According to the 4th S&W catalog it shows that Ser# falling into the 1911 range beyond I couldn't tell you more.
The TL was shipped to Shelton- Payne arms Company, El Paso Texas Aug,25th 1915. The Shelton-Payne Arms company was notorious for selling arms to both sides of the Mexican revolution at that time , legally and illegally. This TL has a import stamp that indicates it was returned to the US from Mexico in the 70s. My assumption is that it was sold illegally to a Mexican and then imported back into the US.

[andy52]

Originally Posted by CptCurl

I have a .455 Triple Lock with the same logo. s/n 12787.









I must admit, I hadn't noticed the difference in the logo before I read your post. I have three .44 Spl. Triple Locks, all earlier serial numbers, and all with the older style logo.

Curl

The building that it shipped from still exists to this day on the St. Louis river front.

[Muley Gil]

"My assumption is that it was sold illegally to a Mexican and then imported back into the US."

I am unaware of any laws in 1915 that would prevent a citizen of Mexico from crossing into the US and buying a handgun.

[andy52]

Originally Posted by Muley Gil

"My assumption is that it was sold illegally to a Mexican and then imported back into the US."

I am unaware of any laws in 1915 that would prevent a citizen of Mexico from crossing into the US and buying a handgun.

I'm not aware of the US laws of the time but you have to bare in mind that two countries were involved in that conflict. Here's some of the sources I used when researching my TL.

Shelton Pane Arms Co. - El paso street history

https://historicelpaso.com/historic_...charles-hotel/

[bruce5781]

No. 7067 has no logo.

Sent from my SM-G930VL using Tapatalk

[CScott]

Here is S/N 398 with the logo almost completely buffed off but still visible enough.
Scott

[mrcvs]

Three more late shipped Triple Lock revolvers, all without the outlined logo: 13175, shipped 31 March 1917; 14387, shipped 8 Dec 1917; 14980, this being in .455 Webley in the large lot shipped to Shapleigh Hardware 29 Dec 1917.

[mrcvs]

Serisland number 4823, a TARGET model, has the smaller logo without the outline. Seems unusually early for this as the ship date was August of 1911. Perhaps this has something to do with the fact this is a TARGET model?

[mrcvs]

Originally Posted by mrcvs

Serisland number 4823, a TARGET model, has the smaller logo without the outline. Seems unusually early for this as the ship date was August of 1911. Perhaps this has something to do with the fact this is a TARGET model?

Please disregard the aforementioned. As it turns out, 4823 is an assembly number for Triple Lock Target Model serial number 14,200, a Target Model without the outline and with the smaller logo. I cannot speak for the configuration of Triple Lock serial number 4823, nor the configuration of its logo, as I have never seen it before.

[delcrossv]

Triple Lock target. S/N 14387, shipped 12/8/17. Small logo.
Figured a picture would be nice