Swing out cylinder
Serial Number 332197
No Model number
38 S & W special ctg
5 screw side plate(plate is missing, screws in place)
Fixed sight
Strain Screw
5" barrel

You have a S&W M&P 38Spl with no side plate but all four screws in place

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Mike 2796
SoFo Bunch member

Probably shipped around 1920.

Most likely shipped late 1920 - April, 1921


S&W revolvers did not have model numbers from 1852 to 1957 so this is not an identifying feature. No S&W revolver sideplate ever had more than 4 screws, so this is not an identifying feature either. The 5th screw of a "Five-Screw" gun is in the front of the trigger guard bow. And, finally, all S&W revolvers that have a flat mainspring have strain screws, again, not an identifying feature

Good information above...except if you see a letter C in front of the serial number, which would indicate a gun about 30 years (edit: "newer") than without the letter prefix.

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

I believe that is backwards. If the serial number has a "C" prefix, it was built in the 1950s.

BTW, welcome to the Forum HHYoder. If you can post some pictures, I may have a side plate that will fit your revolver.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

Yep. For M&Ps IIRC it's no letter, S prefix , C prefix, then K prefix .

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SWCA #3356, SWHF#611

Forgot the V prefix.

That came first after 999,999.

And the K is for the adjustable sight model, not the M&P.

D came after C, in 1969.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

C is the newest I own.

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SWCA #3356, SWHF#611

.pdf showing missing side plate opening.

War Eagle! '66

Attached Files

S&W.pdf (134.3 KB, 103 views)

Whoever removed the side plate knew enough to be careful with the screws , the are not chewed up ... what did he do with said side plate?

The stocks are from a 1910-1920 decade gun and it does not have the C prefix style hammer block (or hammer), so the earlier age estimate is correct. Replacement correct sideplates are available but will require professional fitting.

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

...the photo above...rescued from the pdf...

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A Country Boy Can Survive

The original owner died in 1940.
His 98 year old daughter in moving and a friend of mine who was helping her move found the gun in a linen closet. It had a piece of clear tape where the side plate should have been. That's the way see remembers it always being.
I would like to find a side plate to have fitted to it.

Why on Earth did you buy the gun sans a sideplate?!

Was it free to you? Very cheap?

Fortunately, someone here may be able to locate one for you, but these require individual fitting. By a COMPETENT revolersmith...

Good luck, and I hope this poor gun has finally found a good home.

When it gets the sideplate, don't use Plus P (higher velocity) ammo in it. Heat treating of cylinders for added strength didn't happen until late 1919. IF the grips are original, this gun is before or right at that date. Someone who keeps up with old serial numbers can give you the precise serial number at which heat treating began. But S&W does NOT warrant use of Plus P ammo until model numbers began in 1958, for ALL STEEL guns. Aluminum frames are not included.

Your poor gun that needs transplant surgery is all steel, but metallurgy then wasn't as advanced as in later decades, so go easy on hot loads. They probably won't blow up a heat treated cylinder, but will accelerate wear if fired a lot and you'll experience cylinder endshake sooner than if you stay with midrange target ammo and standard speed cartridges.

To save you asking, .38 S&W Special CTG on the barrel means it is for those CARTRIDGES. If you knew this, maybe that info will help someone else reading this post.

I just read your baffling signature line. Is that why most cans of tuna in my grocer have dented cans? Many of the dents are quite bad, and this condition seems to apply to all brands.

Frankly, I quit eating canned tuna because of it.

Now, back to our topic...

And thanks for enlarging the OP's tiny photo. His gun was made around the time that S&W made changes in the action, so the experts need that pic to determine if this is a 4th Change or earlier. Or, I guess they can look up the serial number, but the pic makes it easier to determine that and saves number lookup.

OK , I'll bite -

How is it that a S&W side plate , which appears to be produced in a very precise fashion , probably with the aid of some sort of jig , needs to be individually fitted to a specific revolver?

Asking because I do not know ,
Signed , Not A Machinist

I have a accumulation of old side plates. I'm going to get with Forum member tennexplorer (who is also an Auburn grad) & get back to you.

"Fortunately, someone here may be able to locate one for you, but these require individual fitting."

TS, every now and then, you find one that will fit with very little fitting.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

Gil, just sent you a PM. This is a Model 1905 4th change. The problem is that there were "on-the-fly" engineering changes on those guns that didn't cause a nomenclature change. Off the top of my head I can think of three major types of 1905 4th changes. And now to start the real controversy. If you can't find the type of sideplate that is the actual correct version for your revolver, but can find one that fits and looks good, other internal parts can be swapped to make the revolver operational. Just depends on your dedication.

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S&WCA 1729

There was a post on the Forum recently that stated that the side plates were made slightly oversized and then swaged to fit the individual revolvers. That is why assembly numbers were stamped on parts, to keep these parts together. Once polished and the finish is applied, if you look at the fit of the side plate to the frame, you can barely tell these are separate parts.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

ALMOST any K frame sideplate will screw onto any given K frame gun. You MIGHT have to beat it down with a plastic mallet, or it might fall into the mortise with some tiny gaps here and there.
YES, they were made to precise tolerances, but machines change over time. Bearings wear, and cutters wear, creating slight differences.
Sideplates were polished on the frame so that the frame and plate match perfectly. That means some sideplates will be too thin and be below flush on a different frame, or too thick for a different frame.
The MAIN problem in attaching a non-original sideplate is the "four corners" circled in the pic. Again- polishing ON the frame means those four corners match the frame perfectly without a bump or recess. I have never seen a replaced sideplate that matched PERFECTLY at all four corners without some polishing.

Attached Images

1amissingsideplate.jpg (19.1 KB, 195 views)

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Regards,
Lee Jarrett

Muley Gil - Well that makes sense. How a machinist/gunsmith is able to retrofit such a piece is lost on me , but again I'm no machinist.

I'm guessing that CDC , MIM and the like have done away with that process you described.

ejector - Thanks for the further explanation , which I read after the above post. Very helpful.

I will be interested to learn of the OP's efforts in replacing the missing side plate.

...it's a line spoken by Spencer Tracy as Capt. T. G. Culpepper in the movie "It's a Mad Mad Mad Mad World"...

...the following discourse was between him and his wife on the phone:

The Smiler Grogan case is solved.
The what?
What the hell is the Smiler Grogan case?
The tuna factory robbery.
The case I've been talking about
for the last 15 years.

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A Country Boy Can Survive

Oh. Thanks. I never saw that movie. But many signatures on gun boards evade my understanding and often don't seem to relate to guns.

...if you like comedy...it's a classic...

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A Country Boy Can Survive

HH,

I mailed you a side plate today.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

I received the side plate from Muley Gil and it fit perfectly. Thumb pressure was all it took to get it into place. The hammer stop worked perfectly.
It's ready to go back to it's owner.
Can anyone tell me from the serial number when this gun was made.
The Lady would also like to know it's value, any ideas on that?

Here is a photo of the installed side plate. Looks pretty good for a 100 year old, plus, handgun.

Attached Images

S&W 38 Spl HE.JPG (99.0 KB, 39 views)

M&P’s with serials bracketing this one from the 320- to the 340-range shipped in March to May 1920, not in exact serial order. Probability puts this gun in that ballpark.

As for value, these aren’t scarce or highly sought-after. So condition matters. 300-plus would be my wild guess.

Whoa! Very nice - its good to the old boy back in fighting shape.

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“What you got, ain’t new.”

WOW! It really does fit well. I have owned a Smith or two over the years that didn't have a side plate fit any better.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!