5 Screw Pre 29 with 4" Bbl

Vettepartz · #1 06-20-2019, 07:39 PM

I have two dogs, and on Father's Day, they were kind enough to each buy me a new (to me) revolver. They came today, and here is the first. It is a 4" blue pre-29 with serial S1530XX. The SCSW book says that about 3100 were made in the first year, and probably less than 25% were 4". With this serial number, this could be one of them. I have sent for a letter of authenticity to see when it was shipped. It has target hammer, target trigger, red ramp with white outline, and a nice set of "Cokes" on it.

I will post the other revolver in a couple of days.

22hipower · #2 06-20-2019, 07:47 PM

We need to hear (and see) more about your two very generous dogs. Very nice revolver, with a little luck it will be a first year gun. If I remember correctly, according to Mr. Jinks there were only 700 4 inch 5 screw pre-29s; and only 200 4 inch shipped in 1956. How about sharing the story about where your dogs found such a prize. Enjoy.

Jeff
SWCA #1457

llowry61 · #3 06-20-2019, 07:49 PM

I think you need to reward those dogs with some treats! That is one nice revolver.

hkcavalier · #4 06-20-2019, 07:51 PM

Yes, please more details about these dogs.

Mine just find roadkill and fertilize my lawn.

Vettepartz · #5 06-20-2019, 08:37 PM

OK - My dogs found both guns at a pawn shop in Florida. Here are their pictures. The one guarding the floor with her stomach is Addy and she is an Australian Shepard mix. The other is Leo, and he is an Australian Cattle dog mix, or as they call them here in the US, a Blue Heeler mix. Both of them, the dogs and not the guns, came from rescue shelters.

NavySCPO · #6 06-20-2019, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vettepartz

OK - My dogs found both guns at a pawn shop in Florida. Here are their pictures. The one guarding the floor with her stomach is Addy and she is an Australian Shepard mix. The other is Leo, and he is an Australian Cattle dog mix, or as they call them here in the US, a Blue Heeler mix. Both of them, the dogs and not the guns, came from rescue shelters.

Good dog, good dog!

Now, 1) how did you teach them to use the ATM or credit card, and 2) keep your wife from finding out?

Hondo44 · #7 06-20-2019, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vettepartz

OK - My dogs found both guns at a pawn shop in Florida.

Excellent!

Good doggies....What/where is the other gun?

mh51 · #8 06-20-2019, 11:42 PM

I'll trade one wife and three kids for those dogs!!!

7tenz · #9 06-21-2019, 05:25 AM

Need an education, I have heard of and seen 4 screw, but not 5. Where is the 5th located?

murphydog · #10 06-21-2019, 07:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 7tenz

Need an education, I have heard of and seen 4 screw, but not 5. Where is the 5th located?

Here you go!

To IDENTIFY your Gun >

Doc44 · #11 06-21-2019, 08:53 AM

44 Magnums with a 4-inch barrel began to ship in small quantities in October 1956 with less than 200 being shipped in the first year and approximately 700 shipped with a 5-screw frame. 44 Magnums with a serial number in the S153000 range shipped as early as November 1956 with some shipping as late as May/June 1957. Your letter of authenticity will tell you.

Bill

Hondo44 · #12 06-21-2019, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by murphydog

Here you go!

To IDENTIFY your Gun >

Just to be aware, the I and J frames are the exceptions to that screw count shown:

The I frames actually have a 6 screw count, the 6th screw being the mainspring tension screw in the fore grip strap which is the first to be deleted.

I and J frame frame screws #4 & #5 are reversed, the trigger guard screw is #5 because it went away before the top side plate screw which is #4.

7tenz · #13 06-21-2019, 05:59 PM

Thanks, Murphydog and Collects. I have seen the 5th one before, just didn't know it was considered related to the sideplate screws.

moosedog · #14 06-21-2019, 06:33 PM

A nice, hard to find gun. Here's mine that I got several years ago. # S 153627 shipped 12-5-56 to Sports Inc in Chicago.
No, my dog did not buy it for me..................my cat did.

Vettepartz · #15 06-22-2019, 02:16 PM

Hey - My dogs got 9 "Likes" in the post with their picture. I guess we have some dog lovers on here. That's a good thing.

murphydog · #16 06-22-2019, 02:22 PM

Do you see the serial number in the extractor rod cutout? Probably an original 4" if so.

Vettepartz · #17 06-22-2019, 03:01 PM

Yes, same serial number on extractor cutout, frame, back of extractor star, cylinder, and on the yoke arm. No numbers on the inside of the "Cokes".

smitholdtimer · #18 06-22-2019, 04:04 PM

Where do you get these "Enabler Dogs"? Haven't been able to locate a breeder in this area?

mbliss57 · #19 06-23-2019, 07:25 AM

Wow we just got a new dog a couple of months ago. I guess I should have waited until today so I could have obtained one of your pups! That's an exceptional find especially from a pawn shop. They are really quite rare (less than 200) as a 1956 5 screw with a 4" barrel. I looked for quite some time before I found my 4" 5 screw. S156254 shipped Nov 1956. I often wonder where they all are. I would bet the majority of them are owned by S&W collectors. But there is always one lurking in a sock drawer somewhere and then someone who knows nothing about guns takes it to a pawn shop and gets a few hundred dollars for it.

mbliss57 · #20 02-20-2020, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vettepartz

I have two dogs, and on Father's Day, they were kind enough to each buy me a new (to me) revolver. They came today, and here is the first. It is a 4" blue pre-29 with serial S1530XX. The SCSW book says that about 3100 were made in the first year, and probably less than 25% were 4". With this serial number, this could be one of them. I have sent for a letter of authenticity to see when it was shipped. It has target hammer, target trigger, red ramp with white outline, and a nice set of "Cokes" on it.

I will post the other revolver in a couple of days.

Did you ever get your letter back on the 4" pre 29? Can you share when it shipped?

Vettepartz · #21 02-21-2020, 09:02 AM

Yes, I did get the letter. This gun was shipped in February 1957, not the first year. It goes to show that the serial numbers of the N-Frames at that time seemed to jump all over compared to the shipping dates. I have seen the 5-screws with much higher serial numbers shipped in the first year.

22hipower · #22 02-21-2020, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vettepartz

I have seen the 5-screws with much higher serial numbers shipped in the first year.

Indeed, mine (S161859) shipped in November 1956. Would be interesting to know what process they used for inventory control, sure doesn't appear to have been FIFO (first in, first out). Great gun though even if it technically missed the "first year" window.

Jeff
SWCA #1457

Doc44 · #23 02-21-2020, 09:54 AM

Randomization of serial numbers was not due to inventory control as guns were not made in serial number order to begin with. The manufacturing process itself primarily resulted in lower numbers being shipped later than higher numbers.

This issue is addressed in the book on the 44 Magnum, pp. 20-21.

Also, when a product does not have an expiry date, FIFO is not actually necessary.

Bill

22hipower · #24 02-21-2020, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc44

This issue is addressed in the book on the 44 Magnum, pp. 20-21.

Bill

Great info Bill, along with more good data the rest of us don't have. . . . so, when will more of your books be available? Maybe bring some to Tulsa? I know, I know, should have been quicker on the trigger when they first came out.

Jeff

mbliss57 · #25 02-22-2020, 03:55 PM

Thanks.. I was talking to someone else who has a 5 screw 44 magnum serial number in S156xxx range. He was sure it must have shipped in 1956. This just fortified my position that he can’t know without an actual ship date. Especially on the 1st and 2nd year 44 magnums.

One thing I’ve wondered about though.. when did they assign the serial number to a frame vs when it shipped? Did a S150xxx just sit around finished for months or was it assigned a serial number and never finished until months later while later numbers were finished ahead of it?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Doc44 · #26 02-22-2020, 06:44 PM

Final assembly, etc. was completed in random order. S166065 was completed and shipped many months before S153810 was completed and shipped. Look on pages 20-21 of the book on the 44 Magnum.

Bill

Nedroe · #27 02-22-2020, 07:19 PM

This one, S166978, shipped on November 4th, 1957.

I've had the pleasure of it's company since the mid 80's sometime.

Ned

Wildwest22 · #28 02-22-2020, 09:19 PM

Vettepartz, did the pawn shop know exactly what they had? Awesome find, congrats

Engine49guy · #29 02-22-2020, 09:39 PM

Being a "Died in the Wool" early Combat Magnum fan I am instinctively drawn to the 5 screw four inch .44 Magnum and always lamented that there were no five screw .357 Combat Magnums ever produced to directly partner up with one.

BTW I admittedly have terminal OCD... ( this is not a good thing to have when you collect S&W revolvers as quite often things don't make alot of sense) ....
Anyway what kinda nags at my craw is since the 4" version is lumped in with its long tube brothers but doesnt begin to ship in quantity until late 1956 the 4"er really only has about a two or three month window for being considered a "First year gun" while identical guns that were shipped a month or two later in early 1957 are considered "second year" guns.

Perhaps the 4" guns could have even been given a separate designation as the "S&W .44 Combat Magnum" .

Hondo44 · #30 02-22-2020, 11:01 PM

I hear ya! And we're not alone.

I have seen at least one 4 screw with the 5th screw added.