Kinda' cute...

BC38 · #1 01-29-2020, 11:19 PM

...in a worn and well-used sort of way.

Found this little nickled .32 HE the other day. Mechanically it is quite good. Bore is pretty good - looks like some hints of pitting, but it may be just leading. Chambers all look good. Locks up nice, no significant endshake. Action is smooth and pretty light.

The nickel plating has seen better days (obviously). But there is no significant rust that I could see. A good cleaning and polishing with some oil and bronze wool followed by a wax job would likely do wonders. The grips are worn but not excessively. Unfortunately the left grip has been cracked by over-tightening the grip screw. Is that fairly repairable?

Anyway the asking price is the princely sum of $150. Seems like a pretty reasonable price to me. Am I out of my mind for even considering it?

BC38 · #2 01-29-2020, 11:22 PM

More photos...

Old_Cop · #3 01-29-2020, 11:25 PM

I would adopt that revolver, but I am sentimental and old too.

BC38 · #4 01-30-2020, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old_Cop

I would adopt that revolver, but I am sentimental and old too.

Yeah, I resemble that remark too.

I seem to recall reading somewhere that 32 cal revolvers can also shoot 32 ACP, but I'm thinking that due to age that wouldn't be a good idea with this one, correct?

EDIT: Nevermind - I looked up the SAAMI specs on both. 32 S&W Long is 15,000 PSI and 32 ACP is 20,500 PSI. So obviously the 32 ACP ammo pressures would be about 35% too high for this old revolver. Looks like it would be OK in a 32 H&R magnum though.

kscharlie · #5 01-30-2020, 12:09 AM

Where else can you get a gun for $150 that goes bang and puts a smile on your face at the same time? I don't see a down side...

glowe · #6 01-30-2020, 12:09 AM

Good decision on sticking with 32 Long. I do know that many people have shot 32 ACP ammo in top-break 32 S&W DAs, but never tried to chamber 32 ACP in a 32 Long revolver?

kscharlie · #7 01-30-2020, 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BC38

Yeah, I resemble that remark too.

I seem to recall reading somewhere that 32 cal revolvers can also shoot 32 ACP, but I'm thinking that due to age that wouldn't be a good idea with this one, correct?

EDIT: Nevermind - I looked up the SAAMI specs on both. 32 S&W Long is 15,000 PSI and 32 ACP is 20,500 PSI. So obviously the 32 ACP ammo pressures would be about 35% too high for this old revolver. Looks like it would be OK in a 32 H&R magnum though.

The cylinder is too short to accommodate the .32 H&R. You would have to move all the way up to Model 30-1 (true J-frame) with a 1.4" cylinder. The I-frame revolvers had a 1.25" cylinder.

Krogen · #8 01-30-2020, 12:34 AM

Buy it! That revolver has character! If I were at the gun counter beside you, I'd be trying to get my wallet out before you got to yours.

I suppose fixing the grip would be low on my priority list. Should you decide to try a repair, it wouldn't have to be invisible. A crude repair could fit just fine with that revolver's panache.

merl67 · #9 01-30-2020, 01:06 AM

For $150 I would buy it a bit of super glue will fix that grip right up.

BC38 · #10 01-30-2020, 01:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kscharlie

The cylinder is too short to accommodate the .32 H&R. You would have to move all the way up to Model 30-1 (true J-frame) with a 1.4" cylinder. The I-frame revolvers had a 1.25" cylinder.

I think you misunderstood me. I wasn't suggesting shooting 32 H&R magnum in this little 32 S&W Long.

I was saying that the 32 ACP would be safe to fire in a gun chambered for 32 H&R magnum - but not in this gun due to the higher pressure of 32 ACP vs 32 S&W Long.

Looks like you answered my next question - as to whether this one is an M-frame or an I-frame. Thanks for that info.

BC38 · #11 01-30-2020, 01:49 AM

One reason for my hesitancy is that I don't currently reload anything in 32 caliber. So that means I'd be starting from scratch to add it to the bench. I sure ain't gonna buy factory ammo to try to feed it. Unfortunately I probably would have to buy a supply of new brass - unless someone knows a reasonably priced source for once fired 32 S&W Long brass. I guess I could download some 32 ACP cases. I know they can be had for a reasonable price. Maybe start with about 2/3 of a normal 32 ACP powder charge?

EDIT: I just checked the price on Ammoseek. PPU 32 S&W can be had for just under $0.33 a round including shipping. At 3 for a buck I guess I could buy a couple of hundred factory rounds to get myself set up with a small supply of brass. I doubt I'd ever want to shoot more than a couple of hundred rounds at a time and they are low pressure enough that the brass would likely last for a BUNCH of reloadings.

Hondo44 · #12 01-30-2020, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kscharlie

The cylinder is too short to accommodate the .32 H&R. You would have to move all the way up to Model 30-1 (true J-frame) with a 1.4" cylinder. The I-frame revolvers had a 1.25" cylinder.

I'm pretty sure he meant ok to shoot 32 ACP in a 32 H&R chambered revolver. And it would.

I don't see an issue in any post 1920 (heat treating became standard on all S&W revolver cyls.) .32 Long cyl. And have shot it with no ill effects. Any damage would be cumulative over a log period of time, not catastrophic or immediate. Shoot 32 Longs and carry loaded with 32 ACPs.

BC38 · #13 01-30-2020, 02:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hondo44

I'm pretty sure he meant ok to shoot 32 ACP in a 32 H&R chambered revolver. And it would.

I don't see an issue in any post 1920 (heat treating became standard on all S&W revolver cyls.) .32 Long cyl. And have shot it with no ill effects. Any damage would be cumulative over a log period of time, not catastrophic or immediate. Shoot 32 Longs and carry loaded with 32 ACPs.

Correct - and really?

It would be OK to shoot 32 ACP in this one? Even though the SAAMI pressure spec for 32 ACP is more than 1/3 higher than the 32 S&W Long?

I see above that glowe says he's shot 32 ACP in top breaks and it was OK.

Both of those really surprise me - I would expect the 32 ACP to do damage due to just too much pressure.

32 ACP ammo is more reasonably priced - about a quarter a round including shipping.

You guys are going to talk me into this one. What a bunch of enablers!

Hondo44 · #14 01-30-2020, 03:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BC38

Correct - and really?

It would be OK to shoot 32 ACP in this one? Even though the SAAMI pressure spec for 32 ACP is more than 1/3 higher than the 32 S&W Long?

I see above that glowe says he's shot 32 ACP in top breaks and it was OK.

Both of those really surprise me - I would expect the 32 ACP to do damage due to just too much pressure.

32 ACP ammo is more reasonably priced - about a quarter a round including shipping.

You guys are going to talk me into this one. What a bunch of enablers!

No, not in that one, only post 1920 32s. From its serial #, it was made between 1906 and 1909, way before cyls were heat treated.

And I don't shoot ACP in top breaks. Albeit, one can find higher pressure ratings for the 32 S&W (standard cartridge for the top break S&Ws) of 17,000 (higher than the 32 Long's 15,000).

Hondo44 · #15 01-30-2020, 03:28 AM

I used Navel Jelly to remove corrosion similar to that on the 32 you found, and then carefully polished the bare metal as well as the old dull nickel plating.

The Naval jelly does not affect the nickel at all.

My Model 1896 -1st Model 32. Although while the nickel has a yellowish tone, the polished bare metal is a bluish tone as shown here under bright light. However under normal light conditions it's usually not even noticeable:

Babysitr · #16 01-30-2020, 08:52 AM

if the bore is usable, I'd buy that in a minute!

steelslaver · #17 01-30-2020, 09:05 AM

I would add that to my small inventory of I and J frame 32s for that price. Fun little guns for sure.

Thuer · #18 01-30-2020, 09:05 AM

Congrats with that nice little revolver. I do have a soft spot for those nice .32 Smith and Wesson model 1903 revolvers. Was lucky to find one years ago.

raljr1 · #19 01-30-2020, 09:20 AM

I am a 32 lover and have bought my fair share of well used 32s. Would have been tough to pass on for a buck fiddy.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

StrawHat · #20 01-30-2020, 06:42 PM

Don’t forget, after you buy that one, you will also need to buy a straight razor.

Kevin

BC38 · #21 01-30-2020, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StrawHat

Don’t forget, after you buy that one, you will also need to buy a straight razor.

Kevin

Maybe, but I won't be carrying it in my shoe...

george_lehr · #22 01-30-2020, 07:06 PM

Midway has Starline 32 S&W long cases on sale for $17.99/100.

BC38 · #23 01-31-2020, 01:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by george_lehr

Midway has Starline 32 S&W long cases on sale for $17.99/100.

Thanks for the info. That's 18 cents apiece, which ain't too bad. But here's how I look at it.

Best deal I'm finding on bullets so far is about 8-9 cents each for coated 100gr RNFP from Acme bullets. If anyone has a source for cheaper 32 cal bullets, please let me know about it.

Powder and primer is going to add up to another 5 or 6 cents each. Add that to the cost of the brass and bullet and you're at at total of 33-34 cents a round, right?

For that price I can buy a couple of hundred factory loaded rounds (PPU as posted above) - I don't even have to reload them. After I shoot them up I can decide if I want to start reloading them for 14 or 15 cents apiece.

That seems to make more sense to me.

k22fan · #24 01-31-2020, 02:37 AM

He's bad, bad, BC Brown, baddest man in the whole damn town ...

Recalculate assuming you cast your own from lead scrounged out of the range back stop. To get the 0.314" to 0.315" bullets that will ring out the best accuracy you'll probably have to cast eventually anyway.

IIRC correctly Lyman sold carbide die sets labeled both .32ACP and .32 S&W Long. I know they sold carbide sets labeled both .38 ACP/Super and .38 S&W. I haven't used either. My guess is that they have a compromise crimping shoulder that is not capable of turning in a serious revolver roll crimp. Both revolver cartridges do not recoil enough to need one. With Lyman's set you could put on a tuxedo and move up to a pistol that "hits like a brick through a plate glass window."

Did you buy it?

Old_Cop · #25 01-31-2020, 08:16 AM

Wile E. Coyote recommends ACME.

gwpercle · #26 01-31-2020, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old_Cop

Wile E. Coyote recommends ACME.

The only cheaper option is a Lee TL314-90-SWC double cavity bullet mould and that isn't a bad thing if you like to shoot !
With the uncertainties of elections and restrictions , buying a mould ...just in case ... might not be a bad idea.
Gary

BC38 · #27 01-31-2020, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by k22fan

He's bad, bad, BC Brown, baddest man in the whole damn town ...

Recalculate assuming you cast your own from lead scrounged out of the range back stop. To get the 0.314" to 0.315" bullets that will ring out the best accuracy you'll probably have to cast eventually anyway.

IIRC correctly Lyman sold carbide die sets labeled both .32ACP and .32 S&W Long. I know they sold carbide sets labeled both .38 ACP/Super and .38 S&W. I haven't used either. My guess is that they have a compromise crimping shoulder that is not capable of turning in a serious revolver roll crimp. Both revolver cartridges do not recoil enough to need one. With Lyman's set you could put on a tuxedo and move up to a pistol that "hits like a brick through a plate glass window."

Did you buy it?

I haven't been back to buy it yet. I'm not the window breaking type, Mr. Bond.

I like Lee equipment so that is likely the route I'll go, especially if the dies work for both cartridges. That gives me the option of downloading 32 ACP brass for feeding this little gem, plus once I have one 32 caliber you never know - I might end up with a Colt 1903 or something.

Casting isn't an option - at least not right now. I barely have time for reloading. God willing I'll retire in about 5 years and have more time. At that point, maybe I'll take up melting lead in addition to slinging it.

For now I'm not worried about shortages. In addition to a decent supply of loaded ammo, I have enough bullets, powder, and primers to reload over 40k rounds of pistol cartridges in 380acp, 9mm, 38spl, 357mag, 45acp, 45 Colt, 44spl and 44mag, and I'm still buying more supplies. I don't intend to EVER have to worry about not having enough to shoot as much as I want.

kscharlie · #28 01-31-2020, 02:17 PM

Good, you have not purchased it yet. I just wanted to let you know that I made the mistake of purchasing one a couple of years ago. Look what happened...

BC38 · #29 02-06-2020, 12:52 AM

I looked this little .32 HE over again today. The seller even let me pull the grips off of it to look at the cracked left grip. I don't think it is repairable. The rubber is so hard that I can't see any way to close up the crack without breaking it worse.

I found some grips for a .32 top break - can anybody tell me if they will fit on this little gun?
Or maybe someone can tell me where I can buy some repro grips for a reasonable price?
Or better yet, a left grip panel in comparable condition to the right one pictured?

Hondo44 · #30 02-06-2020, 03:57 AM

Yes, I can tell you; they won't.

However....the .38 S&W top break grips do fit, and fit all I frames prior to 1953.

Breakaway500 · #31 02-06-2020, 05:39 AM

I felt the same way when I spotted this 32 ugly duck. $75 later I took it home. Had it cerakoted and fit some Herrett Shooting Star grips on it. Nice little plinker!

glowe · #32 02-06-2020, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hondo44

Yes, I can tell you; they won't.

However....the .38 S&W top break grips do fit, and fit all I frames prior to 1953.

Here is the trouble with replacements original stocks. Early S&Ws were hand finished, meaning that the forgings were shaped, stocks were fitted to the butt-frame and then finished for that perfect fit and finish. No two guns ended up exactly the same. I have bought hard rubber stocks that were too small and others that were too big, but seldom did I find a set that fit the frame perfectly.

Since you are considering replacing the stocks, I would order a set of reproduction stocks. Home - Vintage Gun Grips - Reproduction Pistol Grips, Buttplates and Grip Caps. have many reproduction stocks for sale and those that I have seen seem to be slightly larger that the frames, so some limited fitting is needed. Keep the old set so you can still sell the gun with matching stocks.

H Richard · #33 02-06-2020, 10:53 AM

.32's can be addicting.

reccpd101 · #34 02-06-2020, 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by k22fan

He's bad, bad, BC Brown, baddest man in the whole damn town ...

Recalculate assuming you cast your own from lead scrounged out of the range back stop. To get the 0.314" to 0.315" bullets that will ring out the best accuracy you'll probably have to cast eventually anyway.

IIRC correctly Lyman sold carbide die sets labeled both .32ACP and .32 S&W Long. I know they sold carbide sets labeled both .38 ACP/Super and .38 S&W. I haven't used either. My guess is that they have a compromise crimping shoulder that is not capable of turning in a serious revolver roll crimp. Both revolver cartridges do not recoil enough to need one. With Lyman's set you could put on a tuxedo and move up to a pistol that "hits like a brick through a plate glass window."

Did you buy it?

You can find that die set on ebay often. I bought mine there. Yes, it does not do a strong roll crimp

reccpd101 · #35 02-06-2020, 11:21 AM

I bought one .32 revolver, than another. They bred and I now have 5. May have to look for one of the Beretta or Walther 32 autos.

Warren Sear · #36 02-06-2020, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by george_lehr

Midway has Starline 32 S&W long cases on sale for $17.99/100.

It is alarming to me to see advice being given to shoot .32 ACP in a .32 S&W Long chamber. Not only is the headspace wrong, the tiny rim on the .32 ACP will not eject properly.

This is bad advice. Use the proper ammo.

BC38 · #37 02-06-2020, 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Breakaway500

I felt the same way when I spotted this 32 ugly duck. $75 later I took it home. Had it cerakoted and fit some Herrett Shooting Star grips on it. Nice little plinker!

Interesting! Those Herrett grips - are they J-frame? If so I already have a set just like them. Did you have to do any modifications, or did they just fit right on it?

Hondo44 · #38 02-06-2020, 01:57 PM

I and J frames’ stocks are the same size for the same vintage. I or J frame size does not determine Grip frame or stock size.

There are two I frame and two J frame grip sizes. I and J frame stocks are the same size for the same vintage.

Pre Model 1953 I frames back to 1896 (and Single Shots), thru post war Transitional and Improved I frames, and Model 1950 Baby J frames have the same size grip frame for the round top service grip, with the small trigger guard.

The same goes for the 'Mini' diamond Magnas which began ~ 1951 on I and J frames after the demise of the 'rd top' Service grips of pre war style.

"Model of 1953 Hand Ejectors" saw the introduction of the NEW I frame and the Model of 1953 New J frame with 4 screws or less, have NEW 1/8" longer round grip frame length also the same size, with larger egg shaped trigger guards. From the 1953 models to the present (thru the demise of the NEW I frame Oct 1960 to Jan 1961) rd butt stocks have not changed size.

Therefore, any post 1953 I and J frame grips that cover the butt will also work on any pre 1953 I or J frame.

nbedford · #39 02-06-2020, 02:01 PM

32 Hand Ejector Model of 1903, 2nd change - made 1906-1909 -s#'s range from 51127-95500. $150 would be a decent price around here. I bought a 1st change for $150 but it was missing the mushroom at the end of the ejector.

Hondo44 · #40 02-06-2020, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nbedford

32 Hand Ejector Model of 1903, 2nd change - made 1906-1909 -s#'s range from 51127-95500. $150 would be a decent price around here. I bought a 1st change for $150 but it was missing the mushroom at the end of the ejector.

Reproduced now.

delcrossv · #41 02-06-2020, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by H Richard

.32's can be addicting.

You bet!

Warren Sear · #42 02-06-2020, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by k22fan

...Recalculate assuming you cast your own from lead scrounged out of the range back stop. To get the 0.314" to 0.315" bullets that will ring out the best accuracy you'll probably have to cast eventually anyway.

IIRC correctly Lyman sold carbide die sets labeled both .32ACP and .32 S&W Long. I know they sold carbide sets labeled both .38 ACP/Super and .38 S&W. I haven't used either. My guess is that they have a compromise crimping shoulder that is not capable of turning in a serious revolver roll crimp. Both revolver cartridges do not recoil enough to need one...

I load for the .32 S&W "Short" and Long. I have a Lee carbide 3-die set that loads .32 ACP, .32 S&W and .32 S&W Long. The crimping die puts as heavy a roll crimp I would ever want, and then some.

I cast bullets with a 77 grain Lyman mold and a Lee 93 grain RN mold, and I size everything to .313".

My Model 31-1 was made in 1969.

Sorry for the blurry ammo picture.

BC38 · #43 02-06-2020, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hondo44

I and J frames’ stocks are the same size for the same vintage. I or J frame size does not determine Grip frame or stock size.

There are two I frame and two J frame grip sizes. I and J frame stocks are the same size for the same vintage.

Pre Model 1953 I frames back to 1896 (and Single Shots), thru post war Transitional and Improved I frames, and Model 1950 Baby J frames have the same size grip frame for the round top service grip, with the small trigger guard.

The same goes for the 'Mini' diamond Magnas which began ~ 1951 on I and J frames after the demise of the 'rd top' Service grips of pre war style.

"Model of 1953 Hand Ejectors" saw the introduction of the NEW I frame and the Model of 1953 New J frame with 4 screws or less, have NEW 1/8" longer round grip frame length also the same size, with larger egg shaped trigger guards. From the 1953 models to the present (thru the demise of the NEW I frame Oct 1960 to Jan 1961) rd butt stocks have not changed size.

Therefore, any post 1953 I and J frame grips that cover the butt will also work on any pre 1953 I or J frame.

EXCELLENT! That means I already have at least one set that will fit.

I've looked at a few of the repros online - man, some of those folks are really PROUD of their work.

The perfect solution would be to find an old left grip in comparable condition to the right one. Which, BTW doesn't seem to have any serial number scratched or penciled inside. Probably got scrubbed off by a previous owner.

You wouldn't think that would be too hard to find a left grip since it is the right one that usually takes a beating in a right handed person's holster.

Hondo44 · #44 02-06-2020, 09:28 PM

If the right grip has no # on the back, it may have been replaced already years ago with a factory replacement ordered from the factory.

LoadedRound · #45 02-07-2020, 10:36 AM

Hi BC

I think these grips will work fine on that I frame:

Smith & Wesson .38 Break Open Grips, I Frame

Good Luck

BC38 · #46 02-07-2020, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoadedRound

Hi BC

I think these grips will work fine on that I frame:

Smith & Wesson .38 Break Open Grips, I Frame

Good Luck

THANKS! Those are a better deal than any of the others I've looked at. I'm still hoping for a cheap used original, but those will be a good alternative I'll keep in my hip pocket as a backup plan!

BC38 · #47 02-07-2020, 09:27 PM

Well, I went and done it today. Ended up persuading them to include the sales tax in the purchase price, so my final cost was $137.75 + tax = $150 OTD.

So now it is in BGC jail until the people at the Spokane County Sheriff's office get around to doing the paperwork to say I am a fine upstanding citizen (or at least not a felon or adjudicated nut-job). Should have it home in about two weeks, give or take...

StrawHat · #48 02-07-2020, 10:16 PM

Good for you! I have one with a 3 1/4” barrel and enjoy it every time it goes to the range.

Let us know when you start reloading for it.

Kevin

BC38 · #49 02-08-2020, 03:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warren Sear

I load for the .32 S&W "Short" and Long. I have a Lee carbide 3-die set that loads .32 ACP, .32 S&W and .32 S&W Long. The crimping die puts as heavy a roll crimp I would ever want, and then some.

Any chance you can post the number for that 3 die set?
I'm finding different dies for all 3 of those cartridges and on their website Lee doesn't list any one set as being good for all 3.

Hondo44 · #50 02-08-2020, 04:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BC38

Any chance you can post the number for that 3 die set?
I'm finding different dies for all 3 of those cartridges and on their website Lee doesn't list any one set as being good for all 3.

Yeah, I don't know how one crimp die could crimp all 3 different length cases unless modified. Which is easy enough to do.