Smith and Wesson 1917 Help

Inkedforlife76 · #1 05-09-2020, 09:08 PM

Hello. Today I was inherited a smith and Wesson model 1917 I think.

It is property marked under the barrel. Has U.S. marking on butt. Serial matches on butt, barrel and cylinder. It has flaming bomb proof on upper left of frame by top. Has various eagle number proofs.

Grips were changed to the SILE ones on it and have to try and find a set or a decent set of repops.

My question is based on serial number 80956 which matches throughout so far. And the various markings. I'm confused on it having the logo on right side plate which I haven't pulled yet and the made in USA marking on bottom right front of frame what it is I have here.

Is it a post war put together? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Inkedforlife76 · #2 05-09-2020, 09:11 PM

Few more pictures

Inkedforlife76 · #3 05-09-2020, 09:14 PM

Rest of the pics

StrawHat · #4 05-09-2020, 09:35 PM

I see that as being built in July of 1918. To the best of my knowledge the S&W logo should not be there as it “should be” a civilian model. Some more versed in 1917 will be along to help your confusion!

Kevin

Inkedforlife76 · #5 05-09-2020, 09:41 PM

That's what has me confused and the style of made in USA and address on side of frame. But then it has all other markings it should have if it were a ww1 army issue. Thinking it's one of the later left over build or ???

Oyeboteb · #6 05-09-2020, 09:58 PM

Can you post us a close up of the lower front, right-side Frame Texts?

Inkedforlife76 · #7 05-09-2020, 10:28 PM

Lower right side front.

crsides · #8 05-09-2020, 11:20 PM

Your gun most likely went back to S&W factory in the post war era and they added the stamps. Pull the grips, look on the left side of the grip frame and you should see a month.year date, ie 8.53 which would be Aug 1953.

mh51 · #9 05-09-2020, 11:21 PM

I think the S&W logo and the trademarks were applied when the gun was sent back for repairs/refinish in the 1970's. Roy Jinks was able to stop these additional markings which were not original to the gun. If my time frame is off, someone with a lot more knowledge will be along soon.
Nice inheritance! I think you'll love it.

Hondo44 · #10 05-10-2020, 12:01 AM

Charlie and Mike both nailed it!

In addition, when it went back to the factory, it got a barrel change in the Service Dept, indicated by the S and <> stamped on the bottom of the barrel.

Look for that factory rework date on the left side of the grip frame by the 'toe'.

Inkedforlife76 · #11 05-10-2020, 12:22 AM

I pulled the grips and the sides on back strap have small pitting Mark's that have obscured the number. I cannot make it out. By the bottom pin the fits into grip to stabilize it from shifting there is a small stamped number but I cannot make it out. If this was sent back to smith and wesson and received repair/rebuild and including a rebarrel. Did it go back into service or inventory seeing barrel is property marked. From the blue loss on grip back strap and pitting from water or sweat from hand that got under grip panels it would appear it saw some use after being redone.

Is there a way to narrow down the date depending on the updated frame text when they switched to that style with more then just made in usa.

murphydog · #12 05-10-2020, 12:40 AM

The change from one to four line stampings on the right forward frame was in the later 1940s. The marking of refinished guns with the large logo and four line stamping was in the mid-1970s.

If you look on the side of the left lower grip frame the small numbers may be one or two digits, then a dot followed by two other digits, the first probably a 7. Refinished guns may also have R-S (refinish-standard blue) in a rectangle stamped there.

The property mark on the barrel is a bit of a mystery, as I suspect S & W no longer had surplus 1917 Army barrels by the 1970s. Perhaps it had a barrel swap at a much earlier date followed by the later refinish, but that is pure speculation.

Muley Gil · #13 05-10-2020, 01:20 AM

Let's sum it up, based on what has been deduced:

This is a WW I issued 1917. After the war, it passed into civilian hands. It went back to S&W, where it received a new barrel and a stamp on the lower right side of the frame. It was repaired/refinished.

You have received a wonderful gift.

Inkedforlife76 · #14 05-10-2020, 11:18 AM

Thank you so much everyone for you insight and help. Truly a great bunch here. To me its priceless and a keepsake I'll enjoy and preserve to pass down one day. What grips would I be looking for based on what we know.

StrawHat · #15 05-10-2020, 11:44 AM

Service stocks, like you have, are appropriate. Others can tell you what medallions would be appropriate.

But, the question is, which era are you looking for? 1917 Army or when it went back to the factory?

Kevin

Inkedforlife76 · #16 05-10-2020, 12:35 PM

I like the look of the smooth originals, but what it would have had when it went back to the factory I'd be interested in as well. I know originals are hard to find from looking and even a decent reproduction seems hard to find.

jmace57 · #17 05-10-2020, 01:36 PM

Look for a PM. I've found some reasonably priced, good looking repros.

handejector · #18 05-10-2020, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hondo44

In addition, when it went back to the factory, it got a barrel change in the Service Dept, indicated by the S and <> stamped on the bottom of the barrel.

It is not a certainty that it was rebarreled. Barrels are pulled from the frame when a gun is refinished and blued separate from the frame. It would have been marked so that it would be returned to the Service Dept. That could be the original barrel. The font of the numbers is correct for the original barrel, but not for the 70s when this gun was refinished.
I'm curious about the bore condition?????

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inkedforlife76

Is there a way to narrow down the date depending on the updated frame text when they switched to that style with more then just made in usa.

Show us a pic of the left gripstrap without the grips. There could be a date on the toe. The left side is where the thumb latch is.

It was the policy in the 1970s to add those markings. Roy Jinks put a stop to that practice.

Correct grips for the gun are the smooth ones, but it doesn't really matter at this point. Put something comfortable on it.

Inkedforlife76 · #19 05-10-2020, 06:18 PM

Bore is not new condition like it would be I'd think having barrel replaced in 70s. Pic is not the greatest but best I can get. Definately seem some shooting.

And the grip on both sides on back end have the pitting as does the back side. Indicating to me salt off ones hand from sweating and moisture. Only number I see on left side is possibly by the little cross peg. Other then that pitting wore away any number.

Pitting does not bother me. It's been used, carried and shot. That much wear by more then a weekend warrior. Consistent with other military revolvers I have that were in use and developed that type of wear under grips and on back strap.

Just puzzling on the logo and frame address marking on right side. And if barrel might have not been changed and if so why still property marked that late in 70s if that's when any repairs/rebuild were done.

murphydog · #20 05-10-2020, 06:28 PM

Is there a number stamped on the forward part of the lower left grip frame (not seen in photo 4 above)?

Inkedforlife76 · #21 05-10-2020, 06:30 PM

No. Nothing stamped on that end either. The other end isnt pitted and has blue. Nothing stamped there.

Inkedforlife76 · #22 05-10-2020, 06:32 PM

2nd photo from left is that same side. Shows nothing that I can see.

handejector · #23 05-10-2020, 06:35 PM

Interesting that they did not date it. Is there a star on the butt or back of the cylinder?

handejector · #24 05-10-2020, 06:38 PM

I see now there is no star on the butt. Probably not on the back of the cyl either?

And-
I think that barrel is original.

Inkedforlife76 · #25 05-10-2020, 06:42 PM

Only markings on back of cylinder are serial number and an eagle head with number proof and another diamond with S marking like whats under the barrel by serial number.

Hondo44 · #26 05-10-2020, 06:58 PM

I agree, barrel pitting makes the barrel appear original to me.

Refinish and/or date stamp usage, are generally accepted to have declined in the 1970s, and stars non-existent, although that's when many 5 or 6 digit dates, if stamped, have been observed, sporadic use after that, and was eventually eliminated altogether not too long after. Reportedly no date stamps have been observed since ~1983.

Inkedforlife76 · #27 05-17-2020, 11:24 PM

Patience pays off. Thanks to member here he showed me gun grips at nc ordnance and they have the resin royal wood 1917 grips and walnut remakes. Kept looking on Ebay hoping. Nothing popping up anywhere and just kept browsing Ebay and typed in different words to try and vary search results and stumbled onto these 1917 originals minus screw which I have.
69 bucks shipped which I'm thinking is a nice score.