22/32 Heavy Frame Target, Hand Ejector, possibly Bekeart?

cmansguns · #1 05-27-2020, 01:35 PM

Some backstory, recently a old collector passed away, and some "rumored" 100 fine guns came on the market. His research and notes haven't been found and/or released just yet. The above is pass-thru info to me, but I'm still on the trail for provenance.
Supposedly he collected, but was not a shooter or hunter.

What I did get from the collection is a very nice (very possibly unfired) 22/32 Heavy Frame Target, or Hand Ejector, possibly a Bekeart. If it does turn out to be a Bekeart it would be in the 4th category, meaning only if the Letter shows shipment to Bekeart in San Francisco.

The serial number is 224963 and matches in all know spots as well as penciled (faint but still legible) on the fragile maroon clamshell style box. Docs are old and show age. There is a brass cleaning brush w/rod inside of a very fragile "rice paper" wrapper that is also showing age. The cleaning rod shows no evidence of ever having come out of the paper, much less ever been down a bore.

This is a 6" round, pinned barrel, thin blade, bead topped on raised ramp front site, fully adjustable (W&E) rear sight, 6 shot fluted cylinder, flat faced hammer, floating firing pin, 5 screw I Frame, 2 screw concave checkered extension target grips w/ gold plated, brass medallions.

Some points that I would appreciate expert commentary (concurrence or alternative opinions) on:

1. S&W logo on right side of frame (meaning 1914 or later)
2. The 2 screw grips were gone by 1919, and this style is seen below s/n 258000, so I believe this to be an original gun dating somewhere between 1914 to 1919.
3. The box end label states Hand Ejector, yet I see modern collectors and SCSW 4th, as well as Roy's book call this model Heavy Frame Target. Do both terms apply to my gun (i.e. collector preference as to which is used to describe)?
4. Are these grips known as Roper Bekeart style, Roper or not Roper at all?
5. Does the box style, contents, or end label confirm or deny the date range?

This gun is just unbelievable to hold and point. At 23 ounces you don't even feel your holding a handgun, more like a kids toy cap gun. The sights line immediately up on target and stay there even with my old age arm fully extended off-hand position!

I bought it seemingly unfired, and it will probably remain so at least till I can track down some more provenance, and get it Lettered from SWHF.

I'm posting the 5 pics (I've GOT to get a decent camera) and then I'll post some more of the box and stuff next.

Please let me know what you think of this latest treasure addition.

cmansguns · #2 05-27-2020, 01:38 PM

As promised some more pics of the 22/32 HE, HFT

delcrossv · #3 05-27-2020, 01:40 PM

My, my! That's a pretty one! Congrats, Charlie.

Edit: That's the first wipe with oily rag notice I've seen. Thanks for posting!

Heavy frame Target is the collector term for these,as compared to the M frame target which was available prior. 22/32 HE works as well.

For comparison:

glowe · #4 05-27-2020, 02:05 PM

They do not get any better than yours!!!!! The target stocks are perfect as well as the revolver.

Most likely shipped in 1915, =/- a year. There is a lot of leeway for the use of Bekeart name, but your revolver is too late to be the original 1000 sold to that distributor. Those had a number stamped on the bottom of the stocks. It may have been shipped to Bekeart in subsequent orders, but that company bought probably thousands of all models of S&W including the 22/32 HFTs.

I call the stocks simply 2 screw Target stocks, having nothing to do with Roper. The box is exactly period correct. The gun is a hand ejector I frame revolver and is called a 22/32 Hand Ejector in the Neal & Jinks book. The 1923 Catalog listed them as 22/32 Heavy Frame Target revolvers.

opoefc · #5 05-27-2020, 02:22 PM

Very nice . These 22s are really .32HEs in 22 cal and made as target models in the standard .32HE production line. The factory called them 32/22 targets in the manufacturing log books kept by the Floor Foremen. Your gun , #224963, was made April 20, 1915 as one of a run of 25 blue Target models. If you want to know where it was shipped, you will need to get a factory historical letter from the SWHF. Ed

Babysitr · #6 05-27-2020, 02:25 PM

I for one, am speechless.....WOW..... hope the letter confirms

DCWilson · #7 05-27-2020, 02:42 PM

Spectacular revolver, and beyond belief that original box and accessories are part of the complete package. Congratulations.

From the serial number I would guess at a narrower date range of 1915-1916. As a data point, 245519 was shipped March 3, 1917.

I don't at the moment recall when the HFT designation became the standard model name, but I do recall seeing it on an inner surface of an early '20s bilingual flip-top box.

Ah, glowe and Ed gave good information while I was slowly composing a comment.

Also, the Spanish for "Heavy Frame Target" is "Tarjeta Amazon Solida." I hope I got the word order right because I didn't check my box or its photos. "Amazon" appears to be a typesetting error, as the Spanish word for "frame" is armazón.

series guy · #8 05-27-2020, 03:58 PM

Wow that's as fine as they get. Very nice. I was thinking the stocks were referred to as two screw extension stocks.

H Richard · #9 05-27-2020, 04:03 PM

I have never seen a more perfect 1915 vintage S&W. It is one that I would call NIB. I kind of doubt if we could expect a Range Report on that one. Beautiful piece.

mod34 · #10 05-27-2020, 04:06 PM

I have conclusively identified it...……..as being MINE!!!

PM me the price!

DCWilson · #11 05-27-2020, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by series guy

Wow that's as fine as they get. Very nice. I was thinking the stocks were referred to as two screw extension stocks.

I believe they were ordinarily described just as "extension stocks" until the Regulation Police was introduced in 1917. After that, the RP stocks were referred to on invoices as "small square butt extension stocks" and the two screw variety as "large square butt extension stocks." I have seen those phrases used in several letters of authenticity.

glowe · #12 05-27-2020, 05:38 PM

Catalogs simply called them Target stocks. Same as those on the Single Shot Target pistols.

opoefc · #13 05-27-2020, 06:58 PM

The production logs just say "target stocks" Ed.

mikepriwer · #14 05-27-2020, 08:29 PM

The target stocks on the 22/32 are in wonderful condition, and they got me to thinking about a pair I have, that are "different". I put together a picture with the 22/32 stocks on the inside, and my pair on the outside.

My pair is not for an "I" frame, but rather for a "K" frame. The collector/gunsmith who sold them to me, Charlie Duffy, thought they were for a 1899, and that is what he had them on.

I was going to offer some comments on the differences, but there are some issues that the pictures do not show. I have a pair of I-frame convex non-medallion target stock that I used to take a couple more pictures. Intentionally, the four grip panels are lined up on their bottom edge.

This next picture is of the outsides of the panels.

And the last picture is of the insides in the panels.

In one of my Journal articles, the K-frame pair of grips is discussed. My 1905 catalog has a statement, to the effect that target stocks (for K-frames) are available. Charlie Duffy thought that these stocks were the item mentioned in the catalog.

Both sets of stocks are clearly for round-butt frames, and they are close to being the same height. The key difference is that the I-frame stocks have a lot more wood in the bottom, such that to my hand feel, they are about the same length.

The K-frame stocks have more wood at the top of the grip, making the feel quite different. The contour of the I-frame grips are more like a square-butt frame, while the contour of the K-frame grips are more like a round-butt frame.

Interestingly, the screws are smaller (in diameter) in the I-frame grips, and larger in the K-frame grips.

Another similarity is the pattern of the layout of the checkering. The bottoms of the "double-u" pattern is nearly the same for both pairs: the "u" portion is positioned almost parallel to the bottom of the grip. On the top portion of the grips, the "U" portion is much lower on the inside, than on the outside, and this is true for both frames.

Regards, Mike Priwer

Hondo44 · #15 05-27-2020, 10:34 PM

Charlie,

Congrats on the quintessential HFT. Nicest I've ever seen.

Many names were used depending on if they were on marketing materials or in catalog listings. Then there's colloquial collector nicknames/shorthand that have developed over the years. Bekeart model is most common which of course is a misnomer for the majority of those "out there". On this forum knowledgeable members usually call those made after the actual Bekeart period, .22/32 HFT (relative to the only other 22 HE at the time; the diminutive M frame HE - Ladysmith. Of course after the heavier K22 was introduced in 1931, they officially just became .22/32 Targets which carried on after WWII until discontinued. This jives with Roy's usage in both of his books.

Those in the early special production runs are known as the BEKEART Model 1911.

Regular production began at #160000 in 1914 and it was named ".22/32 Hand Ejector - Heavy Frame Target" of 1915. But that was a lot to fit on the label, hence the box label wording. But more often referred to as the Bekeart or .22/32 HFT in the general public these days w/o much deference to accuracy.

CAUTION: THIS MODEL IS OFTEN PAIRED WITH INCORRECT VINTAGE BOXES WITH DIFFERENT LABEL WORDING THAT CAN LEAD US ASTRAY. WE ALSO RECOGNIZE THAT OLD INVENTORY BOXES WERE USED AFTER NAME CHANGES AND ALSO WON'T MATCH THE NAME OF THE MODEL GUN IN THE BOX. EVEN THOUGH IT WAS THE ORIGINAL BOX SHIPPED WITH THE GUN.

'Phil B. Bekeart Co.' April 1912 ad posted in a thread that shows one reason for the confusion. The Target Revolver is in smaller font.

Photo Credit bmg60

cmansguns · #16 05-28-2020, 07:29 AM

As my title says....thank you to all who have posted about this 22/32 HFT. Just simply reviewing the above posts one can quickly see the absolute wealth of information that comes from the minds of all of you true experts. 30 years ago I would not have given this revolver even a first look (a. no money, b. no interest in something old and in a caliber less than .38). 20 years ago I would have still passed (a. still no money, b. too many "desirable" S&W to shoot). 10 years ago...if spotted then it would already be in the collection. Memorial Day 2020: thanks to covid 19 restrictions, 1 person at a time gets to approach the counter, can take your sweet time handling very carefully, owner stays right with you, we talk, check SCSW 3rd for some details, I THINK I'm seeing what I'm going to offer...the negotiations begin...My C&R helps because whatever the price turns out to be it is cash out the door..no 4473, no BG check.

So appropriate for the occasion...Owner had a covid mask, and I had my wife made mask (which helped contain my drooling) and we came to agreement.

As to all the above comments and posts:

YES...this gun will be Lettered very soon, and I'll post the Letter results when received. Hopefully their may be some additional docs from SWHF.

NO...….there will NOT be a range report. This is (to me) one of those pieces of history that I am happy to be a "lifetime caretaker" for. I normally don't care for safe queens, and I do have some pieces that came to me unfired, but a big difference between a 1980 Model 27-2, and this 1915 22/32 HFT

The stocks are now (due to all the above posts) a very interesting aspect of this gun personally to me, because I just love to keep learning and this Forum just "keeps on giving".

Thanks to all for allowing me to show off this latest acquisition.

PS: My oldest daughter is coming over today to comment on the box and cleaning rod wrapper. She is a professional fine arts restorer, and is aware of the fragility of old documents so I've asked her for storage advice for the box and docs. Some how the top of the spare room closet shelf along with other blue Banjor Punta boxes and plastic cases just doesn't seem appropriate for this 105 year old box and docs.

series guy · #17 05-28-2020, 08:04 AM

It's really funny that everything in your above post describes my Third Model Perfected purchase. It's such a shock to find a gun this old in this condition that it kind of overloads your senses and gives you that 14 year old asking for your first date feeling. I have shot the Third Model a bit since there's no issue with a turn line.

delcrossv · #18 05-28-2020, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmansguns

PS: My oldest daughter is coming over today to comment on the box and cleaning rod wrapper. She is a professional fine arts restorer, and is aware of the fragility of old documents so I've asked her for storage advice for the box and docs. Some how the top of the spare room closet shelf along with other blue Banjor Punta boxes and plastic cases just doesn't seem appropriate for this 105 year old box and docs.

Please post what she recommends. I'd be interested in hearing a professional's take on preserving old boxes.

glowe · #19 05-28-2020, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hondo44

. . . CAUTION: THIS MODEL IS OFTEN PAIRED WITH INCORRECT VINTAGE BOXES WITH DIFFERENT LABEL WORDING THAT CAN LEAD US ASTRAY. WE ALSO RECOGNIZE THAT OLD INVENTORY BOXES WERE USED AFTER NAME CHANGES AND ALSO WON'T MATCH THE NAME OF THE MODEL GUN IN THE BOX. ALTHOUGH IT WAS THE ORIGINAL BOX SHIPPED WITH THE GUN . . .

Actually, I believe that all boxes that appear to be appropriate to the gun have used 22/32 Hand Ejector on the exterior label. The teens boxes had the same title on the interior label, but the 1920s patent boxes had Heavy Frame-Target on the interior label. Never saw an original Bekeart box, so cannot comment on the very early examples, but from the middle teens on, all that have shown up as original had the HE end label and none with HFT label. If anyone has an HFT end label, please post.

Photos show the exterior label for a teens and twenties box. Also, ran across another 22/32 factory flyer for those who are interested. No date on the flyer.

JSR III · #20 06-21-2020, 10:48 PM

That is truly a beautiful example of the .22/32 HFT or Bekeart model. The guns in my .22/32 database that bracket yours where I have recorded shipping dates are 224924 that shipped on 9-15-1916 and 225003 that shipped on 12-27-1915. Again showing the dysfunction between serial numbers and shipping dates.

The front sight is the Paine front sight. The first 2,000 guns or what I believe to be the first two production runs of 1,000 or so guns, all had a small S&W logo on the left side. When the third run was made in 1914 to include the 490 consecutively numbered guns shipped to M.W. Robinson in NYC, the S&W logo is now a medium sized logo and moved to the right side.

In 1919 we see guns appear with no logo at all and then around 1921 the logo reappears as a small S&W logo on the right side of the frame. This holds true until around 1939 when we start seeing a large logo on the right side.

The stocks were initially the 2 screw extension style target stocks with gold medallions. Around mid 1919 we begin to see the regulation police style stock with gold medallions take over with an occasional 2 screw extension style with gold medallions. Around 1921 we see mostly regulation police style without medallions.

On August 29, 1923 an order comes down from H. Wesson to switch from the Paine front sight to the Patridge front sight and to go back to the 2 screw extension style target stocks.

Early in 1924 we see mostly the 2 screw extension stocks without medallions and this holds true until around 1930 when the 2 screw extension stocks begin showing up with silver medallions.

With the introduction of the K-22 in the 1930's the smaller I frame .22/32 was no longer the big boy on the block and sales fell off. Simultaneously S&W began producing the 'kit' gun which was merely the .22/32 HFT with a 4" barrel.

The flyer that Hondo posted claims that Bekeart has arranged with S&W to exclusively produce another 1,000 .22/32's which seems unlikely since Bekeart only sold 294 of the first run of 1,050 and most were sold by other S&W dealers of the day.

It is also stated that the first 3,000 or so guns bear an assembly order number impressed into the left stock bottom. So far my research has only recorded a high number of 2582 which is on gun 208260 shipped on 3-19-1914 in one of the 5 M.W. Robinson shipments. No guns shipped after mid 1914 have shown up with a stock imprinted assembly number.

Hope that helps.

DCWilson · #21 06-22-2020, 11:32 AM

Gary, the undated flyer in your post no. 19 above must have been issued 1927-28 because of the "16 years" mentioned in the text.

DCWilson · #22 06-22-2020, 12:17 PM

James, your detail-rich post no. 20 informed me on a couple of points that I had not previously known or understood, and it deserves more than the simple "like" that I dropped on it. I knew that 1923 was a watershed year for the Patridge sight at Smith & Wesson, but I hadn't noted the date of the change order if I had ever run across it before. Also, my fuzzy grasp of the period when the HFT could be had with RP stocks was firmed up by your observations; thanks for that as well.

As a recovering prewar Kit Gun addict, I would offer the thought that "simultaneous" is probably too strong a characterization for the Kit Gun's introduction. The K-22 OD had been out for five years before the Kit Gun became commercially available in 1936. I have long thought that the reduced market demand for the HFT in the early '30s played a role in the company's eventual decision to offer the Kit Gun.

JSR III · #23 06-22-2020, 04:39 PM

Quote:

As a recovering prewar Kit Gun addict, I would offer the thought that "simultaneous" is probably too strong a characterization for the Kit Gun's introduction.

David, I guess when one has survived 7 decades on this ball of mud a few years one way or the other seems insignificant however, you are correct that my database does not start showing the 4" barrel kit guns until around 1936 and IIRC the K-22 was introduced in 1930-1931.

Model19man · #24 06-22-2020, 06:41 PM

I don't know if anyone else went to the gun show this past weekend in Tulsa but I did. A fellow on one of the back rows had a half dozen 22/32 "Bekeart model" revolvers for sale. He said he had a dozen more - in nicer shape - at home.

He had several for sale in far lesser condition than the one that started this post. I would say the best one was maybe 75% finish remaining while the worst one was pretty beat up in general. Still all were shooters and I briefly considered buying the best one he had just so I could take it to the range.

Congratulations on finding a lovely example.

JSR III · #25 06-22-2020, 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Model19man

I don't know if anyone else went to the gun show this past weekend in Tulsa but I did. A fellow on one of the back rows had a half dozen 22/32 "Bekeart model" revolvers for sale. He said he had a dozen more - in nicer shape - at home.

He had several for sale in far lesser condition than the one that started this post. I would say the best one was maybe 75% finish remaining while the worst one was pretty beat up in general. Still all were shooters and I briefly considered buying the best one he had just so I could take it to the range.

Congratulations on finding a lovely example.

If you happened to record the gentleman's name or shop if he has one, I would love to reach out and get the details for my database.