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S&W Hand Ejectors: 1896 to 1961 All 5-Screw & Vintage 4-Screw SWING-OUT Cylinder REVOLVERS, and the 35 Autos and 32 Autos


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Old 06-25-2020, 09:07 PM
RabbyTat RabbyTat is offline
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Default Old Revolver - predates model numbers.

I am looking at an S&W .38 specialwith 5 inch barrel, 5 screw frame (4 on the sideplate and one in front of the trigger guard.) with fixed sights, double action, and diamond decorated stock with S&W script stamp marked side plate which has a serial number in the 12XXXX range without any model information anywhere. There is a build number behind the cylinder crane, but no model number is there as in more recent models. I know it to be quite old and with law enforcement background - runs in the family. Trying to learn the date of shipping from S&W.
Is it properly considered a Hand Ejector model, Regulation Police, 1905, or Military and Police?

Thanks in advance!
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Old 06-25-2020, 09:19 PM
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It is a Military and Police model from between about 1906 and 1909, long before model numbers were applied in about 1958. One of the experts will be along (probably as I’m typing this) to offer more info. Welcome to the forum.
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Old 06-25-2020, 09:22 PM
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Welcome to the forum.

It's a K frame .38 Military and Police Model of 1905 - 2nd Change - Hand Ejector from about 1908-09.

Very few S&W hand ejectors are marked with a model name, but there are a few, being the I frame .38 S&W Regulation Police, .357 Magnum, .357 Highway Patrolman, and .44 Magnum.
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Old 06-25-2020, 09:25 PM
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12xxxx would fall in the 1908-1909 date range, and it could be either a Model of 1905 (square butt) or a Model of 1902 (round butt). S&W dropped the Model of 1902/1905 nomenclature prior to WWI, and thereafter referred to all of them as the Military and Police (M&P) Model, either round or square butt. Some continue to refer to all K-frames made up to WWII as the Model of 1905, but S&W did not.

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Old 06-25-2020, 09:33 PM
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Welcome to the forum, Mr. Tat. You haven't provided quite enough information to positively identify the model; pictures would help a lot.

Assuming that there's no letter (or letters) preceding the SN, then it's most likely a Model 1905 M&P (Military & Police); a 121xxx SN would make it a "2nd Change", mfg'd between 1906 and 1909.

Some other things that would be good to know are: round or square butt? target or fixed sight? blued or nickel finish? are the stocks wood or plastic, with or without mediations? Photos would help a lot. -S2
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Old 06-25-2020, 09:42 PM
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Read and follow ---

Sticky: To IDENTIFY your Gun >
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Old 06-25-2020, 10:03 PM
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RabbyTat,

Even if yours is a round butt, with that serial # you will not find it listed as a Model of 1902 anywhere. That's because it's based on evolution logic, early S&W literature, and therefore the preferred model designation of some modern collectors that find the current Model 1905 designation is not correct.

If it has a V on the gun butt of the grip frame preceding the serial #, it's a much later model from about 1942 and nicknamed the M&P 'Victory' Model.
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Old 06-25-2020, 10:08 PM
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The oldest revolver I own has serial 126599 so it is a .38 Military and Police second change. Does your revolver look just like this one?- only yours would have an inch shorter barrel??
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Old 06-26-2020, 01:28 AM
RabbyTat RabbyTat is offline
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Thanks Everyone! What a wealth of information and assistance!

Wood stocks.
Square butt - as far as I understand the early models. (My experience is with 686 and 66 models from when those were carried by use on the street.)
Could not get any pictures into the post. Tried. Is there a limit for new people or are we limited to only external links for photos from outside sites? I used Photobucket in the past, but that is not functional anymore.
Likely was blue steel originally, but basically more plum brown now. This gun was heavily used and has a lot of history. Was in a few battles over its existence that I know of.
No V or other letters that I can find anywhere.
Sights were in the original post, but fixed.

The photo from daddio202 is very similar to the gun in question, but this one is blue steel, has a longer barrel and older - at least IF serial number order is an indication...

Thanks again for the welcome and information!
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Old 06-26-2020, 01:30 AM
RabbyTat RabbyTat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daddio202 View Post
The oldest revolver I own has serial 126599 so it is a .38 Military and Police second change. Does your revolver look just like this one?- only yours would have an inch shorter barrel??
That is a beautiful gun! This one is in rough looking condition, but functions very well.

RT
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Old 06-26-2020, 09:17 AM
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Welcome to the forums from the Wiregrass, RT! Pictures must be of proper size to upload. If yours are larger than 1920x1080 pixels, the forum software will often balk. So, resize them or shoot at a lower resolution. You should then be able to upload them as attachments. If you continue to have problems, there are YouTube videos with links here that may help you.
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Old 06-26-2020, 10:09 AM
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Thanks for the compliments RabbyTat., and welcome to the forum! This is site is the only social media I use. My pictured revolver went back to the S&W factory in 1911 for a refinish and was probably not used much afterwards. I have a couple target models that are blued from before WW1 and the finish is much more worn on them, you have to figure that for many years there was no such thing as air conditioning, so between the elements and use a toll was taken on the finish. If you want to post pictures here try taking the pictures on your cell phone then post them directly here from your cell phone. That may be a whole lot easier to do.
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Old 06-26-2020, 05:12 PM
RabbyTat RabbyTat is offline
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Default Finally figuring out the photo posting process.

IMG_20200625_165914.jpg
Another attempt to post a photo of the gun that we have been discussing.
And now it is upside down - even though I corrected that with the original!
IMG_20200625_165905.jpg
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Old 06-26-2020, 06:06 PM
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Definitely an original Model of 1905. Grips are of the period-correct style, and in better condition than most that age. They were changed to a different style around 1911. Don't lose them. If you want to post pictures from a photo hosting site, try IMGUR. It's free, better than Photobucket was.

Last edited by DWalt; 06-26-2020 at 06:10 PM.
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Old 06-26-2020, 08:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RabbyTat View Post
Attachment 457553
Another attempt to post a photo of the gun that we have been discussing.
And now it is upside down - even though I corrected that with the original!
Attachment 457552
Did you try not correcting the original and see if it corrects itself to right side up when you post it?
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Old 06-26-2020, 08:47 PM
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That’s a great old shooter which seems to have a lot of history. The grips are period correct, but seem in better condition than the wear on the gun would indicate. You can check to see if they’re original by carefully removing them and looking at the back of the right panel. It should have the serial number either stamped in or pencilled. Sometimes the handwritten numbers require a magnifying glass and just the right angle of light to see. Regardless, those grips in that condition are valuable. Thanks for sharing.
Good shootin’,
Doug
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Old 06-26-2020, 09:05 PM
RabbyTat RabbyTat is offline
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Thanks! That was helpful.
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Old 06-26-2020, 10:04 PM
RabbyTat RabbyTat is offline
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CapnB

I see where there was something that was possibly stamped but rust from the frame is attached to the wood and I seem to be altering it by trying to remove the rust between the stock half and the frame - if it is really there. I also see vestiges of the number written faintly in pencil on the right grip. The pencil marking's legible digits are in the correct locations.
It would not surprise me for these to be replacements as this gun was very likely in an armory.
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