I am working on a Smith & Wesson Model of 1905, 4th Change in 32 WCF. The serial is 82553, all matching except wrong grips, in factory nickel. The gun is pretty rough shape finish wise but the rifling is sharp with a little pitting in the grooves.

The Trigger Pin is loose in the frame. Is there a way to tighten it up? Or is it not too much of an issue as it is captive in the Frame and Side Plate?

What about lubrication? Totally dry? Or where to oil inside the lockwork?

With that serial number of 82553, it is just after the start of cylinder heat treating. Is there any limitations as far as ammunition?, I.E. rifle ammo OK or use only what is marked safe for revolvers? I am assuming this is a mid 1930's gun?

I have 88843 which I show as 1920/21. You should be ok with any 32-20 ammo manufactured today although I might stay away from some of the Buffalo Bore heavier loads. Kind of expensive to use factory ammo though so I use cast lead reloads in my 32-20s. Much fun to shoot. How about some pictures? Here's 88843:

Jeff
SWCA #1457

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1905 4th change nickel 5 inch 32-20.jpg (46.9 KB, 45 views)

I am not a gunsmith, but I do believe a loose trigger pin (stud) is an issue. I believe they are press fit. I don't believe the side plate bears against it to secure it. Maybe it could be removed, slightly peened, and re-pressed into place, or simply replaced? At the very least, I would not trust it for any serious use with a loose stud.

Larry

Here are a couple of pics. It is by no means a prize. I think that the side plate may be a replacement. There is no logo on it or the frame; also it appears to have a groove for a transfer bar? There is no transfer bar in this gun.

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	DSC03135.jpg (98.9 KB, 91 views)
	DSC03137.jpg (82.6 KB, 77 views)

Do you see the slots on either side of the trigger pin? Those mean that you have a threaded stud that takes a sloted screwdriver to tighten. Using an old screwdriver, fashion a slot in the middle of the blade that will engage the slots and just tighten. The trigger pin is rarely ever loose to the point that it affects operation, since it is held tightly in the sideplate as well as the frame.

Your revolver is likely a 1920 gun. The factory stopped stamping logos from 1916 to mid-1920, in the WWI era.

I have owned and operated K frames for over 30 years and have always used a light spray oil on the inside Look for a synthetic oil in an aerosol can and spray the interior. Work the action and use compressed air from an aerosol to blow out the excess. Barricade is what I now use and has a low VOC and will hang around a long time. You can also spray oil up into the action if it is needed by simply removing the stocks.

Lastly, there are only a couple of companies out there that manufacture high velocity rifle ammo, so stick with the major companies and you will find their ammo to be very satisfactory. Even the Remington Express Rifle branded ammo is low pressure. Chronographed it in a 6" gun and it ran around 750-800 fps. It will run over 1000 fps in a rifle barrel.

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Gary
SWCA 2515

Here is a Hand Ejector circa 1908 Ser # 1343XX without a logo on the sideplate. It's also a 32/20 and while holster worn, is pretty much perfect otherwise.

I reload and shoot the 115 grain Lyman 32/20 bullet in it at pedestrian velocities. It's quite accurate with this bullet and they shoot to its point of aim.

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S&W 32-20 02-800.jpg (89.6 KB, 32 views)

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Keep your powder dry.

It is much later than 1908 and more like 1926. The MADE IN USA stamping appeared in 1922 and the mushroom shaped ejector rod knob was replaced in 1927. Did you check the other side of the gun for the logo?

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Gary
SWCA 2515

You generally don't need to worry about the high velocity .32-20 rifle loadings, as they haven't been available for the last 50+ years from the major manufacturers, although some of the boutique manufacturers, such as Bufflalo Bore, may offer them. It is remotely possible you might find an old box, but the ammo collectors have probably snapped up most of them. HV loads are easily recognized by the presence of a jacketed hollow point bullet, and generally cases have a headstamp indicating HV. The .32-20 loads now offered by Remington as "Rifle" really aren't HV and are safe in any revolver.

"Here is a Hand Ejector circa 1908 Ser # 1343XX"

That SN is very close to the end of .32-20 M&P production in the late 1920s, yours likely shipped in 1926. Note that .32-20 M&Ps were always in a separate serial numbering sequence than .38 Special M&Ps. The (small) S&W logo would be stamped on the left side of the frame, not the sideplate, and it should also have the MADE IN U.S.A. frame stamp, as yours does. Your gun's grips are also of the 1920s style.

A BIG Thank you to all!!! Thanks!

There should be a number stamped on the inside of the sideplate.

Unscrew the trigger pin, clean the threads-both the frame and the pin, apply a little Loc-tite and re-install. I have taken a small punch and tapped against one of the slots until tight. Be careful you don't raise a burr. If you do, lightly stone until the burr is gone.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

Didn't realize S&W had used screw in pins. That's why I like this forum, you learn something new about every day.

Larry

I will ask here but if necessary / proper will move to gunsmithing. OK, what is the secret to getting the side plate on? The hand spring needs compressed somehow???

Start with the hand pushed into the recoil shield slot, then lightly press on the sideplate while slowly working the hammer and trigger until the sideplate pops into place. That has always worked for me.

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Gary
SWCA 2515

Once again the members of the forum have come through. Thank you all again. This is the first old style lockwork S&W that I have ever had the sideplate off and it definitely needed it! There was so much crud in there. Just an FYI the trigger pin tightened up nicely and the hammer pin although not wiggly was a little loose as well and tightened up easily.

Consider going to the dollar store and buy a couple cheap screwdrivers. Grab your grinder, files, Dremmel, etc. and go to work. The cheaper the better with buying screwdrivers since mine is adjustable. The steel is soft enough that I can tap it with a hammer and narrow or widen the slot as necessary for different studs on any revolver or any slotted stud on anything. Made a couple of these twenty years ago and still grab them more often than you might think.

I am sure that the punch works, but always like to use the right tool designed to properly fit the job at hand, and it makes the job much easier.

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Gary
SWCA 2515

Regarding lubrication, S&W are designed to run with little lubrication, but should not be dry. A drop or two at pivot points, and rebound slide are normally enough. I recall someone saying put a few drops in the gun and then wipe it off, leaving just the minimum.

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H Richard
SWCA1967 SWHF244

Any light household oil will be OK for gun mechanism use, nothing special is needed. I normally use clock and watch oil (which does not gum up) but only because I have some as I work on clocks also.

And I use hair clipper oil which I think is similar to the oil DWalt is using.

The results of cheap household oil will be wax and gum/varnish over time. Please spend a little extra and only use synthetic based oils, as they have much lower VOCs (volatile organic compounds) which equates to a much slower evaporation rate. It is also known that synthetic oils have tremendous "cling" properties and will continue to coat steel unlike conventional oils the physically "drein" out of critical lube points over time. Birchwood Casey Aerosol Synthetic Gun Oil or Barricade offer protection over a much longer period of time than petroleum oils. As noted above, it is the easiest to apply by spraying down the mechanism and blowing out excess by using canned air.

As for too much oil, I believe it is somewhat of a misnomer. What is the result of too much oil? If it is dripping from the mechanism you have too much, but other than that the gun will function just fine, maybe better than the few drops option.

I recall years ago that I shot Sporting Clays, 5 Stand, Skeet, and Trap with a Remington 1100 for a couple decades. During the 1970s and 1980s, I ran across more complaints about malfunctions with this model than any other shotgun out there, while my 1100s shot tens-of-thousands of rounds without a single problem. I also found that almost everyone who had problems said that these guns were meant to run dry - NO THEY WERE NOT! Mine ran wet with oil for 25 years without any wear or malfunctions. I spray cleaned the mechanism with choke-n-carb cleaner occasionally then re-oiled from time to time, but no big deal. I stripped the action and did detailed cleaning maybe twice a year as a preventative not because of any problems. Those shooters who I was able to convince started oiling their guns and guess what - their problems went away!!

Shotguns will get dirty much quicker than a revolver, so I seldom need to clean the interior of my S&Ws. Try it and find out for yourself, I believe you will be very satisfied with the results of running your S&Ws with synthetic oil in the mechanism!!

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Gary
SWCA 2515

I use Rem-Oil.

__________________
John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

Thanks for that info. Here's a photo of the other side.

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S&W 32-20 01-800.jpg (112.9 KB, 23 views)

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Keep your powder dry.