Guys,

I may need a replacement Hammer and Trigger for my MK II HE in .455.

On Ebay I see many second hand used hammers and triggers being advertised claiming they are for K/L and N revolvers, implying they will work in all three frame types.

Is this true, or can I only use a N frame hammer and trigger set up.

Thanks in advance

Mike

An N frame hammer is longer than a long throw K frame hammer and they can't be substituted. L frame hammers are short throw and shouldn't be substituted for pre-war long throw actions. Triggers are another thing. N/K/L frames all use the same size trigger. Now this presumes you stick with the era. Pre-war triggers (or post-war transitional) should be used on pre-war guns. Even if you get the right era hammer and trigger, they may not work together unless fitted. Don't expect them to be drop in.

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Guy
SWHF #474 SWCA LM#2629

It is possible to fit post war triggers to pre war revolvers. I once fitted a .312 Ranger trigger to a pre World War ONE .32-20.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

Your looking for a hammer like this. One from a 1917 would work. Notice where the spur is high up on hammer


More recent "high speed hammer" Notice spur near center of hammer

Guy you pretty much got it, although and not to be nit picky, there's a few nuances to trip us up:

Pre war triggers are the same size for K and N however there are differences as you said even in just the pre war era. They must match whichever side plate safety is in the gun, 1st or 2nd style, because the hand spring can be in the trigger or not.

Post war L frame hammers are a different height from K and N hammers.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

Mike,

What seems to be the issue with your hammer/trigger?

If it's just push-off, that can usually be fixed easily by a S&W gunsmith. Also many times just a trigger swap will fix minor issues. But you'll need the gunsmiths opinion about where the fault lies; hammer, trigger, or both. Also there's specialists that can rebuild hammers.

Replacing parts may seem to be the easiest but it can turn into an expensive nightmare. You need proper "trouble shooting" before you start laying out cash.

Note: it's usually best to re-use the DA sear (hammer fly) from the original hammer, especially if you retain the original trigger. It can save time refitting a different DA sear.

As steelslaver posted, the 1917 .45 Army model parts are probably the easiest to find and would be virtually identical to your MkII. As well as the .44 spl 2nd model.

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Jim
S&WCA #819

I have new (old stock ) N - Mk.11 hammers for sale, may have good used triggers, PM if interested.
John Claydon, SWCA 348.

And I will vouch for smokymd being very good to deal with.

The only correct hammer and trigger will have chafing bushings. There are several variations of pre-war hammers and triggers that are SLIGHTLY different as the actions evolved through various changes. TLs and 455-2nd models are not true Long Actions! They do NOT have a DA takeover on the hammers and triggers- the hammer falls off the sear.
The K frames evolved separately from the N frames, so there were K frame triggers for the 1905-3rd change that still have chafing bushings that are NOT correct for the 455.
In other words, if you wish to keep the gun correct, you need exactly the correct hammer and especially a trigger that exactly match your old parts. Yes, as Muley says, different parts can sometimes be substituted, but they will often change how the action works to some degree.
So, if you do need parts, I would recommend contacting John to get original 455 parts:

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Regards,
Lee Jarrett

It would be helpful if someone could put together an article with clear, comprehensive pictures on the evolution of hammers, triggers and hands from the 1st Models through modern times. Perhaps no one person has all the resources to do this. So, maybe a collective effort?

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Guy
SWHF #474 SWCA LM#2629

Here’s a 455 2nd set-up:



Here are three different hammers. The middle is a TL hammer with the other two being later design.



Here’s the TL hammer with a correct trigger



The 455 hammer, though still with chafing bushings, is slightly different compared to the TL hammer. Notice a more concave shaping on the 455 vs the convex shape on the TL hammer above.

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SWCA: 3154
SWHF: 552

I've been planning that for years, and gathering pics, but I just haven't had the time.
Hopefully this coming spring.

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Regards,
Lee Jarrett

In another thread a good while back, I made the statement that all the N frame hammers with chafing bushings were identical. That, of course, is incorrect, but they ARE interchangeable.
That convex shape on the first variant is merely for strength, but the Factory found that area COULD bind against the trigger as the action cycled. On some TLs, you will see that the convex lump has actually been ground on to provide trigger clearance. The succeeding concave shape provides that clearance and removes the necessity to grind some hammers during assembly. That is the first evolutionary step in the N frame action.

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Regards,
Lee Jarrett

Wow, what awesome advice !! This forum has many experts and is a great place to further my knowledge - many thanks for the replies guys !

The hammer / trigger I have are badly soiled and tarnished and I was just thinking of getting the gun refinished, its in a very sorry state, and I dont know how easy it would be to get the hammer and trigger re case hardened and looking nice, so I thought about replacing them with an alternative !

This is hardly even a shooter grade gun and needs a lot of TLC hence the thoughts of refurbishment !

Excellent photos. In your comparison of the convex vs. concave shape,
you're of course referring to the shape of the hammer "foot".

Your two photos also show the difference between the short action of the TL vs. the longer action of that particular 455 transitional issue hammer: compare the bottom shape of the DA sear (hammer fly) on each hammer.

So although the 455 hammer still has chafing bushings, it has the newer long action DA sear. That's how S&W changed the hammer throw action length.

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Jim
S&WCA #819